# How acceptable would the Lord's Prayer be to non-Christians? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 6, 2011, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420 "2011-02-06T18:38:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/1 "2011-02-06T18:38:36Z")
There are slightly different variations in various Christian faiths, but here’s how the Episcopal Book of Common Prayer puts it: ``` *Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us, and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever and ever. Amen.* ``` Christ isn’t specifically mentioned, obviously. Would those of other faiths be comfortable in reciting it, were it not for its New Testament origins as the supposed words of Christ himself? Which faiths would, for various reasons, not be likely to recite or adopt it? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/2 "2011-02-06T18:49:37Z")
Delete “father” and I can think of no reason why it would be unacceptable for Muslims, indeed it is similar to parts of the Quran. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/3 "2011-02-06T18:53:54Z")
I’ve been told by jewish friends of mine that they are often uncomfortable with it due to its christian roots and association with past forced conversion and forced prayer. This has come up in lots of AA meetings where the Lord’s prayer had often been a closing prayer. More and more AA meetings are dropping it, and closing with the serenity prayer instead, often even omitting the word “God” from that particular prayer, or leaving it up to individual choice. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/4 "2011-02-06T19:17:11Z")
How acceptable would it be to take a well known Moslem prayer and use it? How acceptable would it be to take a prayer associated with Judaism and use it? When I was growing up my church added the doxology to the Lord’s Prayer and yet the version used in our public schools did not. I was afraid that I would go to hell if I did not say it, and stand out among the predominantly Roman Catholic kids if I did. Prayer in public gatherings where there will be a mix of people from different faiths and people free from faith is dickish bullying. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/5 "2011-02-06T19:20:44Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Delete “father” and I can think of no reason why it would be unacceptable for Muslims, indeed it is similar to parts of the Quran. Really? You think that people sensitive to being colonized and persecuted by Christian countries for centuries might think it’s hunky dory to use a prayer associated with Christianity? ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/6 "2011-02-06T19:22:22Z")
Would you be ok with this in a Christian church? _In the name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds. The Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. Owner of the Day of Judgement. Thee alone we worship; Thee alone we ask for help. Show us the straight path… The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the path of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray._ ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/7 "2011-02-06T20:56:57Z")
Read the OP, people. “…were it not for its New Testament origins as the supposed words of Christ himself?” Were it NOT for its origins… And yes, I think the Lord’s prayer is doctrinally unobjectionable for Jews and Muslims, but the blessing from the Quran may have some problems for some Christian sects (specifically, not everyone accepts a Judgement Day, and Catholics have a strong tradition of intercessory prayer to saints). ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/8 "2011-02-06T21:01:38Z")
> [@Nametag](#): > > Read the OP, people. “…were it not for its New Testament origins as the supposed words of Christ himself?” Were it NOT for its origins… And yes, I think the Lord’s prayer is doctrinally unobjectionable for Jews and Muslims, but the blessing from the Quran may have some problems for some Christian sects (specifically, not everyone accepts a Judgement Day, and Catholics have a strong tradition of intercessory prayer to saints). Do Muslims accept prayer that is not found in the text of the Quran? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/9 "2011-02-06T21:07:51Z")
Well, speaking as a Buddhist, no, it’s unacceptable. Speaking as an atheist, well, ditto. heaven, father, worship, sin, more bowing and scraping, nope, just not acceptable at all. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/10 "2011-02-06T22:04:26Z")
> [@Desert\_Nomad](#): > > Would you be ok with this in a Christian church? > _In the name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. > Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds. > The Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful. > Owner of the Day of Judgement. > Thee alone we worship; Thee alone we ask for help. > Show us the straight path… > The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the path of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray._ Well, seeing as everything else is already translated into English, we may as well go the rest of the way and translate the one remaining Arabic word into English as well: _In the name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful._ - Praise be to God, Lord of the Worlds.\* - The Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful.\* - Owner of the Day of Judgement.\* - Thee alone we worship; Thee alone we ask for help.\* - Show us the straight path…\* - The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the path of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.\* Yeah, sounds pretty good. ---
