# Historical and or factual inaccuracies in song lyrics **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 22, 2008, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473 "2008-04-22T23:21:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/21 "2008-04-23T05:43:43Z")
[QUOTE=Indistinguishable] I think I’m confused. What Prime Meridian is it that cuts through the Western hemisphere rather than Greenwich? [/QUOTE] The prime (or first, or principal) meridian of the [Dominion Land Survey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominion_Land_Survey): > [@](#): > > The Dominion Land Survey is the method used to divide most of Western Canada into one-square-mile sections for agricultural and other purposes. It is based on the layout of the Public Land Survey System used in the United States, but has several differences. The DLS is the dominant survey method in the Prairie provinces, but it is also used in British Columbia along the Railway Belt (near the main line of the Canadian Pacific Railway), and in the Peace River Block in the northeast of the province. The survey was begun July 10, 1871, shortly after Manitoba and the North-West Territories became part of Canada. Covering about 800,000 square kilometres (309,000 sq mi), the survey system and its terminology are deeply ingrained in the rural culture of the Prairies. > > The most important north–south lines of the survey are the meridians: > [ul]The First (or Principal) Meridian at 97°27′28.41″ west, just west of Winnipeg, Manitoba.[/ul] > [ul]The Second Meridian at 102° west, which forms the northern part of the Manitoba–Saskatchewan boundary.[/ul] > [ul]The Third Meridian at 106° west, near Moose Jaw and Prince Albert, Saskatchewan.[/ul] > [ul]The Fourth Meridian at 110° west, which forms the Saskatchewan–Alberta boundary and bisects Lloydminster.[/ul] > [ul]The Fifth Meridian at 114° west, which runs through Calgary, Alberta (Barlow Trail is built mostly on the meridian) and Stony Plain, Alberta (48th Street).[/ul] > [ul]The Sixth Meridian at 118° west, near Grande Prairie, Alberta and Revelstoke, British Columbia.[/ul] > [ul]The Seventh Meridian at 122° west, between Hope and Vancouver, British Columbia.[/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/22 "2008-04-23T05:56:38Z")
Sink the Bismark by Johnny Horton “The Bismark was the fastest ship that ever sailed the seas On her deck were guns as big as steers and shells as big as trees” Ah, I think you got that backwards Johnny. ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/23 "2008-04-23T07:12:07Z")
[QUOTE=ZipperJJ] The date in the title of the song “April 29, 1992 (Miami)” by Sublime, about the LA riots and how they affected the entire country, is correct. However, the singer sang “April 26 1992/there was a riot on the street/tell me where were you” and that’s how it was recorded and will live on forever. That date is wrong. (It’s also my cousin’s birthday!) [/QUOTE] Well, then … I hope you can report that you were at your cousin’s party! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/24 "2008-04-23T10:45:39Z")
Neil Young’s “Cortez the Killer”: the Aztecs were not a bunch of nature-worshipping peace-loving hippies who joyously built pyramids when they weren’t grooving about: they were a savage bunch of bloodthirsty death-obsessed warmongering bastards, and good riddance to the lot of them. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/25 "2008-04-23T11:39:42Z")
… ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/26 "2008-04-23T11:40:12Z")
“Born and raised in South Detroit” usually gets a chuckle out of people from Detroit, doesn’t it? It’s pretty much a lake, or Windsor. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/27 "2008-04-23T12:28:28Z")
Here’s mathematician and physicist Simon Singh taking issue with Katie Melua’s bad science: [Comment in the Guardian.](http://education.guardian.co.uk/higher/comment/story/0,,1581826,00.html) The argument was over the lyrics to Melua’s 2005 single “Nine Million Bicycles”: [QUOTE=Katie Melua] We are 12 billion light-years from the edge, That’s a guess — no-one can ever say it’s true, But I know that I will always be with you [/QUOTE] Singh understandably felt he had to speak up: “When Katie sings ‘We are 12 billion light-years from the edge’, she is suggesting that this is the distance to the edge of the observable universe, which in turn implies that the universe is only 12 billion years old. (…) As soon as the idea of the Big Bang was proposed in the 1920s, astronomers set about trying to work out when the bang happened. Initial estimates were, not surprisingly, wildly inaccurate, but by the 1980s it was known that the universe was 15 billion years old, give or take 5 billion years. Today, the very latest data implies that the age of the universe is precisely 13.7 billion years. This