# Houston police beating **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2011, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096 "2011-02-04T00:34:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/21 "2011-02-04T19:07:30Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > You are full of shit. “Justification for this action?” You sure searched hard enough for justification for a trigger happy SWAT team murdering an innocent man didnt you. > > But then, you never really believed all that shit you were spouting in the other thread did you, you just picked a contrary position and ran with it for shits and giggles. > > Cops cant give into those impulses? I guess its ok to give into the impulse to shoot everybody in the house when serving a warrant, but not to take out frustrations on an actual criminal? You fucking hypocrite. > > (To clarify, no, I dont believe the cops were justified here, its just that Brickies double standards are giving me hives) Yeah, it is obvious. If you don’t see police wrongdoing in **every** situation, you are a hypocrite if you see it in **any** situation. From the SWAT team story, I thought there were serious questions about the police action. But this is, apparently, a much more open and shut case. You don’t have to be a jackboot wearing law and order authoritarian to see that the two situations may be a tad different. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/22 "2011-02-04T19:09:56Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > But see, that’s the whole reason the DA and the judge did not want the tape released yet. It’s prejudiced my mind This reminds me of a Rodrigues cartoon showing a news broadcast that has close-up footage of a screaming gunman firing point-blank into his victim’s forehead, with an arrow pointing to him reading “alleged assassin.” ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/23 "2011-02-04T19:20:07Z")
Oh believe me, I don’t see how it could be anything else. But where do you draw the line in saying what’s to be allowed? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/24 "2011-02-04T19:45:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t see, not can I imagine, any justification for this action. I’m sure, as **Cheesesteak** posits, that it was anger and frustration… but cops can’t give in to those impulses. This appears me to be criminal assault, and I expect the cops to be convicted. To be fair, it did happen in Alief, so the level of thuggery and ignorance was probably elevated compared to the rest of Houston. I wonder if there’s a group-think type of thing that goes on with cops in situations like this- they ALL came running and just jumped on that guy and started beating the piss out of him without probably even knowing why. It’s like one guy makes a bad decision, and 4-5 others just follow suit assuming the first guy knew what he was doing. Up here in Dallas, there was a similar case- some guy was being chased by the cops, and was refusing to pull over, and would slow down like he was going to stop and then take off at full speed, repeatedly. When he did finally pull over or crash (can’t remember which), the cops did the same thing- came running and beat the piss out of him. Makes me wonder if there’s more to it than just dickhead cops beating some guy down. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/25 "2011-02-04T20:57:41Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > You are full of shit. “Justification for this action?” You sure searched hard enough for justification for a trigger happy SWAT team murdering an innocent man didnt you. > > But then, you never really believed all that shit you were spouting in the other thread did you, you just picked a contrary position and ran with it for shits and giggles. > > Cops cant give into those impulses? I guess its ok to give into the impulse to shoot everybody in the house when serving a warrant, but not to take out frustrations on an actual criminal? You fucking hypocrite. > > (To clarify, no, I dont believe the cops were justified here, its just that Brickies double standards are giving me hives) You’re an idiot. The issue is whether a crime was committed. In the SWAT thread, the actions were not criminal. Here, they appear to be. It has nothing to do with “searching for justification.” And under your bizarre theory, why would I also not adopt a contrary position in this thread? No, no. In both threads, I answered - correctly - the question of whether the actions of the police were criminal. And I am confident that in both cases, the judicial system will bear me out. The SWAT cops will not be convicted of any crimes; the cops in this instance will be. So my analysis has the benefit of being validated, at least to some extent, by the judicial system. Your analysis, in contrast, is conducted with all the acuity of a monkey in the zoo that hasn’t quite mastered flinging its own shit at passers-by, and manages only to cover itself in its own excrement. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/26 "2011-02-04T21:15:38Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The issue is whether a crime was committed. In the SWAT thread, the actions were not criminal. Here, they appear to be. It has nothing to do with “searching for justification.” There’s a difference between whether something is criminal and whether a DA chooses to prosecute. In the SWAT scenario, the DA chose not to prosecute. I’m not sure if we resolved whether the actions of the police were illegal but that’s irrelevant to whether the actions were justified and whether we can be outraged by them. I can be outraged by completely legal things like businesses skating by using tax loopholes and completely not outraged by illegal things like jaywalking. Likewise, I can be completely outraged by actions that I do not know are legal or illegal such as a trigger happy SWAT team member gunning down a homeowner with no provocation or a group of police officers kicking the shit out of a suspect when their actions haven’t yet reached a criminal court. I’d really really really like to believe both are illegal, but, you know, I’ll still be pissed either way the law comes down. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/27 "2011-02-04T21:36:43Z")
