# 'Homo erectus' as an insult, is it homophobic? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 18, 2014, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815 "2014-09-18T12:51:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/1 "2014-09-18T12:51:37Z")
This is a true debate I was having with my significant other. I won’t tell you which side I was on, but want your view. If you call someone a homo erectus and mean it as an insult, is it homophobic? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/2 "2014-09-18T12:56:23Z")
Homo can be used to intend a homophobic insult, and Erectus used in a sexual sense, either/or in combination or separately. Or it can just mean a caveman. The intent of the insulter and the perception of the insultee can be quite different. There’s no single answer, but usually the context let’s you know the intent. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/3 "2014-09-18T13:13:39Z")
Kinky Friedman wrote a song called “Homo Erectus.” In which \*he \*was the eponymous character, inspired by a longing for his pretty Anthropology teacher. If Kinky couldn’t make it offensive, nobody could… ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/4 "2014-09-18T13:13:54Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Homo can be used to intend a homophobic insult, and Erectus used in a sexual sense, either/or in combination or separately. Or it can just mean a caveman. The intent of the insulter and the perception of the insultee can be quite different. There’s no single answer, but usually the context let’s you know the intent. The context was as a term to mock a disagreeable person - as a substitute for the more commonly used terms ‘twatdonkey’ or ‘fucknut’, more due to the intrinsic meaning of the words than a direct reference to the genus of hominid. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/5 "2014-09-18T13:26:46Z")
I voted “no,” but my real answer is “it can be” if the speaker intends it to be. Generally, the type of person who would even use a slur like “homo erectus,” I think, would be invoking its literal meaning of pre-H. sapiens human, implying the target is less advanced/dumb/caveman-like/etc. That said, I could see teenagers or someone of that adolescent mentality glomming on to both the “homo” and “erectus” bit, and invoking the sexual associations with that. Now, as kids, we did sometime use “homo sapien(s)” as a veiled insult. It’s not literally an insult–it’s one where you can say “what? I just called you a human!” when you draw out/emphasize the “homo” part. But the allusion to “homosexual” is there. So, like most things, I don’t feel it’s quite black-and-white, though I vote with the “it’s not homophobic” crowd because, literally, it is not. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/6 "2014-09-18T13:34:18Z")
If someone called me homo erectus, my first thought would be that they were calling me a caveman. It would depend on the nature and mentality of the insulter for me to then decide if they meant it in a homophobic way. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/7 "2014-09-18T14:22:27Z")
It’s not homophobic if _I_ do it, no. Not that I would, it’s not really much of an insult, is it? Too obscure for precisely the kind of troglodyte you’d want to use it on. And I’m of the school that if someone doesn’t know they’re being insulted, there’s no real point. Can’t speak for teenagers, though. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/8 "2014-09-18T14:30:52Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > It’s not homophobic if _I_ do it, no. Not that I would, it’s not really much of an insult, is it? Too obscure for precisely the kind of troglodyte you’d want to use it on. And I’m of the school that if someone doesn’t know they’re being insulted, there’s no real point. > > Can’t speak for teenagers, though. Heh, reminds me of when I was in first year university, and a bunch of my buddies were sitting around (in a bar, natch) thinking up really obscure insults for each other (can there be any more typical undergraduate pastime? 😉 ). My contribution was to complement my friend on his “well developed sagittal crest” - silence for a beat - and then another fellow got it: “humans don’t even have them”. 😃 There were several more clever examples from others; sadly, due to encroaching decrepitude, I have forgotten them. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/9 "2014-09-18T14:46:36Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > This is a true debate I was having with my significant other. I won’t tell you which side I was on, but want your view. If you call someone a homo erectus and mean it as an insult, is it homophobic? Do they know it was meant as an insult? The speaker knows it was an insult but if their intended victim doesn’t know it, what’s the point? The speaker can feel that warm, smug feeling but the victim will just think that the speaker is an ass. Homo erectus isn’t an insult, but just as there are people who like to reassign the meaning of words to give themselves something to be offended about, I’m sure the more ignorant can and will consider the term an insult. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/10 "2014-09-18T14:50:12Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > It’s not homophobic if _I_ do it, no. Not that I would, it’s not really much of an insult, is it? Too obscure for precisely the kind of troglodyte you’d want to use it on. And I’m of the school that if someone doesn’t know they’re being insulted, there’s no real point. Indeed. There is much debate about _H. erectus_, whether it was a single species or represents several species. Lumpers and splitters once again. I think a better insult would be either _Homo rudolfensis_, _Homo ergaster_, or _Homo heidelbergensis_. 😃 It also would be an insult to binomial taxonomy to not capitalize the “H”, as in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/11 "2014-09-18T16:25:43Z")