is an astonishing result, because astronomers are giving the first decimal place in their estimate of the age of the universe, implying a hitherto unheard-of level of confidence in their measurements. (…) In short, Katie Melua has no right to call the age of the universe ‘a guess’ or quote it as 12 billion years when we now know it to be 13.7 billion years old.” Singh suggested the following revised lyrics: [QUOTE=Simon Singh] We are 13.7 billion light-years from the edge of the observable universe, That’s a good estimate with well-defined error bars, Scientists say it’s true, but acknowledge that it may be refined, And with the available information, I predict that I will always be with you [/QUOTE] As the [Wiki article](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nine_Million_Bicycles#Lyrical_Error) about the incident points out, however, the lyrics are still incorrect. While the universe is about 13.7 billion years old, the distance to the edge of the observable universe is greater than 13.7 billion light years, due to the expansion of the universe. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2008, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/28 "2008-04-23T14:02:01Z")
[QUOTE=Lucky 13] The “east side” of Chicago is a lake. [/QUOTE] Now, now. This was widely debated in Chicago when the song came out, and although it’s less well known than the North, South, or West Sides, there is in fact an [East Side of Chicago](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Side,_Chicago), hard against the Indiana border. In the Chicago phone book, there’s a whole column of businesses and community organizations with “East Side” in their name. > [@Le Ministre de l'au-delà](#): > > I think they’re confusing the hundredth meridian (which is just west of Brandon, Manitoba, where I grew up.) with the Prime meridian, which is just west of Winnipeg, and from whence all of the section and township lines for the prairies are drawn. If you’re headed west out of Winnipeg, you’d think that you had been on the great plains for quite some time already when you went past Brandon. It’s a brilliant song, but the geography doesn’t work out. Most geographers restrict the [Great Plains](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Plains) to the higher-altitude, short-grass steppe found farther west than Manitoba. Notice how the wiki map superimposes the 100th meridian on the Great Plains. In the United States, at least, the 100th meridian is often used as a metaphorical eastern border for the plains, or for the West in general, even though it isn’t geographically exact. ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/29 "2008-04-24T18:58:03Z")
From _Life in a Northern Town_, by one-hit wonder The Dream Academy: _In winter 1963 It felt like the world would freeze With John F. Kennedy And the Beatles_ By winter of 1963, John F. Kennedy was dead. Of course they might have been talking about the winter of **1962-63** , or speaking from the viewpoint of someone in the Southern Hemisphere. If you want to get all technical about it. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/30 "2008-04-24T19:10:38Z")
Krakatoa is not east of Java. Though not originated by the B-52s, this notion was perpetuated by them. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/31 "2008-04-24T19:26:59Z")
[QUOTE=Lucky 13] Paper Lace, _The Night Chicago Died_: Daddy was a cop On the east side of Chicago The “east side” of Chicago is a lake. [/QUOTE] I know this is a well know gaffe, but I don’t get it- wouldn’t the land to the left of the lake be the east side? Maybe its not called that by anyone, but technically the area opposite the west side is the east side? I’m told by some that Ramblin’ Man contains an error as the bayou and the delta are supposedly different areas, but the song implies they are the same. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/32 "2008-04-24T19:39:39Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] The Idol does Andrew Lloyd Webber thread had me thinking of possible song choices, which made me think of the title number from _Sunset Blvd_ (as a David Cook song) which reminds me of one of my biggest factually inaccurate lyrical lines: “L[os] A[ngeles]'s changed a lot over the years/since those brave gold rush pioneers/came in their creaky covered wagons…” [/QUOTE] Lyrics by Don Black & Chris Hampton. Black also had a woman in NYC sing “He’s doing some deal up in Baltimore now” and later while in Hollywood, “Every man and beast came from out east.” Lady has no sense of direction ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/33 "2008-04-24T19:47:47Z")
