I’ll give 'em points for consistency, at least. And they truly believe they’re saving people from eternal flame by pointing out to them their wicked ways will most assuredly lead them there. Why, if just one person repents and is saved from Hell, isn’t it worth it?
:rolleyes:
I’m ever so glad these people are the overwhelming minority of this religion.
Esprix
I know a pseudo-Fundamentalist who basically believes the same thing, people who have homosexual relations and don’t ask for forgiveness before dying to to Hell, but I think she would be pissed as hell if she saw that site. She’s something of a hypocrite, but at least she doesn’t use her beliefs to stir up hate…in fact, she keeps quiet about them because she lost too many gay friends over that issue.
I personally don’t think there is an afterlife, but I can’t see an omniscient, omnipotent God punishing people for being homosexuals if there was one. Of course, I personally don’t believe God cares too much about humanity one way or the other, but even if he did, I don’t think he’d care that much about who we fucked, as long as nobody was hurt.
The scary scenario is that the God of the fundamentalists is real, there really is a seriously disturbed, petty, and jealous man in the sky who is exactly as he is described in the Bible. In that case, me and almost everyone I know are screwed.
No authority except from God? Does that even include Hitler?
(Both a legitimate question and the obligatory Great Debate reference to Hitler)
Free will? Do you really think that anyone is homosexual is because of will? Assuming you are hetrosexual, did you decide to be attracted to the opposite sex or is it a part of your being? Do you really believe that you could change your sexuality if you chose? I know I couldn’t.
I did not choose to be homosexual.
No, these people are very, very wrong and they are evil. The Bible has been used to justify all manner of evil. Let’s not forget that the Bible was not written by the Hand of God, it was written by the hand of man.
[/QUOTE]
Free will? Do you really think that anyone is homosexual is because of will? Assuming you are hetrosexual, did you decide to be attracted to the opposite sex or is it a part of your being? Do you really believe that you could change your sexuality if you chose? I know I couldn’t.
I did not choose to be homosexual.
[QUOTE]
*
Yes DrMatrix, I do believe it’s a choice, and many people believe that way too! As far as being attracted to someone, I think women are beutiful, and I do notice them, so there is an attraction, but I choose to be with a man cause to me it’s the way it should be and I wouldn’t have it any other way! That doesn’t mean I wouldn’t be friends with a homosexual, it just means I think it’s wrong. If I didn’t think it was wrong, Yes, I would be able to be with another woman. So I guess I can choose, and be very happy with my choice.
Nobody with a working understanding of science or human sexuality believes “that way” too, exclamation point notwithstanding.
There are differences between:
Thinking that women are beautiful and being sexually attracted to women;
Noticing women and being sexually attracted to women;
“Choosing” to have sex with a woman (as a woman) (or not) and being sexually attracted to women.
I’m straight as a gate, and I wouldn’t have it any other way, either. But then that’s circular reasoning, isn’t it? I like it, so I wouldn’t change it, and I wouldn’t change it because I like it. I don’t presume to know “the way it should be” for other people, though; I only speak for myself.
If you think it’s wrong, why would you be friends with a homosexual? Isn’t that kind of hypocritical of you?
Well, then maybe your orientation is more bisexual than straight. Because I don’t think lesbianism is wrong and I could never be with a woman and enjoy myself. Not my bag.
That’s just you, then, isn’t it? Although you apparently “choose” to be straight, you are delusional if you think that homosexuals – many of whom are more honest about their sexual orientation than you apparently are – choose to be gay. They may be happy as larks to be gay, but they didn’t choose to be.
With all respect, and no offense meant, JerseyDiamond, I’m not sure any homosexual would want to be friends with you. It’s not easy to enjoy the company of someone who thinks you’re going to burn in agony for the rest of eternity based your sexual orientation.
matt_mcl, my darling, correct this quote for me and credit it, won’t you, dear?
“Disagreeing with homosexuality is like disagreeing with rain.”
Esprix
I started a very serious response to Jersey Diamond on the old “is it a choice” question. But actually, the proof should be on the person making an assertion. If you believe that, Jersey, kindly muster your evidence and demonstrate to all of us who listen to our gay brothers and sisters saying that it is not and never was a choice for them that we should believe differently.
Allow me to note that for a few people, gay sexuality is a choice: bisexual people can choose to express or suppress the gay side of their orientation. However, we are not talking about them. I look forward to reading your response.
Just as a casual reminder, I made a post on Scriptural references to homosexuality on page one of this thread, asking for your comments, that you either overlooked along with my first reminder about it or have seen fit to ignore.
Slight correction to my previous post: the question and reminder were on this thread: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=56330
Thanks.
People don’t choose to be gay.
Ask the kids who get thrown out, the adults ostracized by their families, the parents who have their kids taken away.