Of all of the words in the English language, the speaker chooses to insult using “homo” as part of the phrase. Even though the phrase used has an entirely different meaning, the speaker chooses to try to be clever and insulting at the same time, while maintaining plausible deniability that they are not indeed using a homophobic slur. By choosing the term “homo” the intent is clear, that the term “homo” contains the connotation of a homophobic insult. I call foul. As a comparison, as a white person in a group of African Americans, try calling someone an “enigma” and see how it works out. Same same. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/12 "2014-09-18T16:44:34Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > As a comparison, as a white person in a group of African Americans, try calling someone an “enigma” and see how it works out. Same same. You have got to be kidding. I’m not self-censoring like that. The _Homo erectus_ thing is different because NO ONE ALIVE TODAY IS A HOMO ERECTUS!! It’s not part of the vernacular like “Neanderthal” is. There are plenty of “enigmas” walking around. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/13 "2014-09-18T17:01:23Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You have got to be kidding. I’m not self-censoring like that. > > The _Homo erectus_ thing is different because NO ONE ALIVE TODAY IS A HOMO ERECTUS!! It’s not part of the vernacular like “Neanderthal” is. > > There are plenty of “enigmas” walking around. Based on the OP, I do not believe the speaker is expecting the hearer to have any knowledge or understanding of the specifics of what Homo Erectus means, in a technical sense. I do believe the speaker is using the term as it has a “sounds like” connotation. That is the intent of my comparison. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/14 "2014-09-18T17:21:08Z")
Beavis: Heh-heh. He said “homo”. Butt-head: Huh-huh. He said “erect us”. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/15 "2014-09-18T17:55:38Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > Of all of the words in the English language, the speaker chooses to insult using “homo” as part of the phrase. Even though the phrase used has an entirely different meaning, the speaker chooses to try to be clever and insulting at the same time, while maintaining plausible deniability that they are not indeed using a homophobic slur. By choosing the term “homo” the intent is clear, that the term “homo” contains the connotation of a homophobic insult. > > I call foul. > > As a comparison, as a white person in a group of African Americans, try calling someone an “enigma” and see how it works out. Same same. If one wants to go that route, say “I have a niggling suspiciion you are niggardly”. “Enigma” is’t I think enough. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/16 "2014-09-18T20:27:48Z")
I refuse to vote, because it depends on the context and what the insulter intended it to mean. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/17 "2014-09-18T20:41:33Z")
Context dependent, IMHO, however, why would you choose that over neanderthal if there _wasn’t_ a sexual implication? ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/18 "2014-09-18T21:03:51Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > Context dependent, IMHO, however, why would you choose that over neanderthal if there _wasn’t_ a sexual implication? Obscurity. Insulting someone with a term they may not understand - most people have heard (by way of cartoons etc. at the least) of neanderthals. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2014, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/19 "2014-09-18T21:22:57Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > Based on the OP, I do not believe the speaker is expecting the hearer to have any knowledge or understanding of the specifics of what Homo Erectus means, in a technical sense. I do believe the speaker is using the term as it has a “sounds like” connotation. That is the intent of my comparison. So the insulter intends for the insultee to be insulted homophobically, with the excuse that he meant to insult his intellect, not only for being unevolved but for being ignorant, with the phallic reference tossed in on top. Man that is one good insult. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2014, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815/20 "2014-09-21T19:29:04Z")
I have nothing to say on this topic. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homo-erectus-as-an-insult-is-it-homophobic/698815.md?page=2)