# Hillary is going to STEAL the democratic nomination, mark my words!! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 27, 2008, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922 "2008-03-27T16:01:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/41 "2008-03-27T20:58:57Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] When this happens, I hope the democratic backlash is so overpowering that they sweep McCain into office. [/QUOTE] :dubious: And why exactly would you hope for that? ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/42 "2008-03-27T22:05:36Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] :dubious: And why exactly would you hope for that? [/QUOTE] because maybe just maybe the wakeup call for the democrats would ring so loud and clear that they would realize how they need to reform… bigtime! the dems are screwing up bigtime… I can’t even believe it. This win should be so easy for them, especially after the bush administration. I don’t see it happening. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/43 "2008-03-27T22:07:23Z")
[QUOTE=Phlosphr] Did you go see Obama at Rhode Island College when he came? I did. I live in Connecticut, I’ve been campaigning for Obama for almost 2 years…started slow by simply talking then went full monty about a year ago. He is going to march right into the Oval office. Luckily at this juncture, I don’t have to be blindly optimistic, I am realisticly looking at a campaign that will march to the WH. Hillary is done. Don’t fret. If there were a glaring reason to be anxious aside from: “…but, but, but the Clinton Machine…” I’d mention it. There isn’t. [/QUOTE] No, I think I was in Rhode island at the time though… I basically live in Albany NY, but I’m from Providence - my family is there so I’m always visiting… it’s a 2.5 hour trip… not too bad. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/44 "2008-03-27T22:15:03Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] because maybe just maybe the wakeup call for the democrats would ring so loud and clear that they would realize how they need to reform… bigtime! [/QUOTE] It’s not worth the risk. [McCain is too hotheaded for the job.](http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080324/dreyfuss) ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/45 "2008-03-27T22:19:30Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] It’s not worth the risk. [McCain is too hotheaded for the job.](http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080324/dreyfuss) [/QUOTE] the link did not bring me to the exact article you wanted, but the site looks like a really good site… thanks for the link! ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/46 "2008-03-27T22:33:52Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] the dems are screwing up bigtime… I can’t even believe it. [/QUOTE] Is this the first primary season you’ve paid attention to for a while? This hasn’t been a particularly brutal nomination contest. ---
**Author:** ![Merkwurdigliebe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/74df32/32.png) [@Merkwurdigliebe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merkwurdigliebe)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/47 "2008-03-27T22:37:53Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] I’m more concerned about the possibility that the Clintons will try to swing the election to McCain so Hill can run again in '12, now that she pretty much realizes she’s “forked” in '08. If McCain beats Obama, then the Dems will be reluctant to nominate a loser twice. It’ll be her “I told you so” moment. Maureen Dowd expressed this today in her editorial: But I don’t see how she can “steal” the nomination. If the superdelegates go her way, well that’s how the process is designed. No theft involved. [/QUOTE] That’s the point… People don’t see it as being fair. Hillary has been scraping and lashing out to find any way to win and people know that. Just saw a poll on MSNBC where only 31 or so percent believe that it would be legitimate to have it Hillary’s way (Superdelegates making up for her pledged delegate deficit). However, only 41 percent believe it would be illegitimate. That’s still a goodly portion though. Again, just because it’s legal doesn’t mean that it’s desirable. It’s a very undesirable position to come back from and she’s going to have to have a VERY good argument to overturn what has already happened. The way she’s been running her campaign has also been very indicative of how terrible a leader she’d be. She sure as hell wasn’t ready on day one of her campaign, why would she be ready for the president? Aside from all of the other ways that Obama has beaten her, she has also beaten herself with her terrible campaign. She’s ready to get credentials fights going? By being explicit about the lengths to which she’d go she must be turning off other people. Do we really have the stomach to watch as she ruins what could have been one of the easiest elections to win in November? I know I sure as hell don’t and if I were a superdelegate, I’d come out and do my best to send her packing. I’d do the same even if Barack Obama were behind. Democrats can’t afford to risk it any more. