# Honest arguments for Trump **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 22, 2024, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576 "2024-09-22T03:21:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/21 "2024-09-22T13:39:42Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Are you, though? > > The OP pretty much poisons the well, and predictably in just the 14 posts so far this thread has already become yet another bashing Trump and his supporters thread. Yes, I am absolutely. What you have done is interpret “honest” to mean something like “neutral”, missing the point of my query entirely, which is: Trump is so clearly and egregiously heinous, so cartoonishly awful as to defy belief, so completely beyond the pale in his every aspect of being, that it is beyond my limited imagining, and outside my experience that a reasonably intelligent, of how one could make an honest argument in his favor. Doesn’t mean one does not exist I just haven’t seen it nor can I imagine it so if you can Please share! so come on down if you can and share it with me anywhere making an argument in his favor that does not make some kind of dishonest claim that he is not who he plainly is. to me. It does not seem possible, but maybe it is. . ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/22 "2024-09-22T13:53:31Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > IMO any _honest_ argument for trump cannot possibly be an argument for trump _qua_ trump. Instead, it’s an argument based on the fatcat / country club ballot. Your first sentence is probably correct, but there might be other options for the second. One of my relatives believes our two-party duopoly will ultimately destroy the country, as politicians work more and more in service of their corporate backers rather than citizens. He hates Trump as much as anyone, but believes he could be a “poison-pill” that destroys at least one of the two parties, with the hope that better alternatives will arise. I don’t agree with his arguments, but at least they are understandable. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/23 "2024-09-22T13:54:51Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > making an argument in his favor that does not make some kind of dishonest claim that he is not who he plainly is. This is the problem: who trump is. _Who he is_ is right there in plain sight. ---
**Author:** ![Dinoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de0a6/32.png) [@Dinoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinoguy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/24 "2024-09-22T14:00:33Z")
To me, it’s about money and power. You want money and power? Vote Republican, just ignore the obvious and vote for him anyway. I don’t trust the orange menace, I didn’t like him when I first heard about him some 30-odd years ago. He reminded me of my then boss, a man full of bluff and bluster who liked to throw his weight around. But i’m a native Texan and I know my people, good and bad. We like guns and dead cows. Go figure. Woopie ty yi yea, (fill ibn the blanks) ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/25 "2024-09-22T14:09:09Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Are you, though? > > The OP pretty much poisons the well, and predictably in just the 14 posts so far this thread has already become yet another bashing Trump and his supporters thread. Yes, I am absolutely. What you have done is interpret “honest” to mean something like “neutral”, missing the point of my query entirely, which is: Trump is so clearly and egregiously heinous, so cartoonishly awful, so completely beyond the pale in his every aspect of being, that it defies belief. I am not being extreme or hyperbolic in my language, **he** is extreme and hyperbolic in his very existence! Perhaps not if he was Joe Nobody, aka Just Another Asshole, but that’s not the case is it? His hideousness is as large as his presence and his ambition, I am not about to pretend otherwise. Anyone who does is being exactly what I don’t want anyone to be, which is **dishonest**. Precisely _because_ that is true, it is beyond my limited imagining and outside my experience that a reasonably intelligent person can make a reasonable argument in his favor without bashing the people they are making it to, and without being dishonest about who he is or how completely insane it is that such a sick excuse for a person was _ever_ president, much less that he might be president again! Can you look at him, see him, know that he is what he is and still argue in his favor? You don’t have to hate him. You don’t have to be as repulsed by him as many of us are, but you have to see him for what he really is. That is not a sly way of saying “hey let’s all get together and bash Trump” at all. I was as transparent, as clear, as I could possibly be about how I viewed him, about my personal limitations and that’s what this is. I can’t pretend that I can imagine it. If you can, please share it with us! Because I may have to deal with him as a president again and maybe that will help my despair. Given the way I view him now I need something. And my two examples of what honest arguments could be are not a bash either and I did admit they were rude, but they represent the understanding I have come to after much struggling to wrap my head around how anyone at all could vote for him, but especially how intelligent, educated people who are not in anyway deluded about who he is could do so. ---
**Author:** ![ThisOneGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@ThisOneGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisOneGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/26 "2024-09-22T14:09:55Z")
Agree this isn’t a place where you can really meaningfully have this discussion. But, as a non-liberal, non-democrat maybe I have a better idea than most? > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I’d say the other “argument for Trump” is Dems telling everyone the economy is great when people are not feeling it is great. I think this is a big one. Per government inflation calculators there has been 22% inflation since 2020. I’ve had about 6% raises. This leaves me 15% behind. I was/am doing fine, but somebody who was struggling before is really in trouble now. The “stupids” being referred to by “It’s the economy, stupid” who think the president controls the economy could easily think that it is all Biden/Harris’s fault. The way the left often unsubtly pushes for greater equality often comes as attacks. I’m constantly being told that everything bad in the world is my fault because I have the temerity, the sheer unmitigated gall, to be a white man. Why I don’t even have the simple decency to be poor! A person could easily view the Democrats as the enemy because of this. Of course, both of these are reasons to not vote for Harris, not reasons to vote for Trump. I’m afraid his appeal, whatever it is, doesn’t work on me either, so I can’t really explain it. But voting is **very** tribal in America. “me and my family have always voted Republican/Democrat” and I will always vote that way without thinking about it is common. This combines with LSLGuy’s five ballots explains where there is a base 30% or so who will vote for the R regardless. But why so many really want Trump and just Trump? I don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/27 "2024-09-22T14:12:24Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > This is the problem: who trump is. > > _Who he is_ is right there in plain sight. Yup. And his supporters like him because he get’s away with everything. Well, until that idiot put himself under a microscope. He’s still getting away with shit while the regular person would already be serving their prison time. Hundreds are because of Trump. 1. They also like him because he will make them rich. 2. ??? 3. Be rich. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/28 "2024-09-22T14:15:12Z")
