# His4Ever, A Word With You Please **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 21, 2002, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045 "2002-09-21T23:37:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/41 "2002-09-22T19:40:49Z")
**Forbin** , she said "This whole conversation is disgusting and pretty close to blasphemy as far as I’m concerned. " To me, that includes the OP. The person of Christ is also sacrosanct to me, but one of the crucial aspects of that person is His **complete** humanity. I’m sorry. I am a firm believer in courtesy and in loving one’s neighbor as oneself, but I have seen His4Ever exhibit little or no such courtesy towards others who do not share her exact beliefs. Also, I take accusations of blasphemy and evil very seriously, especially when directed at someone I know very well in real life. If the baseball bat analogy was over the line, it’s only because I read her as trying to bludgeon people into faith rather than persuade, and I have had to deal with people who’ve had the bruises and worse from such treatment. I regret that I cannot back down on this one. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/42 "2002-09-22T19:51:24Z")
It’s nice to see that others are seeing through **"His"4Ever’s** pathetic, pseudo-christian act. She is, sadly, a walking example of a cancer that threatens the lives of every decent gay person, every decent non-brainwashed/braindead fundie “christian,” and apparently every person with a sense of humor. There are more like her. And they travel in packs (they call them congregations, but a more appropriate term would be klans or gangs). ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/43 "2002-09-22T20:12:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by His4ever \* > \*\* There seems to be some sort of “clique” on this board and if a person disagrees with them, everybody piles on. \*\* Yes, you’re quite right there. However, there is not just one clique on the boards, there are several. You have fallen afoul of two of the largest: 1. The Anti-Ignorance Clique 2. The Anti-Sanctimonious-Bigot Clique Unfortunately for you, nearly everybody else on this particular board is a member of both of these cliques. It is in fact quite hard for an Ignorant Sanctimonious Bigot such as yourself to fit in here. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/44 "2002-09-22T20:34:55Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Forbin_ > You [**gobear**] seem unconcerned when offensive comments are made regarding the person of Christ, but ask yourself how you would react to the (oft quoted) “gays are gonna have sex with children”, remark or any other idiotic stereotype concerning homosexuality. Sorry, but that’s apples and oranges. See, **gobear** is gay, so when **H4E** calls gays “an abomination”, she is personally insulting him. On the other hand, the comments in the other thread cannot possibly be construed as insulting to **H4E** because **H4E** isn’t Jesus. As much as she’d like to think otherwise, she does not hold the copyright on the Bible and has no grounds to dictate how other people may discuss this vitally important historical figure. There’s also the matter that none of the comments in the original thread were, in fact, insulting Jesus. At worst, they were ascribing human emotions to him no doubt shared by the people making those comments. In other words, if a horny person describes Jesus as horny, it’s not an insult, because (presumably) the person describing him as such does not see horniness as a negative trait. Am I making any sense here? Likely not. P’raps I should just stick to rude comments. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/45 "2002-09-22T21:03:34Z")
Some of this makes my skin crawl. **cjhoworth** demands an apology, because **His4ever** hurt someone else’s feelings. She gets one. And now we have another of these f\*\*\*ing pile-ons, in which everybody else calls **His4ever** the hateful one, insults her, makes judgements as to the validity of her beliefs, condemns her to hell, etc., etc. And all because you are the ones who are _really_ in tune with what God wants. So we all know that when someone cites the Bible saying that someone’s behavior is an abomination, that is vicious and evil. But calling someone “sanctimonious”, “hateful”, a “liar”, “warped”, a “cancer” - all that is perfectly OK, isn’t it? To all you telling **His4ever** that she is never going to get thru to others by being nasty - do you ever listen to your own advice? Or is that as hypocritical as some of the rest of this bullshit? ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/46 "2002-09-22T21:18:36Z")
**Shodan** , fuck right off, why don’t you? Many people, including **CJHoworth** , have tried to talk to **H4E** politely; they have tried to use gentle persuasion to help her see the error of her ways. Nopne of it has worked. Now you’re not gay and you don’t like gays, so I can see how her language wouldn’t bother you. I, however, find her anti-gay attitude appalling, just as I find anti-Jewish or anti-black attitudes appalling. **H4E** is a hater, she’s a bigot, she wraps herself in the Bible to justify her prejudice. And to compare her anti-gay beliefs to joking about Jesus is asinine. A little religious levity pales beside anti-gay hatred which is directly responsible for fueling gaybashing and legal discrimination. And don;t hand me the “ **H4E** is against gaybashing” because that’s bullshit–if you think that the fundamentalist anti-gay movement has not given its imprimatur to attacks on gays, then you’re living in a fucking fantasy land. Somebody calls me an abomination, they get told to go fuck themselves, and that goes for their fucking sycophants, too. