# Hillary makes bogus claim of racism in Alabama. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 18, 2015, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983 "2015-10-18T05:35:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/221 "2015-10-19T14:58:01Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Do you consider Ms. Maddow to be a neutral reporter of facts? Since she was reporting on facts and the opinions that other people had expressed, yes. I heard nothing that sounded like her own opinion. Did you even watch the video or are you automatically rejecting the source? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/222 "2015-10-19T14:58:09Z")
I don’t care if 100% of people had birth certificates issued by the hospital, or more accurately had the hospital forward the information to the county clerk who issued the certificate later. By the time you turn 18, you’ve had that many years to lose that piece of paper. I know I’ve had to get new copies of our kids’ certificates for sports teams or drivers licenses or whatever. Easy for me because I happen to work and live in the same county where they were born. Wouldn’t be so easy if they haven’t used their birth certificate in 40 years and are living in a different part of the state and/or different state and didn’t have a car and couldn’t take time off work and didn’t have internet access. The games that Alabama plays should be assumed to be for the purpose of suppressing minority voting unless proven otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/223 "2015-10-19T15:01:29Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Can you give us good reason not to trust her reportage of said facts? Rachel Maddow is as neutral as Sean Hannity. If you can’t see that, I cannot help you. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/224 "2015-10-19T15:05:55Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > By the time you turn 18, you’ve had that many years to lose that piece of paper. I know I’ve had to get new copies of our kids’ certificates for sports teams or drivers licenses or whatever. That sounds irresponsible. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/225 "2015-10-19T15:08:36Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > The games that Alabama plays should be assumed to be for the purpose of suppressing minority voting unless proven otherwise. That’s not how it works. “Pre-clearance” was ruled unconstitutional, remember? ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/226 "2015-10-19T15:13:27Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Look at the North West corner of the both maps, and the mostly white, but low population density area gets hit hard. I’ll wait for an independent analysis that looks at this with some mathematic rigor. Right now, we’re all just eye-balling. I’m not an expert of North Alabama… but if it is anything like Georgia, the northern section (in general) is “rolling hills” with a little bit of the Appalachian Mountains in the Northeast. East Central Alabama, above the “black belt” is certainly [Piedmont](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piedmont_(United_States)), (description)officially designated as [rolling hills](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piedmont_(United_States)#/media/File:Piedmontmap.png)(map). Actually, they call it the [Cumberland Plateau](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumberland_Plateau) over there ([map](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumberland_Plateau#/media/File:Cumberlandplateaumap.png)), though there is a small section of Piedmont too.In other words, the black belt and south of the black belt are/were more suited to farming, cotton and peanuts specifically, a slightly warmer climate and less hills. This is why, I think, traditionally, more black people lived there, there was more farming there. North Georgia is not really suitable for large scale farming, not for peaches and cotton and soybeans and peanuts… the way South Georgia is. Two more maps of Alabama [1](http://www.worldatlas.com/img/areamap/f1c08d3d0c4d50d39adb73ac35cb421a.gif), [2](https://www.google.com/search?q=geography+north+alabama&sa=X&espv=2&biw=1295&bih=774&tbm=isch&imgil=ZB9dJAj-w6zzaM%253A%253BcAGWFv5CathzjM%253Bhttps%25253A%25252F%25252Fen.wikipedia.org%25252Fwiki%25252FGeography_of_Alabama&source=iu&pf=m&fir=ZB9dJAj-w6zzaM%253A%252CcAGWFv5CathzjM%252C_&usg= __n9d7gFWOyQd15YcJUzDRmJ2RYhM%3D&ved=0CF4QyjdqFQoTCNv75pjlzsgCFQbUgAodwcgG7g&ei=LwQlVpuoDoaogwTBkZvwDg#imgrc=vS-MqUd2n3DogM%3A&usg=__ n9d7gFWOyQd15YcJUzDRmJ2RYhM%3D). Central Alabama has only one large city, Montgomery, but North Alabama has 3, Huntsville, Tuscaloosa and Birmingham. From what I’ve been told, back 100 years ago… population was more evenly spread between the North and South in the two states but as technology became more modern people moved North away from the farms… I know this is not answering the question directly of politics in 2015 but maybe it can provide some context… ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/227 "2015-10-19T15:19:59Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Rachel Maddow is as neutral as Sean Hannity. If you can’t see that, I cannot help you. If that is your opinion, than your help is neither required or requested. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/228 "2015-10-19T15:23:29Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > That sounds irresponsible. Are you contending that “irresponsible” people shouldn’t be allowed to vote, or else that it’s right and proper for them to have more barriers to the process? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/229 "2015-10-19T15:26:47Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > That sounds irresponsible. That sounds like life. People lose stuff. You may still have it, but you forgot where it is. To say “tough cookies, we know you got that birth certificate 50 years ago, if you can’t produce it or go through the effort to get a copy made, you can’t vote! Neener neener neener!” is pretty much ignoring how life really works. Or willfully looking past that in order to make people that you consider to be undesirable from voting. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/230 "2015-10-19T15:30:47Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > Are you contending that “irresponsible” people shouldn’t be allowed to vote, or else that it’s right and proper for them to have more barriers to the process? Part of living in a civil society is civic responsibility. Maintaining the barest minimum of documentation that you are given at birth, or shortly thereafter, is included, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/231 "2015-10-19T15:32:56Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Part of living in a civil society is civic responsibility. Maintaining the barest minimum of documentation that you are given at birth, or shortly thereafter, is included, IMO. So is not wasting people’s time with pointless questions. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/232 "2015-10-19T15:35:30Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Part of living in a civil society is civic responsibility. Maintaining the barest minimum of documentation that you are given at birth, or shortly thereafter, is included, IMO. I presume you could produce your childhood vaccination records and all your report cards on demand. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/233 "2015-10-19T15:36:51Z")
It’s all part of your permanent record. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/234 "2015-10-19T15:37:05Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Part of living in a civil society is civic responsibility. Maintaining the barest minimum of documentation that you are given at birth, or shortly thereafter, is included, IMO. Fire. Flood. Homelessness. Lost while moving. Theft. All of these things can happen, even to the most responsible of human beings. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/235 "2015-10-19T15:41:29Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Fire. > Flood. > Homelessness. > Lost while moving. > Theft. > > All of these things can happen, even to the most responsible of human beings. You don’t have all your vital records on a surgically implanted chip, backups to the cloud, multiple copies in safe deposit boxes all over the world and armed security guards covering every human interaction you have? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/236 "2015-10-19T15:45:50Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > It’s all part of your permanent record. Don’t get so distressed. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/237 "2015-10-19T15:48:41Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > You don’t have all your vital records on a surgically implanted chip, backups to the cloud, multiple copies in safe deposit boxes all over the world and armed security guards covering every human interaction you have? No, I keep all of that stuff in a Safety Deposit box in Zurich, along with about 1000K in cash and 6 passports. Along with some hair dye and colored contact lenses. Of course… [leaving](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmxK_pBaG4E) the bank can sometimes be a problem… ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/238 "2015-10-19T15:50:04Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > It’s all part of your permanent record. I lost mine. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/239 "2015-10-19T15:50:56Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > You don’t have all your vital records on a surgically implanted chip, backups to the cloud, multiple copies in safe deposit boxes all over the world and armed security guards covering every human interaction you have? No, I just have my document butler take care of it. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2015, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983/240 "2015-10-19T15:52:10Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > No, I just have my document butler take care of it. Potential single point of failure!!! You’re not taking personal responsibility!!! 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-makes-bogus-claim-of-racism-in-alabama/734983.md?page=13)