# Hip Hop Videos **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 6, 2006, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608 "2006-04-06T18:28:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/41 "2006-04-07T03:16:08Z")
> [@Indygrrl](#): > > Sure you can. Sometimes people like to think they are making a choice, when in reality, they are doing the only thing they know to do. This may be excessively elitist, but I can’t help thinking that if you only know how to do one thing, you’re not being objectified, you’re already an object. Anyway, my recommendation to the OP is to play hip-hop/rap video bingo. Just make up a card with squares for: low-rider limousine girls in bikinis and high heels girls in micro-shorts girls doing that high speed butt-wiggle move right in the camera swimming pool champagne 40 oz. can (beer or malt) bed with black satin sheets gun large amount of cash cash being waved in the camera doberman scene going back and forth between doberman and girls gold jewelry Funny thing is, even female artists I’ve seen have most of these elements in their videos as well. ---
**Author:** ![MessyPaint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@MessyPaint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MessyPaint)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/42 "2006-04-07T03:20:46Z")
I like hip hop. And the videos. Come on. It’s in us all! ---
**Author:** ![Talon\_Karrde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Talon\_Karrde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Talon_Karrde)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/43 "2006-04-07T04:14:31Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > And don’t forget about the young women, who might get the idea that all they are worth to the world is their jiggly bits. > > Every time we have this discussion here, someone (and usually more than one someone) brings up the idea that it is empowering for women to be objectified and to objectify themselves. I don’t buy it, and I don’t think I ever will. I’m not a feminist, and I’m not a prude, but what I see on hip-hop videos and things like that isn’t a good thing for men or women. Those girls aren’t owning their own sexuality; they’re being exactly what someone else wants them to be for someone else’s gratification, and they’re so bought in that they think they’re the ones benefitting. It’s not good for the boys to treat girls like that, either. You can’t de-humanize someone else without de-humanizing yourself. I agree with this. The thing that’s most degrading about it is that all of the women are slaving over the men and trying to appease them, like that is their greatest desire. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/44 "2006-04-07T04:56:49Z")
> [@Gangster Octopus](#): > > You need a link to make a guess? Have you seen his other posts on the same subject? I’m hoping for another really amusing “cite.” ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/45 "2006-04-07T05:43:35Z")
Is it just me, or does there seem to be an inherent assumption here that there is something wrong with whores? ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/46 "2006-04-07T12:39:23Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > And don’t forget about the young women, who might get the idea that all they are worth to the world is their jiggly bits. > > Every time we have this discussion here, someone (and usually more than one someone) brings up the idea that it is empowering for women to be objectified and to objectify themselves. I don’t buy it, and I don’t think I ever will. I’m not a feminist, and I’m not a prude, but what I see on hip-hop videos and things like that isn’t a good thing for men or women. Those girls aren’t owning their own sexuality; they’re being exactly what someone else wants them to be for someone else’s gratification, and they’re so bought in that they think they’re the ones benefitting. It’s not good for the boys to treat girls like that, either. You can’t de-humanize someone else without de-humanizing yourself. _Clapping_ If I had any ability to express my thoughts coherently, I’d have posted this. ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/47 "2006-04-07T12:43:09Z")
> [@MessyPaint](#): > > I like hip hop. And the videos. Come on. It’s in us all! It may be in us all, that’s what I use the toilet to get rid of… ---
**Author:** ![Indygrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@Indygrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indygrrl)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/48 "2006-04-07T14:08:16Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > And don’t forget about the young women, who might get the idea that all they are worth to the world is their jiggly bits. > > Every time we have this discussion here, someone (and usually more than one someone) brings up the idea that it is empowering for women to be objectified and to objectify themselves. I don’t buy it, and I don’t think I ever will. I’m not a feminist, and I’m not a prude, but what I see on hip-hop videos and things like that isn’t a good thing for men or women. Those girls aren’t owning their own sexuality; they’re being exactly what someone else wants them to be for someone else’s gratification, and they’re so bought in that they think they’re the ones benefitting. It’s not good for the boys to treat girls like that, either. You can’t de-humanize someone else without de-humanizing yourself. So much to say on this, I don’t know where to begin but this is a good start. I think this matter of “you can’t objectify the willing” is completely simplified and inaccurate. What you are saying here is true, and this is where a lot of it begins. For some reason, so many attractive young women think of themselves only as a commodity that begins and ends with their bodies and looks. I can only draw on my own experiences here, but I have learned a lot about women and men through my years as a stripper. To me, it’s exactly the same as dancing in rap