Or, better yet, ask people who have participated in the “ex-gay” movement. Many of them go on to become ex-ex-gays. Recently, several spokespeople for that movement have denounced it, asserting their homosexuality.
Now, I realize that numbers don’t really mean much in a lot of contexts. However, when virtually every single gay person swears up and down that it’s not a choice… well, I’m inclined to believe them.
Hey, I didn’t choose. I tried to change. It didn’t work. This led me to believe that there either wasn’t a God, something that I find not to be true, or that God made me who I am. It works for me.
Me, too! I’ll even say there are some women I find more attractive than some men. I don’t decide what is attractive to me and I find it hard to believe that anyone can decide what is attractive and what is not. I would be untrue to my nature if I tried to have a relationship with a woman. I’ve known gay men who have married women. It is almost always a Very Bad Idea.
Boy thats an arrogant statement. Last I heard, people who understand science were still trying to figure out whether they can prove that it’s not a choice.
You always say your a christian, right? Are you saying GOD cant presume to know the way it should be? The bible says it’s wrong.
How is it hypocritical to be friends with somebody who does something you think is wrong? Jesus ate and hung around with sinners. Does that make him a hypocrite?
two men or two women having sex together is a sin. Telling a lie is a sin. a man and a woman who are not married having sex is a sin. Does that mean you can’t be friends with anybody who sins, otherwise you’re a hypocrite?
DrMatrix and Andygirl,
I don’t know what to say. I believe that it is not a physiological quality that makes you homosexual. Maybe not so much a choice as the result of things that happen in your early life, the same way some people are scared of heights and some people love brussel sprouts. Neither one of those things are genetic or medical, even though they may not be a conscious “choice.” Things happen to people, and those things and their timing shape who you will be and what you will be like. I think being homosexual is like that.
I’m sorry I used a bad choice of words.
Anyway, this got blown way out of proportion. I didn’t want to make anybody mad or offend anybody, and I guess I did. so I’m sorry to all of you guys if I came across mean.
I don’t think the world is divided into ‘straight’ and ‘homosexual’. I think some people’s preferences lean so much towards one gender that they couldn’t be attracted to the other, even under the most extreme circumstances, and in those cases I believe there is no choice, but I think most people are less extreme, and they choose, either because they prefer one over the other, or because of the way they were raised, or for practical considerations, and some people don’t choose, and some people change their choice.
JerseyDiamond and the other Christians on the board who follow this line of thought, why does God (the J/C/I version) believe that homosexuality is a sin?
It’s been pointed out in other threads, homosexuality harms no one, it’s simply two people of the same sex enjoying each other physically. Procreation isn’t possible thru homosexual sex, but then, that’s not the point of it; the point is about close, physical intimacy with another person. To say that sex is for procreation implies that every time you have sex you MUST have offspring from that union or else your sinning.
So, why is homosexuality so bad other than “because God said so!” ??
So, you’re saying that homosexual orientation is beyond one’s control, so then how can you stand by your earlier
statement that homosexuality is a sin? Because the bible says so? The Bible also forbids eating shellfish and wearing poly-cotton blends. Because it doesn’t lead to procreation? Well, I have family members in heterosexual marriages who have sex, but don’t beget kids each time; are they also sinners?
And if you really think being gay is a choice, then when did you decide to become heterosexual? If you don’t like gay sex, then I recommend that you avoid having it.
laughing at goboy’s sig…where’d you find it.
Okay, first off, I hope for his sake that Fred Phelps never tries to picket a funeral my dad happens to be directing. (Dad’s an undertaker). My dad would have his ass booted out of there before you could say JackAss.
Another thing, JerseyDiamond-what’s it to you, anyways? Why do you even CARE if people are having sex with someone of the same sex? Does it really MATTER, or affect you? Does it hurt you? I doubt it, so why do you care?
Seriously, what gives? I don’t see why people waste their time thinking about other people’s lives.
I got my current sig from a line said by David Spade on Just Shoot Me.
I think I’ve come up with a metaphor to illustrate the opinion of JerseyDiamond and others on the choice issue. I was going to put it here, but it got a little long, and I started a new thread.
I think the key here is to remember that this is a VERY big book. Saying that you believe in EVERYTHING it had to say is quite a bold statement.
For instance you are saying you believe that people used to live to be hundreds of years old, not to mention all the tribal Israeli laws that the OT has.
Some say they only believe in the NT. If so, fine. Then STOP quoting the OT! (You know, the old “Man shall not lay with man as he lays with woman for it is an abomination”).
If you choose to include the OT in your faith, then include ALL of it. And interprit it consistantly.
This last part is what people like the idiots at http://www.godhatesfags.com leave out. They only see what they want to see in the Bible, and let’s admit that it IS a bit vague to say the least 
So, I think the only question is one that has already been posted here. What do YOU think? That’s the only thing that matters when you’re talking about faith and not facts.
— G. Raven