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/48 "2008-03-27T22:39:24Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] because maybe just maybe the wakeup call for the democrats would ring so loud and clear that they would realize how they need to reform… bigtime! the dems are screwing up bigtime… I can’t even believe it. This win should be so easy for them, especially after the bush administration. I don’t see it happening. [/QUOTE] How old are you? Not meaning to be insulting. I’m just trying to figure out how many election cycles you’ve been through as a Democrat or Democratic-leaning voter. Because the old Will Rogers joke? “I don’t belong to any organized political organization. I’m a Democrat.” It’s not a joke. In another thread today I noted that the funny thing about the Democratic party is that if you went into a roomful of Democrats and shouted “The Democratic Party sucks!”, you would get at least half the room (and, depending on which fool of a Democratic politician spouted off that day, probably the whole room) nodding and muttering, “They sure do…_sigh_”. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/49 "2008-03-27T22:40:54Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] How old are you? Not meaning to be insulting. I’m just trying to figure out how many election cycles you’ve been through as a Democrat or Democratic-leaning voter. Because the old Will Rogers joke? “I don’t belong to any organized political organization. I’m a Democrat.” It’s not a joke. In another thread today I noted that the funny thing about the Democratic party is that if you went into a roomful of Democrats and shouted “The Democratic Party sucks!”, you would get at least half the room (and, depending on which fool of a Democratic politician spouted off that day, probably the whole room) nodding and muttering, “They sure do…_sigh_”. [/QUOTE] Actually, I’m a registered republican. 🆒 I just happen to support Obama… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/50 "2008-03-27T22:44:12Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Actually, I’m a registered republican. 🆒 I just happen to support Obama… [/QUOTE] Ah…welcome to an alien planet, sir. The Democrats and Republicans are probably even MORE different in their party procedures than they are in their policies. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/51 "2008-03-27T22:45:23Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Is this the first primary season you’ve paid attention to for a while? This hasn’t been a particularly brutal nomination contest. [/QUOTE] You don’t think so? It’s really close, and I don’t believe either candidate will have enough delegates to win so they’ll have to count on the superdelegates. You don’t see this as an amazingly stressful and confusing campaign? You’ve got two candidates who will be groundbreaking if either wins; a race so tight that everything is affecting the outcome… like Howard Dean screwing with Fla & Michigan voters and calling their delegates irrelevant; you’ve got Hillary fabricating war stories; and Obama just went through a living hell because he’s being held accountable for his minister’s words… words that were taken out of context and that affected Obama’s standings among independents… it’s been a complete clusterF ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/52 "2008-03-27T22:47:41Z")
Assuming she DOES manage to steal the thing…well, what can she do with it? I mean, is there even a market to sell that kind of stolen goods? Would she have to go to Mexico or Canada or something like that, or would someone fence it here in the US for her? And what then? She would have to flea (sic) the country, no? What would she get with her ill gotten booty? -XT ---
**Author:** ![JohnnieEnigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dfb087/32.png) [@JohnnieEnigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnieEnigma)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/53 "2008-03-27T22:49:09Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] Assuming she DOES manage to steal the thing…well, what can she do with it? I mean, is there even a market to sell that kind of stolen goods? Would she have to go to Mexico or Canada or something like that, or would someone fence it here in the US for her? And what then? She would have to flea (sic) the country, no? What would she get with her ill gotten booty? -XT [/QUOTE] she’ll hand it over to her husband. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/54 "2008-03-27T22:52:36Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Howard Dean screwing with Fla & Michigan voters and calling their delegates irrelevant; [/QUOTE] Dean’s not screwing with anybody and hasn’t called anyone’s votes or delegates irrelevant. The early primary penalties were known well before Michigan and Florida voted to move their primaries up. Dean had nothing to do with that, by the way. It was the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee, of which Howard Dean is not a member, that stripped them of their delegates. And Dean isn’t calling their delegates irrelevant. The DNC is calling them invalid, because they weren’t legal primaries. I agree with that. The solution is for the state parties to fund a revote, but neither one is willing to do that. So it’s on them. