# Honorable Republicans - are you out there? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 22, 2005, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691 "2005-07-22T19:02:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/21 "2005-07-22T20:29:28Z")
I liked it better before the two parties started the whole time-share thing. Republicans used to stand for economic freedom, and Democrats used to stand for personal freedom. It was all very simple. It was easy to discern which dick was up your ass at a given time. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/22 "2005-07-22T20:31:48Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > …So what do you call that down there in Texas?.. Piddlin’. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/23 "2005-07-22T20:34:21Z")
> [@](#): > > 1. Rove apparently was informed that Plame was a CIA worker by a media personage earlier. > > 2. The “leak” occurred in a call from the media person to Rove, and they brought up the story anyway. > > 3. Plame is not a covert and will not become a covert operative. In any case, Rove only mentioned AFAIK that she had helped select her own husband to go on a fact-finding mission. This is not exactly top secret, and Rove had no reason to think it was. > > Seriously, there never was any story here. It’s just another manufactured media frenzy. > > That said, I don’t like everything Bush has done, but the media and certain sections of the left have gone bananas in recent years. They constantly make the wildest accusations. Even the most ordinary doings (and not just at the White House or Conservatives in general) have been blown into ridiculous media “scoops”. Was it the media that was locking people up over this? Because I’m sure it will be a comfort to Judith Miller to hear there was no crime involved. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/24 "2005-07-22T20:35:58Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You mean other than having the lowest rating of any governor _ever_? Even worse than Gray Davis? Is anybody talking about recalling Schwarzenegger? Ugh, can you imagine how many times we’ll hear bad ‘Total Recall’ jokes if that happens? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/25 "2005-07-22T20:40:36Z")
The “sabotage” story was bullshit. The GAO found only the normal damage and petty theft that occurs in any workplace and which was normal for any White house transition. There was a practical joke in which some staffers removed the “W’s” from computer keyboards. There was no huge rash of vandalism and theft. The story was a harbinger of the viciousness and dishonesty which are the signature characteristics of this White House. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/26 "2005-07-22T20:43:50Z")
To which “this” are you referring? If you’re going to toss out terms like “viciousness” and “dishonesty” about politics, you’re going to have to be very specific. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/27 "2005-07-22T20:44:28Z")
> [@](#): > > The “leak” occurred in a call from the media person to Rove, and they brought up the story anyway. That’s not what the reporters are saying. They’re saying that Rove was not just _confirming_ Plame’s covert status (and she WAS covert. Try not to get your news from Sean Hannity) but was the original source for it. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/28 "2005-07-22T20:47:01Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > To which “this” are you referring? If you’re going to toss out terms like “viciousness” and “dishonesty” about politics, you’re going to have to be very specific. “This” as in the _present_ administration. The Bush II White house. All administrations are dishonest, it’s true, but this one has raised the bar about seven stories. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/29 "2005-07-22T20:48:50Z")
> [@L'il Nemo](#): > > …Plame is not a covert and will not become a covert operative… Jeez, no matter what you do, the dead talking point rises from the grave to feast on the gullible. Drag it out into the sunlight, pound a stake through its heart, chop off its head, fill its mouth with garlic, bury it at the crossroads with a silver dime and some johnny conkeroo…and yet they rise. This “point” has been clobbered, creamed, reamed and disembowled. Its rung down the curtain and joined the Choir Invisible. This is a steaming load. Hamsters have labored mightlily to bring you the cites, the arguments, the proofs that this is pure-D ass-whistle. Balderdash, sir! Tommyrot! ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/30 "2005-07-22T20:49:15Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > “This” as in the _present_ administration. The Bush II White house. All administrations are dishonest, it’s true, but this one has raised the bar about seven stories. I hope you’re not afraid of heights. The bar seems to get higher with each new round of [del]suckers[/del] voters. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/31 "2005-07-22T20:51:31Z")
And even if it was brought up by the reporter in question, Rove should never have confirmed it. Just because it’s “out there anyway” doesn’t make it right. Good lord, I am bored to death with the whole excuse that “Dems did it first!” Does that make it alright, suddenly? All I hear from Republicans is how much better their party is. If that’s the case, then why, every time someone is caught doing something wrong, do they descend to that stupid excuse? If this administration is so much better, why are they doing the exact same things they’re accusing Democratic administrations of doing? Case in point: > [@](#): > > And this particular item has been true for more than a hundred years. Democrat politicians are just as guilty as Republicans of instigating unnecessary wars. Well, don’t you want your party to be the one to do somewhat _better_? Don’t I hear all the time about how much more moral and decent the people in the Republican party are? “They did it toooooooo!” Really doesn’t make you seem all that superior. I apologize for hijacking, but DAMN this stupid fucking excuse is just tapdancing on my last nerve. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/32 "2005-07-22T20:54:06Z")