or heavy metal videos, etc. It’s the same mentality, and the same attempt at a means to an end. Rarely have I seen a stripper doing it for the love of dancing around a pole. Seriously, and I was as close to that as anyone and I still felt wrong about it at times. A lot of girls really do like to dance, and really do like aspects of the business, but overall still feel like they don’t want to go in there and dance night after night. They are technically willing, but in some ways they are trapped (whether that’s their mental block or something else is another issue). They are objectified, but they take it and turn it around as if it is something they are choosing. I think it makes most of us feel better when we are in control of our lives, and telling yourself that this is your independent choice is one way of harnessing some control, even if it is false. And no, I’m not saying this is all or even most of the women in rap videos. I don’t know. But where you have attractive, uneducated women, you have the opportunity to objectify and they have the opportunity to let themselves become objects. And then the cycle winds itself up. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/49 "2006-04-07T14:15:07Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Have you seen his other posts on the same subject? I’m hoping for another really amusing “cite.” It’s OK, Cervaise. I got the joke. ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/50 "2006-04-07T14:16:55Z")
> [@Indygrrl](#): > > (snip) > A lot of girls really do like to dance, and really do like aspects of the business, but overall still feel like they don’t want to go in there and dance night after night. They are technically willing, but in some ways they are trapped (whether that’s their mental block or something else is another issue). They are objectified, but they take it and turn it around as if it is something they are choosing. I think it makes most of us feel better when we are in control of our lives, and telling yourself that this is your independent choice is one way of harnessing some control, even if it is false. I understand what you’re saying, but how different is that from any job? ---
**Author:** ![Indygrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@Indygrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indygrrl)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/51 "2006-04-07T14:23:46Z")
> [@Rube E. Tewesday](#): > > I understand what you’re saying, but how different is that from any job? Its sexual nature makes it different enough. IMO, exploiting your sex is different than being exploited at your cubicle job. It feels different, at least to me. There is more vulnerability when you are near naked and opening yourself up to criticism and all sorts of other elements. It’s also a little more of an explanation on my earlier position. And another way of saying these women aren’t deserving of the contempt heaped on them by a large portion of society. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/45deac/32.png) [@Evil\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_One)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/52 "2006-04-07T14:34:18Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > Anyway, my recommendation to the OP is to play hip-hop/rap video bingo. Just make up a card with squares for: > > low-rider > limousine > girls in bikinis and high heels > girls in micro-shorts > girls doing that high speed butt-wiggle move right in the camera > swimming pool > champagne > 40 oz. can (beer or malt) > bed with black satin sheets > gun > large amount of cash > cash being waved in the camera > doberman > scene going back and forth between doberman and girls > gold jewelry Nice! But let’s add: Waving gang signs or other gestures at the camera Henchmen in sunglasses Everyone nodding in unison pointing at a woman and smiling/mugging for the camera ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/53 "2006-04-07T14:36:03Z")
> [@Rube E. Tewesday](#): > > I understand what you’re saying, but how different is that from any job? Another excellent point, taking us further into the heart of this discussion. Why is stripping or prostitution or being a jiggle girl on a video different than any other job? The girls are providing something that they are being paid for. Can you imagine being an accountant and being expected to work in a tiny gold bikini? Why aren’t all professional women expected to work in tiny gold bikinis? ( **Rigamarole** , you raise a good question, but I think it would hijack this discussion too much to get into the whole ethical question of prostitution. For the record, I don’t think strippers or prostitutes or jiggle girls are morally bad.) ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2006, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/54 "2006-04-07T14:36:49Z")
> [@Indygrrl](#): > > Its sexual nature makes it different enough. IMO, exploiting your sex is different than being exploited at your cubicle job. It feels different, at least to me. There is more vulnerability when you are near naked and opening yourself up to criticism and all sorts of other elements. > > It’s also a little more of an explanation on my earlier position. And another way of saying these women aren’t deserving of the contempt heaped on them by a large portion of society. Totally agree with you about your last paragraph. This is something I’ve always wondered about. Lots of people claim to be down on things like stripping because the woman is being “exploited”, but would have no problem with her cleaning floors for minimum wage. Does the sexual component make such a huge difference? If so, why? Thanks for your real life take on this. ---
**Author:** ![Guy\_Incongnito](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4af34b/32.png) [@Guy\_Incongnito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guy_Incongnito)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2006, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/55 "2006-04-08T13:04:29Z")
Yeah! Stupid rappers! Don’t they know that it’s only OK to exploit women if you’re a rich white guy who owns a beer company or a car company? ---
