# Hil's too sexy for this pic, Sec of State's gonna leave me. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2011, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255 "2011-05-09T11:03:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/61 "2011-05-10T09:23:49Z")
> [@Capitaine\_Zombie](#): > > I didnt get the joke. Could you educate a foreigner? It’s a [pun](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shofar). ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/62 "2011-05-10T09:48:12Z")
wtf. This thread has gone from ‘Orthodox Jew’ bashing to ‘let’s make fun of how some powerful women look’. Pot, kettle? ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/63 "2011-05-10T10:06:26Z")
Also, I don’t read Yiddish, but can anyone tell me if she’s mentioned in the caption? I tried to find out online, but every main newspaper that’s running this quotes the bloggers or ‘speculations’ by other newspapers on what the Yiddishe newspaper was thinking. Since when is _that_ respectable journalism? The newspaper apologized. Let’s make a story out of nothing. :rolleyes: This is a minority Jewish newspaper that doesn’t publish photos of \*any \*women. It’s circulation is probably pretty low. _shrug_ There’s so much mobility in Judaism that if you don’t like it, you’re free to move to another sect. Yeah, that’s silly, but I don’t understand what the hooplah is about. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/64 "2011-05-10T10:16:50Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > wtf. > > This thread has gone from ‘Orthodox Jew’ bashing to ‘let’s make fun of how some powerful women look’. > > Pot, kettle? For one, it’s only one post, and, two, in what world are the two things equivalent? Making a joke about how someone looks isn’t anywhere near the same as pretending like someone doesn’t exist because your belief system says they shouldn’t. There’s a big hooplah because you don’t modify historical images to remove people you don’t like. It’s what the USSR did. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/65 "2011-05-10T10:19:04Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > This is a minority Jewish newspaper that doesn’t publish photos of \*any \*women. It’s circulation is probably pretty low. _shrug_ There’s so much mobility in Judaism that if you don’t like it, you’re free to move to another sect. > > Yeah, that’s silly, but I don’t understand what the hooplah is about. The “hooplah” is that, rather than not run the photo at all (which would have been understandable) they chose to photoshop the women out entirely, which suggests that they were not there and had no role in the matter. Even pixelating them would have been better; at least that would acknowledge their presence. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/66 "2011-05-10T10:21:52Z")
Furthermore, one of the things praised about the image was that it showed diversity, and they intentionally removed it. They took a patriotic symbol of what America means and desecrated it. And they didn’t apologize for that. We’re not too big on people who do that shit right now. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/67 "2011-05-10T10:42:13Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > The newspaper apologized. Let’s make a story out of nothing. :rolleyes: As **BigT** points out, no they didn’t. They apologized for editing a picture that the White House had requested they not edit. They didn’t apologize for making it appear that there were no women involved in capturing bin Laden. Which is what people are actually pissed off about, here. They’re not being pitted for insulting the integrity of Peter Souza’s photography. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/68 "2011-05-10T10:47:58Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > The newspaper apologized. No, they didn’t. They made an “I’m sorry you don’t like it” non-apology, insinuated that opposition to their censorship was an example of religious intolerance and accused their critics of slander and libel. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/69 "2011-05-10T11:00:07Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > For one, it’s only one post, and, two, in what world are the two things equivalent? Making a joke about how someone looks isn’t anywhere near the same as pretending like someone doesn’t exist because your belief system says they shouldn’t. > > There’s a big hooplah because you don’t modify historical images to remove people you don’t like. It’s what the USSR did. No one was pretending like the Secretary of State didn’t exist. They don’t publish photos of women. Even artistic renditions of women. That’s their policy. Yeah, they edited a photo they didn’t have the right to. They said sorry. But why would you expect them to apologize for a longstanding policy? > [@Gyrate](#): > > The “hooplah” is that, rather than not run the photo at all (which would have been understandable) they chose to photoshop the women out entirely, which suggests that they were not there and had no role in the matter. Even pixelating them would have been better; at least that would acknowledge their presence. Again, I’d like to know what the article actually said…but since so far we’ve just had speculation, I’m going to withhold judgment. It’s a tiny community paper that caters to the community. It is _not_ ABC. > [@Miller](#): > > As **BigT** points out, no they didn’t. They apologized for editing a picture that the White House had requested they not edit. They didn’t apologize for making it appear that there were no women involved in capturing bin Laden. Which is what people are actually pissed off about, here. They’re not being pitted for insulting the integrity of Peter Souza’s photography. Why would they apologize? It’s their policy. Again. Who are you to determine their religious beliefs? If the women of the community don’t like it, they’ll make note. Why do you care? You can’t even read Yiddish! Do we freak out when a blog posts doctored photos and trumped up op eds? _shrug_ It’s not your paper. Why do you care? The Hasidic communities are well aware of Senator Clinton’s existence. yeah, I love how this thread was ‘misogynist assholes!’ to ‘let’s make fun of a woman’s looks!’ ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/70 "2011-05-10T11:08:20Z")