**Author:** ![Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8edcca/32.png) [@Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superfluous_Parentheses)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/11 "2011-02-06T22:05:08Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Speaking as an atheist, well, ditto. > > heaven, father, worship, sin, more bowing and scraping, nope, just not acceptable at all. Ditto. And it wouldn’t be acceptable “if not for the origin” either; it would just make a lot less sense. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_the\_Immortal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Max\_the\_Immortal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_the_Immortal)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/12 "2011-02-06T22:28:05Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Speaking as an atheist, well, ditto. > > heaven, father, worship, sin, more bowing and scraping, nope, just not acceptable at all. Not to mention “kingdom”. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/13 "2011-02-06T22:33:22Z")
An atheist is a non-Christian, although certainly not a “faith.” To an atheist, each and every line is either offensive or nonsense and reflects a reverent belief in a fictional character. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/14 "2011-02-06T22:35:31Z")
How about Roger Zelazny’s agnostic prayer, used by one of the characters in _Creatures of Light and Darkness_: > [@](#): > > Insofar as I may be heard by anything, which may or may not care what I say, I ask, if it matters, that you be forgiven for anything you may have done or failed to do which requires forgiveness. Conversely, if not forgiveness but something else may be required to insure any possible benefit for which you may be eligible after the destruction of your body, I ask that this, whatever it may be, be granted or withheld, as the case may be, in such a manner as to insure your receiving said benefit. I ask this in my capacity as your elected intermediary between yourself and that which may not be yourself, but which may have an interest in the matter of your receiving as much as it is possible for you to receive of this thing, and which may in some way be influenced by this ceremony. Amen. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2011, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/15 "2011-02-06T22:35:43Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > Well, seeing as everything else is already translated into English, we may as well go the rest of the way and translate the one remaining Arabic word into English as well: > _In the name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful._ > > - Praise be to God, Lord of the Worlds.\* > - The Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful.\* > - Owner of the Day of Judgement.\* > - Thee alone we worship; Thee alone we ask for help.\* > - Show us the straight path…\* > - The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the path of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.\* > Yeah, sounds pretty good. Yeah, people, “Allah” just means “God.” There are places where Christians gladly address “God” as “Allah.” So yeah, it’d be kind of strange to take a pre-written prayer from another tradition (I mean, if you don’t find the existing prayers sufficient, wouldn’t you just write your own) but if it expresses what you mean to express and doesn’t directly go against your religion, I can’t see any real objection. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/16 "2011-02-07T00:06:12Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > There are slightly different variations in various Christian faiths, but here’s how the Episcopal Book of Common Prayer puts it: > > ``` > *Our Father who art in heaven, > hallowed be thy name. > Thy kingdom come. > Thy will be done > on earth as it is in heaven. > Give us this day our daily bread, > and forgive us our trespasses, > as we forgive those who trespass against us, > and lead us not into temptation, > but deliver us from evil. > For thine is the kingdom, > and the power, and the glory, > for ever and ever. Amen.* > > ``` > > Christ isn’t specifically mentioned, obviously. Would those of other faiths be comfortable in reciting it, were it not for its New Testament origins as the supposed words of Christ himself? Which faiths would, for various reasons, not be likely to recite or adopt it? Non-Christian Unitarian. Let’s see. We can start with issue with gender - assuming God is male and patriarchal. Issue with assuming its my role to fulfill “God’s Will” or that God has the power to forgive me (only I, and those I have offended have that power - God is non-personified in my worldview). And keeps going. i.e. its meaningless drivel with a cultural burden and offensive assumptions on the nature of God. It does have value to me as tradition and history, but only when framed in context and NOT as a prayer. A lot of Unitarians would be comfortable with it, however - which is sort of the nature of being UU - you get to decide for yourself. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/17 "2011-02-07T00:17:53Z")
As an atheist I find the entire prayer unacceptable and would not say it. I’d also be highly offended if it was said at a event like a graduation or non-religious meeting and probally get up and leave. I also find the Serenity Prayer equally unacceptable. ---
**Author:** ![AshenLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/94ad74/32.png) [@AshenLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AshenLady)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/18 "2011-02-07T00:23:19Z")
Islamic tales from the Koran is the only religion that is politically correct, so take your Lord’s prayer and put it in a place where the sun don’t shine. ---
**Author:** ![Yodalicious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yodalicious/32/8195_2.png) [@Yodalicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yodalicious)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/19 "2011-02-07T00:36:51Z")
My wife was raised Catholic, I was raised Jewish; we had a rabbi and a priest officiate our wedding. When The Lord’s Prayer was recited most of the older folks on my side, my parent’s age and up, said it along with my wife’s side of the family. I found out later that they had learned it at Synagogue, back in the 40s and 50s. Back in the 70s and early 80s, when I still went to Temple, God was often refereed to as “Father.” ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420/20 "2011-02-07T01:55:05Z")
It would be about as acceptable as Boca Burgers to a non-vegetarian. Some would take a polite nibble, most would not. Why would you want to dumb it down for non-believers? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-acceptable-would-the-lords-prayer-be-to-non-christians/570420.md?page=2)