# Holy Crap! S&W introduces a .460 revolver. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 24, 2014, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641 "2014-01-24T19:47:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2014, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/61 "2014-01-31T08:20:43Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > The actual reason is that the .45 GAP was designed to fit in a 9mm/.40 size pistol while retaining the ballistics of the .45 ACP. > [Here.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.45_GAP) Personally, I still think it sounds like a solution in search of a problem. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2014, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/62 "2014-01-31T12:30:39Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > Personally, I still think it sounds like a solution in search of a problem. I’ve shot the Glock 21(.45 ACP) and it’s noticeably thicker than the 17/22 pistols. For my average size hand, it was still shootable but not really comfortable. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2014, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/63 "2014-01-31T13:19:26Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > Personally, I still think it sounds like a solution in search of a problem. Which is basically the reason for most wildcat loadings. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2014, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/64 "2014-01-31T16:11:19Z")
My thoughts: [ol] [li]I’d hate to spend $2-4 a bullet to own a weapon[/li][li]It takes all of teh fun out of target shooting when my wrists are sore three or four days.[/li][li]It only comes in stainless and I like my weapons to be low-visibility.[/li][li]I don’t live anywhere near Kodiak bears or Cape Buffalo so it would be next to useless.[/li][/ol] My Beretta 96D and my Remington 870 are enough to handle 90% of the problems out there. Running away while take care of the remainder. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2014, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/65 "2014-01-31T20:12:41Z")
Heck, my Ruger 22/45 target pistol is enough to handle 90% of the problems out there. As an expert once said “A well placed shot from a .22 has more stopping power than a wild miss from a .45”. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2014, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/66 "2014-02-01T02:52:33Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Which is basically the reason for most wildcat loadings. 😛 I would agree with this. I think most shooters know at least one guy who’s spent ages perfecting his own custom cartridge which is ballistically very similar to one you can buy commercially, but not interchangable with it or anything else in existence. Actually, now I think about it, it’s possible wildcat cartridge developers might be the original hipsters. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/67 "2014-02-03T04:51:02Z")
Minor rant. When I was reading gun mags from the 60s and 70s, ‘ACP’ stood for ‘automatic centerfire pistol.’ Now, all online sources say the ‘c’ stands for ‘colt.’ ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/68 "2014-02-03T05:55:00Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > Minor rant. When I was reading gun mags from the 60s and 70s, ‘ACP’ stood for ‘automatic centerfire pistol.’ Now, all online sources say the ‘c’ stands for ‘colt.’ It always has. They just didn’t know any better. Hell, the original, now antique, ammo boxes don’t even say ACP. They read .45 Caliber M1911. Later boxes, from the era you’ve mentioned, are labeled 45 auto. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/69 "2014-02-05T09:15:02Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > It always has. They just didn’t know any better. Hell, the original, now antique, ammo boxes don’t even say ACP. They read .45 Caliber M1911. Later boxes, from the era you’ve mentioned, are labeled 45 auto. I’ve never seen any cartridge besides those originally designed for a Colt self-loader designated “ACP”, and it’s worth noting _all_ semi-auto pistols were centrefires around that time. I’m not actually sure when the first semi-auto .22 pistols came about but I’ve never seen one from before the 1920s or so - semi-auto .22 rifles were around from the early 1900s, though. British publications from the 1920s-1950s variously refer to the .45 ACP cartridge as “.45 US Government”, “.45 Auto(matic)” and “.45 Automatic Colt’s Pistol”, FWIW. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/70 "2014-02-05T09:35:57Z")
The line of “ACP’s” include: .25, .32, .380, and .45. The .38 super (9mm long) never had the ACP attached to it. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/71 "2014-02-05T11:25:54Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > The line of “ACP’s” include: .25, .32, .380, and .45. The .38 super (9mm long) never had the ACP attached to it. No, but as far as I can tell, the .38 ACP, aka .38 Auto, was the predecessor to .38 Super (Automatic). The main difference is the power/pressure. .38 ACP is rarely used now; .38 Super is used in competitions or in places that forbid .45 and used in 1911s etc. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/72 "2014-02-08T11:23:15Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > No, but as far as I can tell, the .38 ACP, aka .38 Auto, was the predecessor to .38 Super (Automatic). The main difference is the power/pressure. .38 ACP is rarely used now; .38 Super is used in competitions or in places that forbid .45 and used in 1911s etc. Just to be _really_ confusing, there’s also a .380 ACP which is still manufactured but is in no way interchangeable with .38 ACP. And I know .38 Super is popular with IPSC shooters in Australia because of the restrictions of .45 calibre handguns, but otherwise I’ve never seen a “normal” (ie not specially designed/modified for competition) handgun in the calibre, although I’m aware it was briefly popular in the 1930s before .357 Magnum came along. ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2014, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/73 "2014-02-09T06:40:13Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > …And I know .38 Super is popular with IPSC shooters in Australia because of the restrictions of .45 calibre handguns, but otherwise I’ve never seen a “normal” (ie not specially designed/modified for competition) handgun in the calibre, although I’m aware it was briefly popular in the 1930s before .357 Magnum came along. It’s also popular in countries that prohibit civilian ownership of firearms chambered in “military calibers.” IIRC, Mexico used to have quite a few, mainly 1911-style pistols. Not sure if Browning Hi-Powers were also re-chambered there to 38 Super. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2014, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/74 "2014-02-10T11:46:51Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > It’s also popular in countries that prohibit civilian ownership of firearms chambered in “military calibers.” IIRC, Mexico used to have quite a few, mainly 1911-style pistols. Not sure if Browning Hi-Powers were also re-chambered there to 38 Super. Don’t many of those countries define “military calibre” as anything over a certain size (often .32 ACP/.32 S&W Long), though? I had heard .38 Super was popular in Mexico because of their laws, though. ---
**Author:** ![LongJohn46](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@LongJohn46](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LongJohn46)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2014, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/75 "2014-02-10T15:37:32Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > My personal rule of thumb is that no revolver should have a cylinder longer than its barrel. Or wider! ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2014, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641/76 "2014-02-11T00:07:11Z")
except maybe a revival of the Vietnam tunnel gun. [http://www.barthworks.com/military/guns/photos/s%26wtunnelgun.jpg](http://www.barthworks.com/military/guns/photos/s%26wtunnelgun.jpg) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/holy-crap-s-w-introduces-a-460-revolver/679641.md?page=3)