The paper just [proved my point](http://ditzeitung.com/statement.html). > [@](#): > > Our editorial policies are guided by a Rabbinical Board and because of laws of modesty, does not allow for the publishing of photos of women. The readership of the Tzeitung believe that women should be appreciated for who they are and **what they do, not for what they look like** , and the Jewish laws of modesty are an expression of respect for women, not the opposite. So the paper makes an error in removing her from a photo when it should not have (since they didn’t have permission). People here (and everywhere I’ve seen this online) jump on the Secretary of State’s\* looks \*! _shakehead_ ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/71 "2011-05-10T11:09:18Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Why would they apologize? Because it’s deeply sexist, and incredibly offensive. > [@](#): > > It’s their policy. Again. Who are you to determine their religious beliefs? I’m not “determining” their beliefs at all. They’re free to believe whatever the hell they want. But putting an action under the umbrella of religious belief does not render that action immune to judgment. > [@](#): > > If the women of the community don’t like it, they’ll make note. Why do you care? You can’t even read Yiddish! Can you explain the relevance of any portion of this? > [@](#): > > Do we freak out when a blog posts doctored photos and trumped up op eds? _shrug_ Yes, generally speaking, when a blog (or any other media outlet) that presents itself as a legitimate news source doctors elements of a story, it will also be criticized. > [@](#): > > It’s not your paper. Why do you care? The Hasidic communities are well aware of Senator Clinton’s existence. It’s not your paper, either. Why do _you_ care? > [@](#): > > yeah, I love how this thread was ‘misogynist assholes!’ to ‘let’s make fun of a woman’s looks!’ Again, that was one poster. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/72 "2011-05-10T11:12:31Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > The paper just [proved my point](http://ditzeitung.com/statement.html). > > So the paper makes an error in removing her from a photo when it should not have (since they didn’t have permission). Oh, hey! It’s okay, folks! They say they aren’t sexist! Go ahead and ignore their actions - if they say they aren’t sexist, that makes whatever they do okay! > [@](#): > > People here (and everywhere I’ve seen this online) jump on the Secretary of State’s\* looks \*! What “people?” It was one person. One. > [@](#): > > _shakehead_ You’re kind of an idiot, you know that? ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/73 "2011-05-10T11:19:15Z")
> [@](#): > > …women should be appreciated for who they are and what they do, not for what they look like, and the Jewish laws of modesty are an expression of respect for women, not the opposite. “…and that’s why women should wear Burkas.” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/74 "2011-05-10T11:27:53Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > “…and that’s why women should wear Burkas.” You laugh, but there are Muslims who make that argument. **CitizenPained** , the paper did not make an error. They did something manipulative and dishonest in keeping with a policy that is idiotic and sexist. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/75 "2011-05-10T11:31:26Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You laugh, but there are Muslims who make that argument. I don’t think he was laughing. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/76 "2011-05-10T11:32:20Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > What “people?” It was one person. One. And I apologize for being a jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/77 "2011-05-10T11:38:48Z")
Whatever. Go and Orthodox Jew bash, Clinton bash, or whatever it takes to inflate your dicks. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/78 "2011-05-10T11:42:58Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Whatever. Go and Orthodox Jew bash, Clinton bash, or whatever it takes to inflate your dicks. :rolleyes: What do you mean, “dicks?” I’m the only person in this thread who’s insulted you. Everyone else in this thread has (miraculously enough) treated you seriously. You really have trouble with this whole “counting” thing, don’t you? ETA: Actually, I’ve taken you seriously as well, in so far as I actually rebutted your arguments. Something you’ve failed entirely to do in this thread to anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/79 "2011-05-10T11:43:29Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Whatever. Go and Orthodox Jew bash, Clinton bash, or whatever it takes to inflate your dicks. :rolleyes: Who was bashing Clinton? And are we bashing all Orthodox Jews, or just those that refuse to print pictures of women? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255/80 "2011-05-10T11:44:00Z")
So what’s your opinion, then? These guys have their beliefs, therefore they didn’t act like dicks? That pretending the Secretary of State doesn’t exist because she’s a woman isn’t sexist? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hils-too-sexy-for-this-pic-sec-of-states-gonna-leave-me/581255.md?page=5)