# Hobbit: Radagast the Brown getting a bigger storyline **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 18, 2012, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119 "2012-09-18T23:57:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/61 "2012-09-20T14:29:02Z")
‘The Hobbit’ - the book - is only written from Bilbo’s perspective - its what he knows (or what he wants others to know). I think Peter Jackson took the opportunity to flesh out the other parts of the story that were happening at the same time - the items that were alluded to - that lots of other Tolkien fans would love to see incorporated. So, its more than just ‘The Hobbit’ - its another Journey (quite unexpected) into Middle Earth and back again. What I am still hoping for is that he puts together a special cut that is just ‘The Hobbit’ - but I am looking forward to this trilogy regardless. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/62 "2012-09-20T14:33:13Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > And of course there was singing - does > _Tril-lil-lil-lolly > The valley is jolly_ > not ring a bell? 🙂 > [@mlees](#): > > No… Then you have never _truly_ experienced the …Might and… Majesty of the Elves of Rivendell. \*O! What are you seeking, And where are you making? The faggots are reeking, The bannocks are baking! \* ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/63 "2012-09-20T14:52:35Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Then you have never _truly_ experienced the …Might and… Majesty of the Elves of Rivendell. > > \*O! What are you seeking, > And where are you making? > The faggots are reeking, > The bannocks are baking! > \* snerk 😃 Yeah, I hope the Rivendell elves get a bit of a … dignity upgrade. They were more than a bit silly and childish in The Hobbit. I liked the dwarven singing in the first trailer tho. It was all basso and ominous-like. Very Russian. I have hope. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/64 "2012-09-20T14:53:00Z")
Here’s (IIRC) a full list & first lines of all the songs in The Hobbit \*Chip the glasses and crack the plates! Blunt the knives and bend the forks! \*(The dwarves’ cleanup song) \*Far over the misty mountains cold To dungeons deep and caverns old \* (The dwarves’ after-dinner song , featured in the first trailer - and I agree, **Lasciel** , it sounded _great_ there - shades of Aragorn’s coronation song, too) \*O! What are you doing, And where are you going? \*(The welcome song of the Rivendell Elves) \*Clap! Snap! the black crack! Grip, grab! Pinch, nab! \* (Goblins’ song in the caves) \*Fifteen birds in five firtrees, their feathers were fanned in a fiery breeze! \*(Goblins’ song in the forest) \*The wind was on the withered heath, but in the forest stirred no leaf: (Dwarves’ song at Beorn’s) \*Old fat spider spinning in a tree! Old fat spider can’t see me! \* (Bilbo taunts Mirkwood spiders) \*Roll–roll–roll–roll, roll-roll-rolling down the hole! \* (Wood Elves’ barrel song) \* The King beneath the mountains, The King of carven stone, \* (Lake-town song about the dwarves) \* Under the Mountain dark and tall The King has come unto his hall! \* (The dwarves singing to Thorin) \*The dragon is withered, His bones are now crumbled; \* (The Rivendell elves’ returning song) \*Sing all ye joyful, now sing all together! The wind’s in the tree-top, the wind’s in the heather; \*(The Rivendell elves’ song night-time serenade) \*Roads go ever ever on, Over rock and under tree, \*(Bilbo’s homecoming song/poem/thingy) ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/65 "2012-09-20T15:06:03Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > I seem to recall that characters broke out in song in the written books (LoTR). I wonder if he would be dissapointed that Jackson didn’t include much of that in the films. 🙂 > > Was there singing in The Hobbit? And oh thank all the ghods that Jackson didn’t put the singing and bad poetry in. I have learned, over the years, that when it comes time to re-read LOTR, skip the poetry. It sucks. If you do, there’s a damn good story lurking in the background. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/66 "2012-09-20T16:49:22Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > And oh thank all the ghods that Jackson didn’t put the singing and bad poetry in. > > I have learned, over the years, that when it comes time to re-read LOTR, skip the poetry. It sucks. If you do, there’s a damn good story lurking in the background. Heh. I do skip those, and I guess that’s why I couldn’t remember if there was any singing in “The Hobbit”. In the little bits on Radagast shown in the new trailer, what was that breaking through his skylight? ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/67 "2012-09-20T18:25:31Z")
I would pay good money to have [Goblin Town](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogTDa-vG2MQ) in the film. I see the first commenter agrees: “Peter Jackson better have this in the damn movie” ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/68 "2012-09-20T20:44:35Z")
> [@carlb](#): > > Not shoe-horned at all; a significant part of the film will concern the White Council’s dealings with “The Necromancer”. While this was all done “off screen” in _The Hobbit_, it’s described in the appendices to _The Lord of the Rings_, and was contemporaneous with the events of _The Hobbit_; it’s why Gandalf left before the company entered Mirkwood. Galadriel was a significant player in the White Council, so there’s every reason to expect her to play a role in the film. It’s the same reason we’ll see Saruman again. > > There’s a difference between forcing a character into a story just because they’re popular/cool/whatever, and using a character who, while not explicitly mentioned or described, has every reason to be present (like Legolas and Galadriel). That’s a fair point, I’d completely forgotten about the appendices and what else was going on at the time of the Hobbit. My doubts about how well Jackson and Boyens can script these events though still stand however. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/69 "2012-09-21T09:32:29Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > Well from what I can gather about his opinions on the illustrations provided, he probably would have had mixed reactions to the films. Likely he would have taken umbrage with the scripting, along with the language delivery. OTOH, he certainly seemed to enjoy all the illustrations provided to him, even the ones he deemed “bad”. I think that if he could be persuaded to allow the films, he would have enjoyed them as a sort of homage. Tolkien sold the film rights to LOTR, although he doubted the films would ever be made. But he does speculate on _how_ they could be made, in his letters. He did know how stories “work”–he realized that hobbits were useful viewpoint characters, while the gloomy heroes & villains of his unpublished stories were a bit remote. (I’ve imagined him brought back for a visit to the set; he’d have plenty of complaints & corrections but would probably love Meduseld. Saxons on horseback!) Christopher is famously “protecting” the stories–but continues to cash in by repackaging bits & pieces from his father’s old notebooks. I wonder what Tolkien would think about _that_… ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/70 "2012-09-23T16:37:16Z")
