# Hollywood Loves "Ugly Girl" Stories, Lacks Cojones To Use Real Ugly Girls **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 21, 2007, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860 "2007-01-21T18:43:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/41 "2007-01-22T14:30:30Z")
[QUOTE=astro] [Eva Longoria](http://www.eva-longoria-sexy-pictures.com/evalongoria005.jpg) of Desperate Houswives [/QUOTE] Thanks - haven’t seen the show. FWIW, I felt the same way as the OP about Shallow Hal. If they meant it, they would have cast some at least normal woman as the female lead, not someome who meets the Hollywood standard of “pretty = anorexia”. There is an early scene after the lead has had his magical insight, where he is in a cab with two women. Before, seen thru his eyes, they are Hollywood standard. After, from the “real” point of view, they are both (IMO) equally or more attractive. I have problems with the whole idea that you must be thirty pounds underweight to be beautiful. Or that implants are attractive, non-existent noses are _de rigueur_, or anyone over twenty five is out of the running. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/42 "2007-01-22T14:33:21Z")
I can think of one example of an ugly girl who finds true love – and with a hunky guy, River Phoenix. And she stays ugly throughout the movie. Funny thing is, I think Lili Taylor is hawt. And they cast Sue Morales (Northern Exposure) in the wrong role. If this movie had balls, they’s have cast her as Rose. The movie was Dogfight, BTW. ---
**Author:** ![Ichbin\_Dubist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/51bf81/32.png) [@Ichbin\_Dubist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ichbin_Dubist)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/43 "2007-01-22T14:33:51Z")
So what is everyone’s opinion of Lili Taylor? She’s been cast as the “ugly girl” more than a few times (_Dogfight_ and _I Shot Andy Warhol_, for example), but not always – I don’t think there was any hint that Nate was slumming by marrying her in _Six Feet Under_. She won’t remind anyone of a Barbie doll, but I think she’s prettier than the average Jane. Although she does play the neurotic wallflower really convincingly. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/44 "2007-01-22T14:46:52Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] FWIW, I felt the same way as the OP about Shallow Hal. If they meant it, they would have cast some at least normal woman as the female lead, [/QUOTE] No, they couldn’t have. The point of the story was that Hal saw ugly women as Hollywood-beautiful. They needed someone Hollywood-beautiful to portray what he was seeing through his hypnosis. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/45 "2007-01-22T14:48:21Z")
[QUOTE=Ichbin Dubist] So what is everyone’s opinion of Lili Taylor? [/QUOTE] See my post right before yours. When I saw her in Ransom, I wanted to sex up my TV set. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/46 "2007-01-22T14:50:24Z")
[QUOTE=Huerta88] The notion of Anne Hathaway as anything but hot was also part of what annoyed me so much about **The Devil Wears Prada.** [/QUOTE] > [@nitetime](#): > > Granted, casting Anne Hathaway, who is stunningly beautiful even by Hollywood standards, as the “ugly girl” is going a bit too far. Anne Hathaway wasn’t cast as “ugly” in _Devil Wears Prada_. She was cast as “not fashion conscious”, and slightly overweight by fashion-magazine standards. She had to be attractive to make the point that looks weren’t enough in the _Runway_ world–you had to be anorexic and tricked out in the latest duds besides. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/47 "2007-01-22T15:46:11Z")
[QUOTE=astro] [Is this woman pretty?](http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5184/0008hq7h7vp.jpg) [/QUOTE] Prettier than the second link of her! Seriously, in this link, she’s got a beautiful, fresh faced look (and she IS wearing makeup, just a different style and quantity of makeup) that I find just breathtaking. I don’t really know her work, although I see her on awards shows and such. I find that, much like with Paris Hilton, the “before/ugly” picture is far prettier than the “after/beautified” picture. It’s not that I don’t like makeup, it’s that I like subtle makeup that enhances, not thick and obvious makeup. I want to look at the person, not the bronzer. Although I did wonder at first if it was an odd angle of Maggie Gyllenhaal (another beauty in my book - when she’s not all tarted up.) ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/48 "2007-01-22T17:26:53Z")
Good points in the OP, but good luck finding any actress who will be considered “ugly” by consensus. As I’ve learned from perusing certain message boards, there is apparently nobody so hideous that at least one or two people won’t chime in about how “cute” he or she looks. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/49 "2007-01-22T18:23:58Z")
two comments: after recently seeing _Factotum_, and considering her other roles (\*High Fidelity \* and \*Say Anything \* come to mind – how’s that for spanning her career), I’ll say that Lilli Taylor has an attractive face, bad hair and an awful body – awkardly built, thick torso, saggy breasts, ridiculously skinny legs re _Shallow Hal_, it really wasn’t realistic to pick a larger girl for the female lead, as she had to be thin in the early segments. The other girls and guys who Hal saw both while he was hyptnotized and not hyponotized were played by different actors, which you can overlook with periphereal players, but which, for continuity’s sake, would be nearly impossible to overlook with the lead. IMHO, YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/50 "2007-01-22T19:30:22Z")