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/47 "2002-09-22T21:35:02Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Shodan_ > And all because you are the ones who are really in tune with what God wants. So we all know that when someone cites the Bible saying that someone’s behavior is an abomination, that is vicious and evil. > > But calling someone “sanctimonious”, “hateful”, a “liar”, “warped”, a “cancer” - all that is perfectly OK, isn’t it? > > To all you telling His4ever that she is never going to get thru to others by being nasty - do you ever listen to your own advice? What an enourmous steaming load. Pay attention, Bubbles, so you don’t keep embarassing yourself: the people telling **H4E** that she’s never going to get through to other people by being nasty are not the same people who are being nasty right back at her. And as far as I can tell, most of the people treating her as she treats other people aren’t doing it in God’s name. I know I’m not. My opinions are mine alone. I make no claim of divine endorsement. And I have no problem lowering my tone to match her own. Hypocrisy? Hardly. If someone insults me and mine, I’m going to insult them right back. I’ve never made any claim to greater personal civility, and I’ve never demanded that people treat me better than I treat them. Where, pray tell, is the hypocrisy in that? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/48 "2002-09-22T21:39:44Z")
She didn’t just fucking apologize **Shodan**. She whined, rationalized, complained, and nailed herself to Jesus’ Very Own Cross for about the fiftieth time in her short SDMB history. And even the purported apology was only offered “because you desire it,” not because she was acting like an Ignorant Sanctimonious Bigot[sup]TM[/sup]. Meanwhile, your own eagerness to defend every Ignorant Sanctimonious Bigot who comes along is really getting distressingly predictable. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/49 "2002-09-22T21:44:40Z")
**Shodan** , what **His4Ever** said was "I will apologize because you desire it. " She is not apologizing for her comment regarding for blasphemy or for claiming people’s “minds are warped by the evil one.” Also, since I am not agentfroot’s friend but one of her spiritual advisors and because my words led to the thread which started this debacle, when she says that of agentfroot, she also says that of me. Bottom line: **the apology, as written, is not accepted** because it is not a true apology. What I want from **His4Ever** is a retraction of the implication that agentfroot or I are in league with evil because we wonder about what Christ was like as a teenager. Quite frankly, I don’t expect to get it. I would also like to see one post from **His4Ever** where she shows compassion rather than condemning those who are different. One of the things I treasure most about this board is it is a place where I can ask questions I wouldn’t dare ask anywhere else. Responding to what to me is a perfectly legitimate question with implications of blasphemy is not only against the religion she and I claim to share, it’s against the spirit of this entire message board. To me, her post in that thread contributed nothing except condemnation and a belief that the question should not have been asked. If anyone sees anything else in it, please say so, either here or by e-mail. Respectfully, CJ ---
**Author:** ![lynn73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@lynn73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lynn73)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/50 "2002-09-22T21:47:34Z")
:rolleyes: Sigh… **gobear** , you still have no idea where I’m coming from. I am sorry that I couldn’t tell you what you wanted to hear when you asked what I thought of homosexuality. It would’ve been easier and simpler if I could have said what everone wanted. But it wouldn’t have been the truth, dear one, and true love tells the truth. I didn’t call you any names, I simply quoted what the Scripture says. And, I’m not in favor of gay bashing or any physical violence toward them in any way. I truly wish, **gobear** , that I could say what you want but I can’t do that. The Lord loves you very much but He doesn’t love what you’re doing for you’re hurting your own body 1 Cor 6:18. I’m sorry my believing these things hurts you, but in my heart I believe the Bible to be against this activity so how could I have told you any different? You will, no doubt, continue to think of me in the way you have been but God knows I have no hate or animosity toward you. You have the right, of course, to continue to say what you want about me and call me names or whatever. Still, I hold no animosity toward you, only a deep concern for your eternal well being which is more important IMHO than happiness here on earth, though we all want happiness. Regardless of all that’s been said and discussed on this board concerning this subject, I still cannot say what you want to hear but my thoughts and prayers are with you. ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/51 "2002-09-22T21:54:40Z")
Hell, Shodan, don’t count me as a hypocrite. I accept that the odds of His4ever abandoning her fundamentalism are slim to none, and bitch at her because I consider her to be acting stupidly, not out of any real hope of changing her behavior. And, apoligising for something you really don’t feel sorry for is kind of pointless, especially if you go and do the same mess again. ---
