Holy Crap! "Stay-on" gas pumps are back in NY!!

[Contrapuntal]

@Darth_Sensitive

That he, instead of holding the nozzle, takes off the gas cap and wedges it in so that it keeps the pump running.

Why is that true in his case and, presumably, no one else’s? If the clip is there, no jury rigging is required. If it isn’t there, anyone who wants to keep the pump running has to hold it himself, or rig it some way.

I must be missing something obvious.

[sailor]

@wheresgeorge04

The auto shut-off valve can malfunction - I’ve seen it happen a half-dozen times or so in 5 years working at a gas station. Sometimes the fuel overflows, sometimes the nozzle is ejected.

ETM

Just last week the pump next to mine had something malfunction and quite a bit of gasoline was spilled and flowed under my truck. The guy using the pump apologized saying it should have cut off but didn’t. I was not sure if I should get in the truck and run or if I should wait.

[elmwood]

I’ll tale the clips over the extremely high gas prices I have to pay when I visit the folks in Buffalo. Buffalo has the most expensive gasoline in the continental United States, and nobody can explain why.

[KCB615]

@muldoonthief

Not Mass - there are at least 2 self-serve stations I know of that have the nozzle catch, and have for years. So unless the weights & measures inspector never noticed them, I’d guess they’re legal.

From 527 CMR, the Massachusetts Fire Prevention Regulations:

527 CMR 5.08 (k) Hold open clips shall not be allowed on self-service dispensing nozzles.
EXCEPTION: Listed Stage II vapor recovery nozzles that will only operate when the bellows assembly is compressed into the car fill pipe and will automatically shut off if the nozzle is removed from the fill pipe

The only reason the hold open clips are on the dispensing nozzles at the service stations you mention is because the local fire inspector hasn’t found them yet. The sealer of weights and measures has nothing to do with the hold open clips, he’s only making sure a gallon is a gallon.

I don’t have the Rhode Island fire code with me, but they use the NFPA 2003 code set, and I’m 99.9% sure that hold open clips are not permitted in the NFPA codes.

[Dog80]

@wheresgeorge04

The auto shut-off valve can malfunction - I’ve seen it happen a half-dozen times or so in 5 years working at a gas station. Sometimes the fuel overflows, sometimes the nozzle is ejected.

ETM

6 times in 5 years? These are crappy nozzles then, because in my gas station I had only one nozzle fail in 25 years.

[YamatoTwinkie]

I’ve had the nozzle get ejected in the middle of filling once recently. Dunno if it wasn’t seated properly or what, but it ended up spilling a bit on the ground.

[mnemosyne]

@Tom_Tildrum

As a safety concern, I think it’s somewhat idiosyncratic to NY. Are there any other states that ban these devices?

I haven’t seen these in Ontario or Québec in years, at least a decade (and didn’t notice them when I drove through New Brunswick and PEI last spring).

[Billdo]

@Tom_Tildrum

Along perhaps the same lines, weren’t garbage disposals illegal in NY until relatively recently? I seem to recall reading that somewhere.

That used to be a prohibition in New York City (not statewide) against in-sink garbage disposals to protect the somewhat fragile City sewer system. A few years ago the City concluded based on the experience in other cities that they wouldn’t be harmful and removed the ban.

[DanBlather]

In Oregon we can’t pump our own gas.

[RaftPeople]

@Spartydog

That’s exactly the reason for disabling the locking mechanism. It has nothing to do with overflow. People leave the nozzle in the car and drive off destroying the pump and the car along with creating a fire hazard. It doesn’t happen often but once or twice a year is enough to have the owner of the filling station remove the locking mechanism.

I learned this from a gas station attendant who has seen it happen 3 times. He saw a guy in a Porsche do it. The repair bill must have been astronomical.

Our hoses have a release joint just for this situation so nothing gets damaged and gas doesn’t spill. I actually did it last year.

[Yorikke]

@Dog80

6 times in 5 years? These are crappy nozzles then, because in my gas station I had only one nozzle fail in 25 years.

Seriously? We used to use pretty standard Venturi nozzles, now we are on a Healy system, and I haven’t had any failures yet with our new pumps / nozzles. Maybe 6 times is too many - I can only now think of 3 specific instances of this type of failure, but that’s still a lot more than you’ve had…

Joe

[Richard_Pearse]

@Contrapuntal

Why is that true in his case and, presumably, no one else’s? If the clip is there, no jury rigging is required. If it isn’t there, anyone who wants to keep the pump running has to hold it himself, **or rig it some way.]/b]

I must be missing something obvious.

This. The presence of the clip means he doesn’t have to rig it by sticking his fuel cap in the handle.

I think the danger of those clips is simply that it allows someone to wander off and not monitor the transfer of a flammable liquid into their car.

[Santo_Rugger]

@Spartydog

That’s exactly the reason for disabling the locking mechanism. It has nothing to do with overflow. People leave the nozzle in the car and drive off destroying the pump and the car along with creating a fire hazard. It doesn’t happen often but once or twice a year is enough to have the owner of the filling station remove the locking mechanism.

I learned this from a gas station attendant who has seen it happen 3 times. He saw a guy in a Porsche do it. The repair bill must have been astronomical.

