# Homosex and Abort as matters of Choice **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 15, 2004, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416 "2004-10-15T17:54:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/101 "2004-10-20T16:33:30Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > Maybe so. Still, why would some _strive_ to define themselves one way or another? Whence this desire to conform to a certain label? Oh blah blah blah. You made a (dumb) thesis, now either stick with it or give up on it. Stop with this wishy-washy crap. What you’re saying it obviously true, but it doesn’t have anything to do with your OP as far as I can tell, so it doesn’t explain the ridiculous comments you made. > [@](#): > > Whatever we do in bedroom, we all are Human Beings first. Again, duh. > [@](#): > > I find politicians describing people by their sexual orientation very disturbing. Among the problems with what you’ve written here is that you’ve made it sound like politicians were the ones who started doing this. A lot of the time, people define themselves. Why? Wanting a sense of belonging, probably. Who cares? > [@](#): > > Why don’t you go fuck yourselves, Senators? Why is it the Senators who should go fuck themselves instead of YOU? They didn’t make a dumb post to this board and then pretend it was some flower-child wish that humans would accept each other as equals and stop labelling each other. You’ve made some tired claims that aren’t backed up by science. Either stick with them or don’t, but don’t act like you were saying something you obviously weren’t. Stop trying to abort your post. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/102 "2004-10-20T17:07:05Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You’ve made some tired claims that aren’t backed up by science. I thought I made it perfectly clear that I don’t want to rely on science too much, in this and other social and spiritual matters. For every ‘scientific’ argument in your favor the other side will advance a ‘scientific’ argument in their favor. There is ‘pro-gay science’ and ‘anti-gay science’. There are still countries, like Cuba, where homosexuals are persecuted strictly on ‘scientific’ grounds. When science gets mixed up in serious public issues, the final argument becomes which side has more guns. Scientists need to be left to develop better gadgets for the benefit of all of us, indiscriminately. There is higher Truth. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/103 "2004-10-20T18:01:29Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > I thought I made it perfectly clear that I don’t want to rely on science too much, in this and other social and spiritual matters. You have now. It’s to your own detriment, but oh well. > [@](#): > > For every ‘scientific’ argument in your favor the other side will advance a ‘scientific’ argument in their favor. That’s part of how science works, but that doesn’t mean it’s impossible to figure out what the truth is. > [@](#): > > When science gets mixed up in serious public issues, the final argument becomes which side has more guns. It’s unintentional I’m sure, but I don’t think I’ve ever heard a better one-sentence statement of the Bush administration philosophy. “Science should be kept out of the public discourse, but we’ll kick your ass in war, buddy!” 😛 Anyway this is a whole new brand of stupid. Science is involved in a ton of public issues today and I don’t see any of them erupting into wars. A few anti-abortion zealots have murdered doctors, but in that case the other side isn’t even shooting back. Are you trying to argue that science should be kept out of issues like stem cell research, which are purely scientific? Why do I keep asking you rhetorical questions? Obviously that’s exactly what you’re arguing, and it’s fucking moronic. Some of us are interested in science and the truth, and we want to make sure our chocies and our public policy are guided by facts. You’d obviously prefer such complications be kept out of it because they confuse you. Tough shit. Learn what you’re talking about or shut the fuck up, but don’t start with this bullshit about science causing problems. Ignoring science is what’s caused so many of our problems. > [@](#): > > Scientists need to be left to develop better gadgets for the benefit of all of us, indiscriminately. You know there are other kinds of science that do things other than developing gadgets, right? Sociology IS a science. > [@](#): > > There is higher Truth. If anything is high here, I think it’s you. You know that quote “Don’t argue with an idiot, he’ll drag you down to his level and then beat you with experience?” I didn’t realize how much experience **New Iskander** had. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/104 "2004-10-20T18:36:15Z")
Why don’t you go fuck yourself, **Marley23**? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/105 "2004-10-20T18:38:16Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > Why don’t you go fuck yourself, **Marley23**? Because I’d rather tell everybody else what a moron you are. You’ve been a big help to that end, by the way, so thanks. ---
**Author:** ![spectrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc29f/32.png) [@spectrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spectrum)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2004, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/106 "2004-10-20T18:50:34Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > Why don’t you go fuck yourself, **Marley23**? Ah, the mature way to lose a debate. Is that you, Vice President Cheney? ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/107 "2004-10-21T07:21:55Z")
> [@spectrum](#): > > Ah, the mature way to lose a debate. I apologize if I offended your sensibilities, but like to remind you that this is the Pit and not a debate forum. I opened this thread primarily to vent. There was a number of extremely interesting thoughtful contributions later on, however the license of being in the Pit allowed for too much unnecessary verbal abuse. If you want to continue this discussion as a debate you might consider doing this in GD forum. ---
**Author:** ![spectrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc29f/32.png) [@spectrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spectrum)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416/108 "2004-10-21T16:38:01Z")
In other words, you couldn’t defend your position, so you cursed out those who were smarter and more informed than you. Gotcha. You’re a real dipshit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/homosex-and-abort-as-matters-of-choice/269416.md?page=5)