[QUOTE=Kizarvexius] Of course they might have been talking about the winter of **1962-63** , . . . [/QUOTE] That would make sense, since Dream Academy was English. In England the Beatles were well known in winter 1962-63, while Kennedy was alive. In America the only nexus was after Kennedy’s death. Beatlemania is sometimes attributed to public hunger for a pop-culture distraction after the assassination. (As if we needed an excuse for a distraction!) But that took place in the winter of 1963-64. I can’t believe I’m defending the lyrics to inane songs. > [@Wee Bairn](#): > > I know this is a well know gaffe, but I don’t get it- wouldn’t the land to the left of the lake be the east side? Maybe its not called that by anyone, but technically the area opposite the west side is the east side? Neighborhood names aren’t entirely rational. The areas alongside the lake are called the Lake Front, or the Loop, or the Gold Coast, or Hyde Park, but absolutely _never_ the East Side. As I say above, there is an East Side of Chicago, but it’s alongside the Indiana border, not Lake Michigan. ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/34 "2008-04-24T19:51:49Z")
Anyway, the factual hilarity in “The Night Chicago Died” isn’t the geography, it’s the idea of Capone shooting in out with the Chicago Police. Why would he damage his own property? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/35 "2008-04-24T20:24:50Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] In the Charlene drag-queen’s dream song _Never Been to Me_ the title character sings “I’ve been to Nice/and the isle of Greece/where I sipped champagne on a yacht…” While it’s possible to sip champagne on a yacht in the Mediterranean or Aegean, GREECE IS NOT **AN** Island! It’s a peninsula and an archipelago of many many islands! [/QUOTE] I’ve always heard that as “the isles of Greece”, which makes sense, since there are many Greek islands, even if most of Greece is a pair of peninsulas (separated by the Corinth Canal, which I think technically makes the Peloponessos the largest Greek island, and no longer a peninsula). ---
**Author:** ![pinkfreud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pinkfreud/32/17603_2.png) [@pinkfreud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkfreud)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/36 "2008-04-24T20:33:58Z")
Merle Haggard, in “Okie from Muskogee,” sings “We don’t smoke marijuana in Muskogee.” Well, I been there, and Merle’s mighty wrong about that. ---
**Author:** ![ArizonaTeach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/45deac/32.png) [@ArizonaTeach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArizonaTeach)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/37 "2008-04-24T20:43:29Z")
Well, Zager and Evans got most of it right, but they were waaaaaay of on 7510. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/38 "2008-04-24T20:46:01Z")
[QUOTE=pinkfreud] Merle Haggard, in “Okie from Muskogee,” sings “We don’t smoke marijuana in Muskogee.” Well, I been there, and Merle’s mighty wrong about that. [/QUOTE] and Kinky Friedman’s “Asshole from El Paso” doesn’t even mention **Hal Briston** _We keep our women virgins till they’re married. So hosing sheep is good enough for us._ ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2008, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/39 "2008-04-24T21:21:48Z")
Of course, Snoopy didn’t really shoot down the Red Baron either. [Link](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oxzg_iM-T4E) ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2008, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473/40 "2008-04-25T04:15:41Z")
[QUOTE=Kizarvexius] From _Life in a Northern Town_, by one-hit wonder The Dream Academy: _In winter 1963 It felt like the world would freeze With John F. Kennedy And the Beatles_ By winter of 1963, John F. Kennedy was dead. [/QUOTE] > [@Freddy the Pig](#): > > I can’t believe I’m defending the lyrics to inane songs. Well, I at least can believe I’m defending this song as I do it, since I did like it a lot when it was a hit (I even bought it on a 45 RPM record) and still do. JFK died on November 22, 1963. So these lyrics refer to the winter following his assassination as a period of bleak despair for the denizens of a small town in the American North, into which came The Beatles. Spot on factually, really. In a “northern town” as sung about (i.e., somewhere in Wisconsin or Vermont), especially back in 1963, there would almost certainly have been freezing temperatures and snowfall by November 22nd, and possibly snow remaining on the ground all day long. This is winter by anyone’s everyday definition, with only eggheads waiting for the winter solstice. “Beatlemania” in the US began very shortly afterwards, in December 1963 and January 1964 (and building up quickly enough that their arrival in Feb 1964 was to delirious crowds). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/historical-and-or-factual-inaccuracies-in-song-lyrics/446473.md?page=3)