**Author:** ![lynn73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@lynn73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lynn73)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/52 "2002-09-22T22:04:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by cjhoworth \* > \*\ ***Shodan** , what **His4Ever** said was "I will apologize because you desire it. " She is not apologizing for her comment regarding for blasphemy or for claiming people’s “minds are warped by the evil one.” Also, since I am not agentfroot’s friend but one of her spiritual advisors and because my words led to the thread which started this debacle, when she says that of agentfroot, she also says that of me. Bottom line: **the apology, as written, is not accepted** because it is not a true apology. What I want from **His4Ever** is a retraction of the implication that agentfroot or I are in league with evil because we wonder about what Christ was like as a teenager. Quite frankly, I don’t expect to get it. I would also like to see one post from **His4Ever** where she shows compassion rather than condemning those who are different. > > One of the things I treasure most about this board is it is a place where I can ask questions I wouldn’t dare ask anywhere else. Responding to what to me is a perfectly legitimate question with implications of blasphemy is not only against the religion she and I claim to share, it’s against the spirit of this entire message board. To me, her post in that thread contributed nothing except condemnation and a belief that the question should not have been asked. If anyone sees anything else in it, please say so, either here or by e-mail. > > Respectfully, > CJ \*\* I will apologize but not for finding some of the statements made in that thread irreverent and offensive. Maybe not the person who started the OP but some of the things said in the thread I found very disturbing and offensive, am I not allowed to say so? Those are the things I found offensive not the subject of the OP. I’m sorry, but some of the comments in that thread to me are downright terrible IMHO. Sorry if my opinion on it angers you. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/53 "2002-09-22T22:06:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by His4ever \* > Sigh… **gobear** , you still have no idea where I’m coming from. To the contrary, I think **gobear** has accurately and repeatedly described where you’re coming from: simple-minded, fundamentalist Christian, antin-gay bigotry. > [@](#): > > I am sorry that I couldn’t tell you what you wanted to hear when you asked what I thought of homosexuality. No, you’re not sorry at all. As a matter of fact, you appear to get a kick out of condemning people who aren’t like you. > [@](#): > > But it wouldn’t have been the truth, dear one, and true love tells the truth. Considering all the half-truths, omissions, and outright lies you’ve told around here, I can only construe this as a concession that you are not acting out of love at all. > [@](#): > > I’m not in favor of gay bashing or any physical violence toward them in any way. Yeah, but legal discrimination is also perfectly fine with you, as you’ve also stated. Why go through the trouble to smack a queer upside the head with a baseball bat when you can just deny him housing, health care, and employment? > [@](#): > > I truly wish, **gobear** , that I could say what you want but I can’t do that. Fine. But you can shut up altogether, can’t you? ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/54 "2002-09-23T00:17:13Z")
> [@](#): > > Sigh…gobear, you still have no idea where I’m coming from. I am sorry that I couldn’t tell you what you wanted to hear when you asked what I thought of homosexuality. It would’ve been easier and simpler if I could have said what everone wanted. But it wouldn’t have been the truth, dear one, and true love tells the truth. I didn’t call you any names, I simply quoted what the Scripture says. Calling me an abomination is calling me names. And again, the Scriptures were written in Greek and Hebrew, not English, and if you bother to check, you’ll find that the interpretation you’ve been taught is not necessarily correct. Check out the homosexuality discussion at [religioustolerance.org](http://religioustolerance.org). > [@](#): > > And, I’m not in favor of gay bashing or any physical violence toward them in any way. Glad to hear it. And if you are in favor of non-discrimination policies in housing and employment, as well as legal marriage (civil unions, whatever), that will make me very happy. > [@](#): > > The Lord loves you very much but He doesn’t love what you’re doing for you’re hurting your own body 1 Cor 6:18. Aside from your perplexing certainty that you are privy to the will of the Architect of the Universe (assuming the existence of such a being in the first place, a highly dubious proposition), you keep reducing the complexity of gay relationships to the merely physical. My dear lady, have you never been in love? Have you never snuggled on the couch with a bowl of popcorn and _Koyaanisqatsi_ on the DVD? Have you never walked down a busy street with your beloved, sharing glances and warmth undetected by the oblivious throng? Have you never basked in the knowledge that you are adored? Love comes from the marriage of souls, not mere genital friction. If my boyfriend and I never laid a finger on each other, we would still be as gay as a daisy in