**luc** … **nemo** didn’t post that. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/33 "2005-07-22T20:59:03Z")
> [@smiling bandit](#): > > 1. Rove apparently was informed that Plame was a CIA worker by a media personage earlier. The memorandum that reported the secret status on Plame was send to the White House on July 6, Novak contacted Ari Fleischer on the 7th, Novak then talks to Rove on the 9th. Novak then spilled the Beans on Plame on the 14th. > [@](#): > > 1. The “leak” occurred in a call from the media person to Rove, and they brought up the story anyway. The latest reports show contradictions on the testimony, meaning that it is more likely that perjury is the crime here. > [@](#): > > 1. Plame is not a covert and will not become a covert operative. In any case, Rove only mentioned AFAIK that she had helped select her own husband to go on a fact-finding mission. This is not exactly top secret, and Rove had no reason to think it was. This is one of the most silly talking points ever, if She helped select her husband (and reports are showing she did not) how can you say that she was not important? Most likely, her seemingly mundane CIA work was not the only work she was doing. The latest report on the memo circulated on Air force one shows that Plame status was deemed a secret, now the investigation is focused on who had access to that memo. > [@](#): > > Seriously, there never was any story here. It’s just another manufactured media frenzy. The media (confirmed here not to be liberal) was in bed with the administration on the way to war, what I see here is a conspiracy from the government and the Washington media to keep the status quo of the corporate media to continue getting scoops that are really propaganda. > [@](#): > > That said, I don’t like everything Bush has done, but the media and certain sections of the left have gone bananas in recent years. They constantly make the wildest accusations. Even the most ordinary doings (and not just at the White House or Conservatives in general) have been blown into ridiculous media “scoops”. Proportion will never enter your mind horizon, just check the Clinton scandals to really see ordinary doings (yes, some were bad but not as serious a the ones at hand) being blown into ridiculous levels by the media. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/34 "2005-07-22T21:05:25Z")
Shhheeee-it! Sorry 'bout that, **Nemo**! It’s embarassing to be misidentified, I understand full well, like when some airhead hottie starts in with “Oh, Mr. Crowe, I just loved _Gladiator_…” Abject apology tendered. To the matter, this tidbit of news. Not huge, just more of the same… [http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050722/ap\_on\_go\_ca\_st\_pe/cia\_leak\_democrats](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050722/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/cia_leak_democrats) **Ex-CIA Officers Rip Bush Over Rove Leak** “Former U.S. intelligence officers criticized President Bush on Friday for not disciplining Karl Rove in connection with the leak of the name of a CIA officer, saying Bush’s lack of action has jeopardized national security. …” yadda blah yadda blah, and then this… "…Johnson, who said he is a registered Republican, said he wished a GOP lawmaker would have the courage to stand up and “call the ugly dog the ugly dog.” “Where are these men and women with any integrity to speak out against this?” Johnson asked. “I expect better behavior out of Republicans.”…" ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/35 "2005-07-22T21:06:02Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > We’ve been thru this one before. > > The [GAO report](http://english.people.com.cnn/200206/13/eng20020613_9755.shtml) found that So what do you call that down there in Texas? > > Regards, > Shodan That’s nice. Perhaps you should win a cookie. Moving on: do you care to respond to the gestalt of the OP? ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/36 "2005-07-22T22:12:04Z")
> [@Slacker](#): > > For the record, I’m not a Democrat. I’m not really anything. I’m Chris. I’m a progressive Christian that thinks are going way off in the wrong direction in this country. Why do you hate America, Slacker? ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/37 "2005-07-22T22:16:44Z")
> [@HPL](#): > > Why do you hate America, Slacker? It’s the smell… ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/38 "2005-07-22T22:19:00Z")
You know for all the problems I have with Air America and Janeane Garofalo… her soudbite about Republicans has stuck with me. “If you’re a Republican… you’re either dumb… or you’re cruel.” I see the problem as the fringes of the Republicans are the ones in power but the mainline party is sitting idly by and letting them wreck the house that Abe built. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/39 "2005-07-22T22:20:36Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > It’s the smell… …if there is such a thing. I feel saturated by it. I can taste your stink. And every time I do I feel I have somehow been infected by it. It’s repulsive. I must get out of here. (ahem) ---
**Author:** ![Slacker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6bbea6/32.png) [@Slacker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slacker)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2005, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691/40 "2005-07-22T22:23:13Z")
> [@HPL](#): > > Why do you hate America, Slacker? Not a day goes by I don’t ask myself that same question. ☹ So do we have any official takers yet? **Shodan** and **smiling bandit** , do you guys (or gals) consider yourselves good people and support this administration? Can you explain it to the rest of us? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/honorable-republicans-are-you-out-there/313691.md?page=3)