[del]I[/del] A friend of mine did this in [del]my[/del] his charger once. There was no damage at all to [del]my[/del] his car. Next time you pump gas, take a look at the hose. It’s got a quick release connection about six feet from the nozzle. That simply pops off. I’m not sure if it quick-connects back on, but the pump, nozzle, and hose are unharmed, also. The gas station attendant told [del]me[/del] him it happened all the time. If it was that big of a deal, 90%+ of states wouldn’t allow the “stay-on” latch. Also, the fire hazard was close to zero, and less fuel spilled than my Dakota used to leak out of the gas tank overflow when the nozzle was allowed to automatically disengage.

[Hail_Ants]

@Contrapuntal

Why is that true in his case and, presumably, no one else’s? If the clip is there, no jury rigging is required. If it isn’t there, anyone who wants to keep the pump running has to hold it himself, or rig it some way.

I must be missing something obvious.

It was just a bit of sarcasm on my part, due to:
[list=A]
[li]Some stations actually have signs saying not to do this (use your gas cap to hold it on)[/li][li]I never seem to see anyone else doing it[/li][/list]
Like I said, its just gasoline, and I hate saftey-nazis.
BTW, I’m sure glad this didn’t turn into a GD about safety!

[TheTyrant]

@Tom_Tildrum

As a safety concern, I think it’s somewhat idiosyncratic to NY. Are there any other states that ban these devices?

Along perhaps the same lines, weren’t garbage disposals illegal in NY until relatively recently? I seem to recall reading that somewhere.

When I lived in Atlanta a couple of years ago, I distinctly remember seeing “REMOVE BY 20XX” imprinted on the auto locking mechanism on gas pumps there. Honestly, I can’t recall if it was every pump at every station–but it did make me wonder if there was an impending ban or something.

(By the way, I moved from Atlanta to Manassas. Howdy, neighbor!)

[muldoonthief]

@KCB615

From 527 CMR, the Massachusetts Fire Prevention Regulations:

527 CMR 5.08 (k) Hold open clips shall not be allowed on self-service dispensing nozzles.
EXCEPTION: Listed Stage II vapor recovery nozzles that will only operate when the bellows assembly is compressed into the car fill pipe and will automatically shut off if the nozzle is removed from the fill pipe

The only reason the hold open clips are on the dispensing nozzles at the service stations you mention is because the local fire inspector hasn’t found them yet. The sealer of weights and measures has nothing to do with the hold open clips, he’s only making sure a gallon is a gallon.

I don’t have the Rhode Island fire code with me, but they use the NFPA 2003 code set, and I’m 99.9% sure that hold open clips are not permitted in the NFPA codes.

Huh. I just filled up at one of the stations today, and it definitely had the clip. No vapor recovery bellows on the nozzle either. Maybe the fire inspector is the owner’s brother or something. And I guess I foolishly expected that since the weights & measures guy actually goes to all the gas stations every year, he’d inform the fire inspector if he found something unsafe, even if that isn’t his job. I forgot they were both civil servants.

[JerseyFrank]

@Alessan

Really? Becaue the way full service works here, the attendant puts the nozzle in your car and then walks away to treat other customers or whatever. When it fills up, the pump stops and he or she moseys on back to your car to take it out and close up. I’ve never seen a pump overflow in my life.

I’ve lived in FL (self-serve) and NJ (full-service only).

In FL, I’ve had pumps overflow multiple times. I’ve had pumps with clips. I’ve had pumps without clips. I’ve had pumps that shut themselves off incorrectly. I’ve had credit card readers not work. Basically, if there’s a problem that is possible with a gas pump, I’ve probably seen it.

In NJ, I’ve NEVER seen a problem with a gas pump.

The simple answer is that if the employee is pumping the gas, there’s a big incentive for 100% functional pumps - efficiency, convenience, liability, etc… If your customers are pumping the gas the attendants don’t give a rat’s ass until the law comes down on them or their customers disappear.

[Contrapuntal]

@Hail_Ants

It was just a bit of sarcasm on my part, due to:
[list=A]
[li]Some stations actually have signs saying not to do this (use your gas cap to hold it on)[/li][li]I never seem to see anyone else doing it[/li][/list]
Like I said, its just gasoline, and I hate saftey-nazis.

Thanks.

[DanBlather]

I went to full up my scooter yesterday. I was on vapors and bought 3.00 worth. The last .25 worth spurted out the top because I didn’t notice that the gas was only $2.19 which made $3.00 too much to fit in my tank.

This has nothing to do with the thread at hand, but…

[jasonh300]

@DanBlather

In Oregon we can’t pump our own gas.

In my experience, neither can the guys who work at the stations in Oregon. I was driving a very old car through Oregon, and for some reason the filler on this car makes gas pumps kick off if you try to pump at full speed. You have to pump pretty slow or it will kick off repeatedly. The gauge was showing empty and the attendant pumped about $15.00 worth (about 8 gallons) and said it was full. He insisted my gauge was broken and refused to pump any more gas. I had to go to another gas station to get the tank filled up. It took another 18 gallons.

@DanBlather

I went to full up my scooter yesterday. I was on vapors and bought 3.00 worth. The last .25 worth spurted out the top because I didn’t notice that the gas was only $2.19 which made $3.00 too much to fit in my tank.

This has nothing to do with the thread at hand, but…

They let you pump your own gas?