May. Oh, and gay sex doesn’t hurt–on the contrary, it can be ecstatically pleasurable. And since you have been so kind to share your Scriptures with me, please allow me to share my holy writings with you… [quote] I’m as corny as Kansas in August, High as a flag on the Fourth of July! If you’ll excuse an expression I use, I’m in love, I’m in love, I’m in love, I’m in love, I’m in love with a wonderful guy! [quote] _South Pacific_, by Rodgers and Hammerstein. In addition, I would urge to read Plato’s [Symposium](http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/symposium.html) for the story of the origin of love that Aristophanes recounts at the eponymous drinking party: > [@](#): > > Men who are a section of that double nature which was once called Androgynous are lovers of women; adulterers are generally of this breed, and also adulterous women who lust after men: the women who are a section of the woman do not care for men, but have female attachments; the female companions are of this sort. But they who are a section of the male follow the male, and while they are young, being slices of the original man, they hang about men and embrace them, and they are themselves the best of men, because they have the most manly nature. Some indeed assert that they are shameless, but this is not true; for they do not act thus from any want of shame, but because they are valiant and manly, and have a manly countenance, and they embrace that which is like them. Or if you want the short version, you can rent the DVD of _Hedwig and the Angry Inch_ and listen to the song, “The Origin of Love”. ---
**Author:** ![agentfroot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/779978/32.png) [@agentfroot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/agentfroot)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/55 "2002-09-23T00:22:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by His4ever \* > \*\* > I will apologize but not for finding some of the statements made in that thread irreverent and offensive. Maybe not the person who started the OP but some of the things said in the thread I found very disturbing and offensive, am I not allowed to say so? Those are the things I found offensive not the subject of the OP. I’m sorry, but some of the comments in that thread to me are downright terrible IMHO. Sorry if my opinion on it angers you. \*\* Ah, here we go. I also found some of the comments pretty distasteful and vulgar. My intention was to provoke thought, not gross sexual jokes, but some people took it a bit too far. You’re partially forgiven… I can understand being offended, but the way you posted made it sound like you were condemning me too. ---
**Author:** ![lynn73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@lynn73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lynn73)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/56 "2002-09-23T00:43:08Z")
No, that wasn’t my intent. I just found some of what was being said very bad, that’s all. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@The\_Tim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tim)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/57 "2002-09-23T00:59:02Z")
I tried posting in the GD thread that started this but it was eaten. I always assumed the point of Christianity was that god was so compassionate he became human not that he was so powerful you should fear speaking ill of him. If it isn’t then Christianity is no different than the pagan religions of the time except there is only a single god to worry about ticking off. Part of being human, especially a famous human, is having people take pot-shots at you. Even after you are dead. I’m sure that Jesus, should he still be aware of what is said of him, can take the jokes. I’ve heard he has endured far worse. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyDiamond](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8491ac/32.png) [@JerseyDiamond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyDiamond)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/58 "2002-09-23T01:24:35Z")
**His4ever** , e-mail me so I can e-mail you. 🙂 JD ---
**Author:** ![d\_redguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5fc32e/32.png) [@d\_redguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/d_redguy)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/59 "2002-09-23T01:28:17Z")
**His4Ever** , _please_ prove to me that you are more than just an FEP (Fundamentalist Emulator Program). Go to some of the other threads and post there. **DO NOT** quote scripture. Did you see Survivor last week? I missed it. Tell me about it. Do you go camping? There’s a thread about that too. What is your take on The Bush Doctrine? Should we invade Iraq? Have anything mundane and pointless to share? We’d love to hear about it. (Seinfeldesque daily occurences play quite well) Start a pit thread. Say fuck a bunch of times. But _please_, **PLEASE** be a human being, not an FEP. Otherwise you will get the brand of OTP. This leads to your posts being ignored. You message does not get out. Who does that help? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045/60 "2002-09-23T02:59:57Z")
His4ever, you haven’t even started to understand what so many people here are trying to tell you. You remind me of Jerry Falwell. While you may take that as a compliment, I assure you that I do not intend it as such. You have the mental flexibility of my cat Annie. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/his4ever-a-word-with-you-please/129045.md?page=4)