# Hillary is going to STEAL the democratic nomination, mark my words!! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 27, 2008, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922 "2008-03-27T16:01:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/1 "2008-03-27T16:01:33Z")
At this point it’s clear that the democratic nomination will be decided by the super delegates. And although Obama is ahead in delegates and the popular vote, watch and see how the hillary machine overpowers the superdelegates. They’re working them day in and day out as we speak, and they will until the convention. The democratic people will not speak in this election… the clinton machine will determine the democratic choice. Mark my words, I know I’m right. I know how those clinton people work… they’re devious, without a soul and they don’t care about anyone about themselves. They’ll destroy the democratic party all for their personal gain. When this happens, I hope the democratic backlash is so overpowering that they sweep McCain into office. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/2 "2008-03-27T16:06:05Z")
But is it not true that Obama has narrowed the superdelegate gap between him and Clinton over the last months? According to [CNN](http://edition.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/), the gap is now down to 34 superdelegates, whereas a month or two ago it was about 100, i believe ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/3 "2008-03-27T16:11:30Z")
[QUOTE=Švejk] But is it not true that Obama has narrowed the superdelegate gap between him and Clinton over the last months? According to [CNN](http://edition.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/), the gap is now down to 34 superdelegates, whereas a month or two ago it was about 100, i believe [/QUOTE] do you see what I’m saying!!! I KNEW those clintons were working the superdelegates. The superdelegates are chosing the next democratic nomination… not the voters. Isn’t that nice. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/4 "2008-03-27T16:12:59Z")
First of all, I don’t think what you’ve laid out is going to happen. Secondly, if it did happen thatenough superdelegates vote for Clinton so that she gets the nomination, how is that “stealing” it? It’s acting within the rules. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/5 "2008-03-27T16:14:40Z")
Because it’s stealing it from the voters… who are these superdelegates that they should decide the next candidate when things are this close especially when the voters and regular delegates are favoring Obama. It’s just wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/6 "2008-03-27T16:16:21Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] do you see what I’m saying!!! [/QUOTE] I don’t see it at all. Obama is gaining superdelegate support, which is demonstrated by what feels like every article published in the last six weeks. She’s gained only a handful of those delegates recently, and he’s eroded her lead. With the voters tending in another direction, those delegates haven’t got much loyalty to the Clintons. I think those delegates are very concerned about the idea of “overturning” the popular vote. They don’t want to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Jurph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/50afbb/32.png) [@Jurph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jurph)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/7 "2008-03-27T16:18:40Z")
Take a deep breath. [DailyKos has a litany](http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/3/26/104555/955/7/484087) of all the things that her campaign has done to try to get an edge – any edge – in this campaign. So far she is still losing. - Her overall delegate count is lower by over 100. - Her superdelegate edge is being blunted day after day. - Her campaign has declared about a dozen different states “must-win” races, and lost most of them, including Texas (remember that the primary and the caucus both count!). - She has been caught in (yet another) lie at what may be the worst possible time: the doldrums between OH/TX and PA, where the 24-7 news cycle is grasping at straws to find a story to fill the vacuum. By contrast, Obama’s turn in the barrel earlier this month didn’t hurt his poll numbers at all. - Her veiled threats to Pelosi made the front page of Drudge, and sparked (yet another) story during the news vacuum. Reporters don’t have to work too hard on this one – it’s easy to cast her as a villain, regardless of your opinion of her campaign. Don’t panic. She will continue to flex her political muscle, push for backroom deals, threaten, cajole, lie, backstab, and do all of the things that make her the vicious candidate that she is… and she will most likely end up hurting herself more than the party. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/8 "2008-03-27T16:18:44Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Because it’s stealing it from the voters… who are these superdelegates that they should decide the next candidate when things are this close especially when the voters and regular delegates are favoring Obama. It’s just wrong. [/QUOTE] Then isn’t your complaint with the Democratic Party, which doesn’t seem to trust its own voters and so left in a failsafe mechanism? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/9 "2008-03-27T16:21:56Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Because it’s stealing it from the voters… who are these superdelegates that they should decide the next candidate when things are this close especially when the voters and regular delegates are favoring Obama. It’s just wrong. [/QUOTE] If it’s wrong, then change the nominating process to get rid of the superdelegates, but until you do so, the system is what it is. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/10 "2008-03-27T16:22:41Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Then isn’t your complaint with the Democratic Party, which doesn’t seem to trust its own voters and so left in a failsafe mechanism? [/QUOTE] Yes, it is…I can’t believe they have this superdelegate system set up to disenfranchise their voting base. What a sham… ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/11 "2008-03-27T16:27:55Z")