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/55 "2008-03-27T22:54:30Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] she’ll hand it over to her husband. [/QUOTE] Well…if she is truly forked, as was said in another thread, then she will have to move and allow Bill to be taken by Obama’s knight (not the one who says nee! btw…the other one). So…that would pretty much preclude her being able to give it to Billy boy. It’s a quandary… -XT ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/56 "2008-03-27T22:59:55Z")
You really should breathe a little more slowly, **Johnnie**. That _puscht_ that Clinton’s backers tried to pull off against Pelosi, threatening to withhold funding for the DCCC if she didn’t disavow her comments that the supers shouldn’t overturn the will of the voters? It’s causing [massive backlash](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/3/27/162844/720/548/485580). The supers don’t like to be threatened. Clinton’s backers pushed too hard. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/57 "2008-03-27T23:44:33Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Is this the first primary season you’ve paid attention to for a while? This hasn’t been a particularly brutal nomination contest. [/QUOTE] I’ve heard a few people say this, and I wonder what contests they’re comparing it to. Which ones from the past **do** you consider brutal? I ask because I’m curious if it’s just a matter of people who say this’ perceptions of “recent” being different from mine, particularly with back-to-back 2 term presidents. Other than some Reagan-Gorbachev photo ops, my first awareness of politics was the Ollie North scandal that broke out when I was nine. There are many voters who we’re even born yet when that happened (hell, there are voters who were born during George Bush senior’s term), so maybe it’s not a lack of paying attention on a lot of people’s parts… As for the OP, I will be disappointed, but not at all surprised, if Clinton manages to buy or threaten her way into the nomination. It would be in keeping with her megalomaniac conviction that it’s “her turn” to win by any means necessary. Does she have a theme song yet? If not, I suggest [this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFnnV595byE). ---
**Author:** ![Airblairxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Airblairxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airblairxxx)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/58 "2008-03-27T23:58:00Z")
Just when I was getting myself into a high dudgeon about HRC, she goes and starts saying stuff like this: > [@](#): > > \*Clinton spoke out Thursday in Fayetteville, North Carolina, regarding party unity, and she had a warning to Democrats who may consider sitting out the November election or even voting for McCain, the presumptive GOP nominee. > > “Please think through this decision. It is not a wise decision for yourself or your country,” Clinton said. "There are, in my view, significant differences between Sen. Obama and myself, but those differences pale to the differences between us and Sen. McCain. I intend to do everything I can to make sure we have a unified Democratic party. > > “When this contest is over and we have a nominee, we’re going to close ranks, we’re going to be united, and I have no doubt about that, because the most important goal is for us to put a Democrat back into the White House next January,” Clinton added.\* Sounds like . . . something . . . is finally sinking in. Quote from here: [Poll: Clinton-Obama bickering could hurt turnout - CNN.com](http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/27/dem.turnout.poll/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2008, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/59 "2008-03-28T00:39:16Z")
[QUOTE=JohnnieEnigma] Because it’s stealing it from the voters… [/QUOTE] You cannot have stolen from you what is not yours. It is not the right of the pledged delegates to elect the Democratic nominee on their own. I mean, I’m not even a Clinton fan - heck, I’m not even American - but this seems really dirt-obvious to me. The rules for selecting the candidate are the rules. I don’t recall Sen. Obama’s supporters bitching about the process in 2004, or 2000, or 1996. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2008, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922/60 "2008-03-28T00:49:00Z")
[QUOTE=Airblairxxx] Just when I was getting myself into a high dudgeon about HRC, she goes and starts saying stuff like this: Sounds like . . . something . . . is finally sinking in. Quote from here: [Poll: Clinton-Obama bickering could hurt turnout - CNN.com](http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/27/dem.turnout.poll/index.html) [/QUOTE] Meh. Sounds more like she’s getting pressure that her antics are placing the party’s November’s prospects at risk and needs to throw a bone that direction while she continues to play the me or nothing game. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-is-going-to-steal-the-democratic-nomination-mark-my-words/442922.md?page=4)