It’s interesting that we’re seeing more and more cases of this happening. My take is that it is happening at the same rate as before; it’s just now there is video surveillance everywhere, and more people with video cameras and cell phones. In the past, complaints against police where just a matter of the officers’ words against a suspects. So the complaints were ignored. What we’re finding out is that assault is often simply “business as usual” for some police agencies and officers. This[case in Kelowna](http://www.theprovince.com/news/Assault+charge+recommended+just+before+Kelowna+protest+over+alleged+police+brutality/4117824/story.html) and the [recent one in Vancouver](http://www.vancouversun.com/life/Vancouver+police+constable+charged+after+disabled+woman+pushed+ground/3941743/story.html) As well as the [G20 police assaults in Toronto](http://www.thestar.com/news/torontog20summit/article/932020--police-officer-charged-with-second-assault-at-g20) would never have gone forward without video evidence. A disturbing trend is for the police to confiscate video cameras or cell phones after people have video’ed them beating on civilians. This is a very common tactic, and once done, it is very hard for people to get their property back. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/28 "2011-02-04T21:40:28Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > What we’re finding out is that assault is often simply “business as usual” for some police agencies and officers. Another police Pit thread, another braindead generalization. All is as usual on the SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/29 "2011-02-04T22:03:51Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Another police Pit thread, another braindead generalization. > > All is as usual on the SDMB. I’m sorry you feel that way **Hamlet** , but it is true that for **SOME** police, giving a suspect a beat-down really is business as usual. I’m hopeful that with increased video capturing the police, these bad officers will finally be weeded out of the system. For example, [Const. Geoff Mantler](http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2011/01/11/bc-kelowna-rcmp-kick.html), who booted a suspect full in the face as he was on his knees. This is the same Constable who [already had a complaint filed against him](http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2011/01/21/16973906.html) earlier, for punching a guy repeatedly in the head for legally repossessing his own boat. It seems that for Const. Mantler, punching suspects in the head or booting them in the face was simply how he went about his job. I put the word **SOME** in caps and bold for you **Hamlet** , as you seem to have some reading comprehension issues. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/30 "2011-02-04T22:09:04Z")
Reading comprehension issues is the least of **Hamlet’s** problems. He appears to have a cop’s dick up his ass and he’s loving it. He can’t get enough. This makes it hard for him to concentrate and utilize the higher functions of his brain as evidenced by his drive by post above. Back to the camera issues. Yes, if it wasn’t for them we would never know what some of these cops were up to, and we would see even fewer legal repercussions for them. Of course, they see this, they know, and so they have reacted to this. Many states have began outlawing the videotaping of officers while on duty in public places. There’s no reason why this would be done OTHER than to prevent bad cops from being filmed doing bad things. They like the status quo, and we’ll take that away from them from their cold dead hands. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/31 "2011-02-04T22:11:56Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Another police Pit thread, another braindead generalization. > > All is as usual on the SDMB. I know. It really is sad that the 95% of police officers that are thugs go around giving the rest of them a bad name. But what can you do? You lay down with pigs, you can’t hold it against people who complain about the stink. ---
**Author:** ![quedefuk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/48db29/32.png) [@quedefuk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quedefuk)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/32 "2011-02-05T00:08:25Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > Near Houston resident here. We’ve heard about the tape for 10 months now. I knew it was going to be bad but still was shocked by the violence, especially by the guy doing all the kicking. As mentioned, despite him being agitated by the circumstances of the chase, he went way too far and appears to be guilty of criminal assualt. > > But see, that’s the whole reason the DA and the judge did not want the tape released yet. It’s prejudiced my mind and will do the same for the entire jury pool available here. I think it’s an important distinction that they sought to merely delay the release until after the officer had received a fair trial. Quanell X knew that, yet released a copy as soon as a tiny break in the tape custody became available. He claims a defense of “this needed to be seen”, yet that falls flat because it would have been _after_ a fair trial was held. How often do police not release video they obtain that shows a criminal in the act? I’m sure they maintain the same high standards they apply to themselves in order not to prejudice the jury pool, right? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/33 "2011-02-05T01:05:12Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > I know. It really is sad that the 95% of police officers that are thugs go around giving the rest of them a bad name. But what can you do? You lay down with pigs, you can’t hold it against people who complain about the stink. I’m hoping I’m about to just be whooshed, but otherwise that’s really not fair. I dare say most police officers are good people. Certainly in my experience they have been. The police officers in the OP’s link need to be jailed more than the assault victim, and the SWAT cops from the other thread are murdering assholes who deserve whatever unfortunate events karma sends their way. However they don’t make up 95% of cops. Most cops are just people trying to get by while dealing with the shittiest parts of a shitty world. ---
**Author:** ![Kilmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a6a055/32.png) [@Kilmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kilmore)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/34 "2011-02-05T01:43:35Z")
Those keystones probably did that kid a huge favor by the way. I guess we don’t have to worry about him burglarizing anymore since he’s probably going to be a millionaire now. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/35 "2011-02-05T01:56:11Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > I’m hoping I’m about to just be whooshed, but otherwise that’s really not fair. > > I dare say most police officers are good people. Certainly in my experience they have been. The police officers in the OP’s link need to be jailed more than the assault victim, and the SWAT cops from the other thread are murdering assholes who deserve whatever unfortunate events karma sends their way. > > However they don’t make up 95% of cops. Most cops are just people trying to get by while dealing with the shittiest parts of a shitty world. What percentage of the Houston police are protesting what happened to the kid? How many Houston police refuse to serve alongside the accused? Could you please define “good police” for me? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/36 "2011-02-05T02:31:11Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What percentage of the Houston police are protesting what happened to the kid? What would be a protest action for you? I agree official actions of the department as a whole have not gone far enough. > **[Caught on Tape: Houston Teen Beaten By Police](https://abcnews.go.com/US/caught-tape-teen-beaten-houston-police/story?id=12834297&page=2)** > > Surveillance video is released of Houston teen Chad Holley being kicked, punched and stomped by several police officers in 2010. > [@](#): > > After the video was given to the police department last year, eight police officers were suspended without pay. Following separate investigations by the department’s Internal Affairs Division and the Harris County District Attorney’s Office, four officers – Andrew Blomberg, Phil Bryan, Raad Hassan and Drew Ryser – were indicted on misdemeanor official suppression charges and fired from the police department. Hassan and Bryan were also charged with violation of the civil rights of a prisoner. > > Three other officers were fired, but not charged, and another five were suspended for two days. It’s a terrible video. The kid should being checked over for injuries, not mauled by these thugs. There should be felony assault charges. > [@](#): > > How many Houston police refuse to serve alongside the accused? The accused were rightly fired and are facing charges. They should be facing much worse charges I agree, but your question is nonsensical because the accused aren’t serving with anyone. > [@](#): > > Could you please define “good police” for me? Oh you know damn well what it means. It means police who don’t abuse their positions, or commit assault like these jackasses did. Are you claiming 95% do? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/37 "2011-02-05T02:42:59Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > Oh you know damn well what it means. It means police who don’t abuse their positions, or commit assault like these jackasses did. Are you claiming 95% do? Are you claiming that most of Houston’s bad police just happened to be at that location at that specific time? Would a “good cop” stand by and watch? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/38 "2011-02-05T02:56:04Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Are you claiming that most of Houston’s bad police just happened to be at that location at that specific time? Would a “good cop” stand by and watch? I live in Michigan. Since when am I the expert on Houston police? What is your position? You seem to be of the opinion that 95% of cops are thugs. Let’s say Houston cops are thugs, over 95% of cops are not Houston cops. If 95% of cops are thugs why aren’t videos like this way more common? There’s cameras everywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/39 "2011-02-05T03:00:59Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > I live in Michigan. Since when am I the expert on Houston police? What is your position? You seem to be of the opinion that 95% of cops are thugs. No, but I _am_ of the opinion that one of us likes put words in other people’s mouths. Thank you for verifying my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2011, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096/40 "2011-02-05T03:26:15Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > I know. It really is sad that the 95% of police officers that are thugs go around giving the rest of them a bad name I chuckled. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/houston-police-beating/570096.md?page=3)