I don’t know how this happened, but my last two replies should only be the last reply, which is much longer. The first one is shorter, but also disjointed and semi nonsensical. How do I get a moderator to kill it? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/29 "2024-09-22T14:18:56Z")
At least half of all voters don’t consider rational arguments for or against a candidate. The reason they’ll vote for a candidate is “I like _Candidate_, that’s why I’m voting for them, don’t expect a meaningful answer if you ask me why, and I don’t care what you say about them.” ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/30 "2024-09-22T14:39:09Z")
The well isn’t just poisoned it’s acid and on fire. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/31 "2024-09-22T14:41:00Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > The first one is shorter, but also disjointed and semi nonsensical. How do I get a moderator to kill it? Just click the three-dot icon on the bottom right, then click on the flag icon. That way, you can report your own post to the moderators — just let them know it was a duplicate post. If you’re on a laptop/desktop, rather than a smartphone, you may be able to see the flag icon straightaway. Unsure about that. In any event, the answer to your question is to “report your own post to the moderators.” ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/32 "2024-09-22T14:45:11Z")
Single issue voters have plenty of honest arguments for Trump. If you think abortion is the worst thing ever or your right to own guns trumps children’s right to live, or ironically both things at once which is the norm. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/33 "2024-09-22T15:02:19Z")
> [@ThisOneGuy](#): > > I’m constantly being told that everything bad in the world is my fault because I have the temerity, the sheer unmitigated gall, to be a white man. Can you provide a few cites for this from a non-whack job source? Since it’s a constant barrage, should be easy. ---
**Author:** ![ThisOneGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@ThisOneGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisOneGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/34 "2024-09-22T15:30:16Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > Can you provide a few cites for this from a non-whack job source? Since it’s a constant barrage, should be easy. It’s never directly stated like that (except as you note by wackjobs). It is more of a low level, understated tone. Any non-white, non-man will be described as “brave” or “important” for achieving anything at all (“I tied my own shoes”). Anything I might accomplish can, and will, be dismissed as the result of some nebulous “privilege”. Carefully kept nebulous lest it become clear the person I’m oppressing with my malevolent continuing to exist has just as much of the same privilege. Again, this isn’t 100% of the left. The more intelligent and articulate tend to avoid it. But many of the less well spoken often come across as “all white men are evil”. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/35 "2024-09-22T15:31:48Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > so come on down if you can and share it with me anywhere making an argument in his favor that does not make some kind of dishonest claim that he is not who he plainly is. to me. It does not seem possible, but maybe it is. . I don’t support Trump, so I can’t offer any personally held arguments in his favor. I have people in my life who have voted for Trump and I know intend to do so again. They’ve told me why and I’ve told them why I disagree. There are people on this board who believe I should denounce them and cut them out of my life, but . . . nah. There’s one Trump supporter I’ve stepped away from because ALL he can talk about is Trump, but I’d have the same reaction if all he ever talked about was Harris or horses or anime. I just don’t think there’s any useful discussion to be had on this board about “honest arguments” for Trump. There are too many posters with knives drawn salivating at the opportunity to jump on anyone advancing such an argument. And not just to rebut the argument with logic and facts, but to declare the believer evil or at the very least evil-adjacent. I’m not even necessarily criticizing, that’s just where this board is politically. I sometimes envision being a Trump-supporter posting on this board and can only imagine making a post and immediately seeing a dozen posters’ icons popping up in the “replying. . .” field. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/36 "2024-09-22T15:34:03Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Single issue voters have plenty of honest arguments for Trump. If you think abortion is the worst thing ever or your right to own guns trumps children’s right to live, or ironically both things at once which is the norm. But once again, those arguments aren’t for voting for trump _as trump_. Those are arguments for voting for [whoever] R because you think R = anti-abortion pro-gun and D = pro-abortion anti-gun. The assumption of those voters is (mostly) that trump himself doesn’t matter and his personal shortcomings or superpowers will be immaterial to the Rs trying to deliver the policies they always try to deliver. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/37 "2024-09-22T15:45:51Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The assumption of those voters is (mostly) that trump himself doesn’t matter and his personal shortcomings or superpowers will be immaterial to the Rs trying to deliver the policies they always try to deliver. Or that he is more likely to win than any other choice. He did get the second most votes in any election ever. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/38 "2024-09-22T15:46:01Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > I feel despairing and afraid. Since I am a macho white guy, I can’t admit to feelings like those; but hate and anger are always okay. Trump gives me an arena to experience triumphant vengeance with my thousands of brothers. I love him for that. What about Trump supporters who are neither white, guys, or particularly macho? 52% of white women voted for Trump in 2016. If the only people who voted for Trump were macho white guys, he would lose in a landslide of historic proportions. ---
**Author:** ![Mallard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Mallard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mallard)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/39 "2024-09-22T16:04:33Z")
IMHO, there is no argument “for” Trump. He’s a convicted criminal who attempted a coup to overthrow a duly elected government. ---
**Author:** ![HoneyBadgerDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honeybadgerdc/32/1033_2.png) [@HoneyBadgerDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoneyBadgerDC)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2024, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576/40 "2024-09-22T16:07:42Z")
One of the few things I like about Trump is that he does seem to comprehend the gravity of war. I don’t get this feeling from a lot of politicians. Another thing is that he doesn’t cave into the media when it comes to discussing rivals. he knows he may have to negotiate with them one day and is smart enough not to poison the well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honest-arguments-for-trump/1007576.md?page=3)