That’s why I likes “10 things I hate about you” (hey look, I saw it on cable!). There was not intimation that she was not attractive. Just Just that she was a bitch (ie not willing to conform to what guys think we should be and pretty prickly about it.) That said, there was a girl who went to school with me who dressed…well, a lot like me. Combat boots. Kakies. Baggy clothes Big black coat. Curly hair falling all over her face. I had to take a second look to notice she had the most perfect features. Limpid blue eyes. Porcinline skin. Curly hair was beautiful. She was a total babe. Nobody seemed to notice. She was a couple years behind me…I hope by senoir year, or at least by college someone will notice this jewel …someone who like combat boots. (I’d have done so if it wern’t for this pesky hetorsexuality) ---
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/51 "2007-01-22T20:06:07Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] I remember the endless chatter over Renee Zellwegger putting on some weight to play Bridget Jones, when all that weight did was bring her to an average weight and arguably make her more attractive than she normally is. [/QUOTE] Thank you! Renee Zellwegger is not an attractive person, but people continually talk about her like she is. In my household, she’s known as “Ax Face” Zelwegger. ---
**Author:** ![Alma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@Alma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alma)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/52 "2007-01-22T21:56:01Z")
[QUOTE=Huerta88] I’m not sure I do either. One variant: Ugly girl played by ugly girl does a montage makeover, and is still pretty ugly. Another: Ugly girl is picked on, never really stops getting picked on. Another: Ugly girl picked on, perseveres, remains ugly but succeeds in other aspects of life. Another: Ugly girl picked on, develops winning personality, is everyone’s best friend, but still really ugly. Another: Ugly girl is unfairly picked on for her looks when she is young and nice, becomes old and embittered, and is then, quite fairly, ostracized for her behavior. I know, I know, none very commercial or embiggening of the human spirit. But all more realistic than the stuff complained about in my OP. [/QUOTE] How about: Ugly girl keeps looking the same, other people around her learn that she is not actually ugly, they were just shallow. I know, it’ll never happen. ---
**Author:** ![hawksgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ed655f/32.png) [@hawksgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawksgirl)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/53 "2007-01-22T22:00:06Z")
Ugly girl refuses makeover because she wants people to like her for who she is and doesn’t feel the need to conform for others. She meets the boy of her dreams who loves her for her intelligence, personality, enthusiasm for life, and the ability to stand up for her principles. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/54 "2007-01-22T22:09:36Z")
I will give kudos to Robert Altman who used two of the… not better looking… women to receive consistent work in Hollywood in casting [Nashville](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073440/fullcredits): Shelley Duvall and Lily Tomlin. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/55 "2007-01-22T22:10:21Z")
[QUOTE=betenoir] Porcinline skin. Curly hair was beautiful. She was a total babe. [/QUOTE] Are you sure it wasn’t her curly tail? /lame pun ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/56 "2007-01-22T22:23:37Z")
I blame _The Munsters._ Everybody kept talking about how ugly the daughter was, and everybody bought the idea hook, line and sinker–let’s talk about a gorgeous girl as if she were ugly! Funny! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/57 "2007-01-22T22:26:37Z")
[QUOTE=hawksgirl] Ugly girl refuses makeover because she wants people to like her for who she is and doesn’t feel the need to conform for others. She meets the boy of her dreams who loves her for her intelligence, personality, enthusiasm for life, and the ability to stand up for her principles. [/QUOTE] Or, ugly girl refuses makeover because she wants people to like her for who she is. It turns out that no one likes her because she really is just a pain in the ass with low intelligence and no personality. Who says ugly girls are all smart with great sparkling personalities? ---
**Author:** ![hawksgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ed655f/32.png) [@hawksgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawksgirl)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/58 "2007-01-22T22:27:58Z")
[QUOTE=Antinor01] Or, ugly girl refuses makeover because she wants people to like her for who she is. It turns out that no one likes her because she really is just a pain in the ass with low intelligence and no personality. Who says ugly girls are all smart with great sparkling personalities? [/QUOTE] I didn’t say they did. It was a hypothetical situation about a single person, not an entire group of people. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/59 "2007-01-22T22:35:27Z")
[QUOTE=hawksgirl] I didn’t say they did. It was a hypothetical situation about a single person, not an entire group of people. [/QUOTE] Didn’t really mean to single yours out, just that it was the last post with one of those alternate story line ideas. But that is what all those movies are like, the ugly girl really is smart, has a great personality, probably some really major talent that no one noticed except maybe her art teacher…etc etc. And of course the rich, pretty girls are self absorbed and needlessly cruel to everyone around them. I’d just like to see it reversed. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860/60 "2007-01-22T22:39:46Z")
I mentioned in another thread, that with all the shows on that have average-at-best looking men in relationships with stunningly beautiful women, it’s interesting to see the stereotype reversed in _Grey’s Anatomy_, where a cast of mostly normal looking women are surrounded by men who all look like male models. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hollywood-loves-ugly-girl-stories-lacks-cojones-to-use-real-ugly-girls/388860.md?page=4)