[QUOTE=Jurph] Take a deep breath. [DailyKos has a litany](http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/3/26/104555/955/7/484087) of all the things that her campaign has done to try to get an edge – any edge – in this campaign. So far she is still losing. - Her overall delegate count is lower by over 100. - Her superdelegate edge is being blunted day after day. - Her campaign has declared about a dozen different states “must-win” races, and lost most of them, including Texas (remember that the primary and the caucus both count!). - She has been caught in (yet another) lie at what may be the worst possible time: the doldrums between OH/TX and PA, where the 24-7 news cycle is grasping at straws to find a story to fill the vacuum. By contrast, Obama’s turn in the barrel earlier this month didn’t hurt his poll numbers at all. - Her veiled threats to Pelosi made the front page of Drudge, and sparked (yet another) story during the news vacuum. Reporters don’t have to work too hard on this one – it’s easy to cast her as a villain, regardless of your opinion of her campaign. Don’t panic. She will continue to flex her political muscle, push for backroom deals, threaten, cajole, lie, backstab, and do all of the things that make her the vicious candidate that she is… and she will most likely end up hurting herself more than the party. [/QUOTE] Alright, I am panicking; I don’t want her to be the democratic choice… I just think a lot of people don’t take the daily kos seriously since they appear to be a bit vitirioic and hostile at times. I hope they take them seriously regarding this though… ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/12 "2008-03-27T16:29:11Z")
And now you have major money supporters for hillary playing hardball with Pelosi… threatening her financially that they’ll cut off their support if she doesn’t change her tune. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/13 "2008-03-27T16:32:43Z")
If hillary wins the democratic nomination, I’m voting for McCain… which won’t be difficult for me since I’m still registered as a republican. But I really wanted to see Obama as our next president. ---
**Author:** ![Merkwurdigliebe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/74df32/32.png) [@Merkwurdigliebe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merkwurdigliebe)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/14 "2008-03-27T16:33:21Z")
Today on Fox News she said, “That’s what credentials fights are for” with regards to MI and FL, so it is apparent that she intends on going all the way to Denver with her little sad fucking game. The superdelegates have never had such a clear choice. It’s either now or when? At least if they go to Obama to put him over 2024 we won’t have to pay attention to Hillary any more. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/15 "2008-03-27T16:35:56Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] And now you have major money supporters for hillary playing hardball with Pelosi… threatening her financially that they’ll cut off their support if she doesn’t change her tune. [/QUOTE] Take a breath. Do you think Pelosi is afraid she won’t be able to get re-elected in San Francisco? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/16 "2008-03-27T16:36:12Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Then isn’t your complaint with the Democratic Party, which doesn’t seem to trust its own voters and so left in a failsafe mechanism? [/QUOTE] Hey, if your party’s voters nominated somebody like George McGovern, you wouldn’t trust them either. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/17 "2008-03-27T16:56:00Z")
[QUOTE=Merkwurdigliebe] The superdelegates have never had such a clear choice. It’s either now or when? At least if they go to Obama to put him over 2024 we won’t have to pay attention to Hillary any more. [/QUOTE] Hopefully that’s what will happen. **JohnnieEnigma** It’s got nothing to do with taking the DailyKos seriously. Either what they are reporting is correct or it isn’t. If what they are reporting has any truth in it, others will see it that way too. Look for other sources to see if they corroborate what the Kos is saying. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/18 "2008-03-27T16:57:06Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Hey, if your party’s voters nominated somebody like George McGovern, you wouldn’t trust them either. [/QUOTE] Democracy is too important to be trusted to the people. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/19 "2008-03-27T17:00:16Z")
To address the OP, the Democratic Party is a club that can set up any rules it damn well pleases for how to pick a candidate. If Hillary gets the nomination according to their own rules, it can’t be considered “stealing” it. Then… [QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Hey, if your party’s voters nominated somebody like George McGovern, you wouldn’t trust them either. [/QUOTE] That’s kind of backwards. After 1968, the DP ushered in a _more_ small-d democratic nominating process, instead of leaving it up to party leaders in smoke-filled back rooms. They didn’t trust the voters fully, though, so left in quite a bit of power for the traditional party insiders. The intent was to keep the voters from being able to nominate a candidate that was unelectable. McGovern did not have the support of the popular vote in 1972, but the insiders tipped the scales in his favor, so he was their candidate. The irony is that the two times the insiders have swung away from the popular vote, ostensibly to nominate a candidate who is more “electable,” they have nominated George McGovern (1972) and Walter Mondale (1984), the two most unelectable Democrats one could imagine. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/20 "2008-03-27T17:01:43Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Alright, I am panicking; I don’t want her to be the democratic choice… I just think a lot of people don’t take the daily kos seriously since they appear to be a bit vitirioic and hostile at times. I hope they take them seriously regarding this though… [/QUOTE] Stop panicking! As I posted yesterday in the Fork thread (shortened here): > [@](#): > > . . . The Clinton campaign has been actively wooing these delegates, believing a plurality represents the strongest, and increasingly the only, way for her to win the nomination. But one undeclared delegate, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, said the recent tactics are turning her and other superdelegates off. > > . . . > > And they say they are not buying some of the Clinton campaign’s explanations as to why they should support her, whether it is her victories in large states, primary states or those likely to go Democratic in the November election. > > “Periodically, over the last couple of weeks, you will see a news story or get something from the campaign, and you’ll go, 'How stupid do you think I am?” one uncommitted superdelegate said. “All of us watch television all the time, read the newspapers. We all play with the little charts online too. We know it is virtually impossible.” > > . . . > > The delegates said there is little the party or its leaders can do to prevent the current back and forth. But some said they were increasingly in touch with Clinton campaign officials to say their support is in jeopardy. > > “Uncommitted delegates can come out and say, ‘If you don’t stop this now, we won’t vote for you,’” one uncommitted superdelegate said. > > [http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/03/26/820834.aspx](http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/03/26/820834.aspx) Chill, dude. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922.md?page=2)