I am SO looking forward to this ! ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/71 "2012-09-23T17:27:06Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > In the little bits on Radagast shown in the new trailer, what was that breaking through his skylight? Frame-by-frames are too blurry to be totally sure, but the going speculation is that it’s a giant-ass spider leg. Yay Shelob’s kids! _shudder_ ---
**Author:** ![Quercus\_alba](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quercus_alba/32/4061_2.png) [@Quercus\_alba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus_alba)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/72 "2012-09-23T17:40:50Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > Just from the trailers, I suspect it will be impossible to re-read the book without picturing Martin Freeman as Bilbo… I’m more concerned that I won’t be able to watch Bilbo without seeing Dr John Watson. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/73 "2012-09-23T17:48:52Z")
> [@Quercus\_alba](#): > > I’m more concerned that I won’t be able to watch Bilbo without seeing Dr John Watson. Did you have trouble seeing Bilbo in FOTR and seeing Jack the Ripper? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/74 "2012-09-23T17:59:49Z")
> [@lisiate](#): > > I’m in the deeply skeptical camp. I found the additions added to the \*Lord of the Rings \* by Jackson and Boyens ranged from ‘tolerable, but mediocre’ (elves at Helms Deep), to cartoonish (dwarf tossing and Oliphant surfing), to bewildering pointless (more Liv Tyler!, Aragorn falls off a cliff and floats down a river). The films would have been far better without them. > > Frankly, I fear we’ll find the added Radagast material to be a little bit shit and utterly pointless. Of course I hope I’ll be proved wrong but I doubt it. Agreed. I think everything they changed was to the worse. And Im not really a purist, neither regarding remakes in general, or regarding Tolkien. It was just that all the changes they made were bad writing. I have close to zero faith on those writers doing a good job with fully new material. Other things: - Aragorn cutting the head off the messenger - Gandalf arguing that Helms deep is a deathtrap. How would they defend against that huge army without the fortress I wonder. - The ents not being aware of Saruman’s activity before the events in the film. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/75 "2012-09-23T18:09:58Z")
> [@mr.jp](#): > > Agreed. I think everything they changed was to the worse. But they did write out Tom Bombadill, however one spells it. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/76 "2012-09-23T18:18:54Z")
> [@mr.jp](#): > > Agreed. I think everything they changed was to the worse. And Im not really a purist, neither regarding remakes in general, or regarding Tolkien. It was just that all the changes they made were bad writing. I have close to zero faith on those writers doing a good job with fully new material. > > Other things: > > - Aragorn cutting the head off the messenger > > - Gandalf arguing that Helms deep is a deathtrap. How would they defend against that huge army without the fortress I wonder. > > - The ents not being aware of Saruman’s activity before the events in the film. Add in: - Denethor being a senile glutton instead of the 24/7 armour-plated badass the book made him - Elrond being a dick about having Aragorn’s sword reforged until - Sauron places a curse on Arwen for no really clear reason, and while the entire fate of the free world wasn’t enough to reforge the sword, suddenly it gets done in a hurry because now it’s personal - Faramir dragging Frodo off to Osgiliath, in effect becoming Boromir Mk II instead of a wholly more admirable character than either his brother or his father - Gollum succeeding in alienating Frodo and Sam over a planted cake of lembas - Gandalf not realizing until Frodo has already gone to Mordor that it is stacked to the rafters with orcs - The “snow speeders vs AT-AT Walkers” scene between the Rohirrim and the _mumakil_ - The walls of Minas Tirith being made of damp plaster. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/77 "2012-09-23T18:25:43Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > And oh thank all the ghods that Jackson didn’t put the singing and bad poetry in. > > I have learned, over the years, that when it comes time to re-read LOTR, skip the poetry. It sucks. If you do, there’s a damn good story lurking in the background. Well, the “songs” do read fairly well, but having talked to some of my friends who filk heavily and semi-professionally, they don’t make good\* songs\*. Look, Peter Jackson can do no wrong in my book. I have the super-extended release version, and every added scene just makes the film better. I would watch a 12 part Hobbit. Hell, if Jackson put out a new LotR film every year, I’d be slavering in anticipation, like a kid on Christmas. ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/78 "2012-09-23T18:49:46Z")
I don’t think The Hobbit is enough material for three movies, though it might be slightly too much for just one. However… I remember being intrigued by what little was said of Radagast, and I am looking forward to finding out what they do with him in the movies. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/79 "2012-09-23T18:53:38Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Christopher is famously “protecting” the stories–but continues to cash in by repackaging bits & pieces from his father’s old notebooks. I wonder what Tolkien would think about _that_… Christopher is VERY conservative with the Professor’s legacy, sometimes a bit TOO conservative. But I still prefer his style of legacy guardianship to Brian Herbert’s all-out literary rape of his father’s brainchild. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119/80 "2012-09-23T19:23:51Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > - The “snow speeders vs AT-AT Walkers” scene between the Rohirrim and the _mumakil_ I thought that was great! Very cinematic anyway, but I do agree with your other points. I didn’t mind the Elves at Helm’s Deep either. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hobbit-radagast-the-brown-getting-a-bigger-storyline/635119.md?page=5)