**Author:** ![Talon\_Karrde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Talon\_Karrde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Talon_Karrde)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2006, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/56 "2006-04-09T05:43:35Z")
> [@Rube E. Tewesday](#): > > Totally agree with you about your last paragraph. This is something I’ve always wondered about. Lots of people claim to be down on things like stripping because the woman is being “exploited”, but would have no problem with her cleaning floors for minimum wage. Does the sexual component make such a huge difference? If so, why? > > Thanks for your real life take on this. Sex is _way_ more personal than manual labor. That’s why, if I’m not mistaken, rape is considered a much more serious crime than forcing someone to wash your floor. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2006, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/57 "2006-04-09T06:25:04Z")
> [@Talon Karrde](#): > > Sex is _way_ more personal than manual labor. That’s why, if I’m not mistaken, rape is considered a much more serious crime than forcing someone to wash your floor. Rape is not about sex. Rape is assault, and so falls under the same classification as assault with intent to kill and assault with a deadly weapon. Invoking rape in this debate is pointless emotionalizing and will not fly with me. > [@featherlou](#): > > Why aren’t all professional women expected to work in tiny gold bikinis? For the same reason they aren’t all expected to work in full NBC gear with radiation shielding and respirators. The job dictates the clothing, form follows function, and so on in that nature. > [@featherlou](#): > > And don’t forget about the young women, who might get the idea that all they are worth to the world is their jiggly bits. As opposed to all the accountants, who might get the idea that all they are worth to the world is their spreadsheet skills. > [@](#): > > Every time we have this discussion here, someone (and usually more than one someone) brings up the idea that it is empowering for women to be objectified and to objectify themselves. No, it’s empowering for them to be able to choose their own path in life without people standing in their way. > [@](#): > > I don’t buy it, and I don’t think I ever will. Woo. > [@](#): > > I’m not a feminist, and I’m not a prude, but what I see on hip-hop videos and things like that isn’t a good thing for men or women. In your opinion. Not in the opinion of those actually doing it. Who should I believe? > [@](#): > > Those girls aren’t owning their own sexuality; they’re being exactly what someone else wants them to be for someone else’s gratification, and they’re so bought in that they think they’re the ones benefitting. But you know all about what’s good for them and what’s bad for them, so they should ignore their own moral compass and listen to you. How _empowering_ it must be for someone to turn her whole life over to the moral dictates of a complete stranger, and how _in control_ she shall be once that stranger is dictating the conditions under which she may use her sexuality. > [@](#): > > It’s not good for the boys to treat girls like that, either. You can’t de-humanize someone else without de-humanizing yourself. You are presupposing your own conclusion, which is still very much up for debate. ---
**Author:** ![furlibusea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@furlibusea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furlibusea)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2006, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/58 "2006-04-09T12:10:30Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > …I was watching Oprah and she had the cast of Crash on to discuss racism in our society. > > …Oprah turned to Ludacris and started mauling him with the claws of 10000 wild bears on crack for using the “n-word” in his raps. Then suddenly, she started tearing into him for rapping about bitches and hoes as well. Actually within the context of the movie, it is fully appropriate for her to call Luda to account on this and the n-word. In the his character says something to the affect of [almost quote here] Once upon a time the Black Man had educated articulate men who spoke. Men like Eldritch Cleavers, and Huey P. Newton, and people listened. The FBI and the CIA said we can’t have that, so they gave us these mumbling crass morons who no one could understand to sing rap, and made them famous. [/almost quote off] I sort of remember him going on to talk about women in those videos. She was not just pulling the conversation out of nowhere. ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2006, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/59 "2006-04-09T12:29:10Z")
> [@Talon Karrde](#): > > Sex is _way_ more personal than manual labor. That’s why, if I’m not mistaken, rape is considered a much more serious crime than forcing someone to wash your floor. Yeah, it’s common to beat people, push them down, hold knives to them and abuse them while you make them wash their floor. It happens all the time, but if you add sex, it’s a more serious offence. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![bluetrust](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@bluetrust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bluetrust)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2006, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608/60 "2006-04-09T19:31:50Z")
Well, the question you have to ask is: > [@](#): > > Are girls shaking their ass so bad for society that it trumps: the girls’ right to shake their own ass, the rappers right to have it in his video, and MTV’s right to pick and choose the videos they broadcast? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hip-hop-videos/351608.md?page=4)