# How are the Clinton hating dems feeling now? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 25, 2022, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862 "2022-06-25T22:15:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/481 "2023-04-13T16:38:34Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > That’s bothsidism, How’s this for bothsidism: at least when a Trumpist stabs you, they do it from the front? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/482 "2023-04-13T16:39:45Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > What signs would you expect to see other than reports in the media? Far more pressure a larger number of Democrats so that other than occasional reports of dissatisfaction she does resign. She won’t even step down from the judiciary committee, she just wants a temporary replacement yet she can’t even travel to DC to participate now. It shouldn’t have to be done publicly either, the right people could talk to her now and find a way to close this out. This is very late in the game for the pressure to just be at the ‘increasing’ stage. If the party can’t stand to criticize itself over it’s ability to successfully fend off the judgeship rigging, jerrymandering, and voter restricting Republicans then the situation will not improve. We are supposed to be the adults in the room. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/483 "2023-04-13T16:50:14Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > You are saying that storming the Capitol to keep Trump in power is the same as not forcing her to resign. Nowhere did I say that. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > No, that would be an extremely stupid strawman to build. Not a straw man, exactly the question that needs to be answered. Do you think the Democratic party is effective? We can’t count on the Republicans to shoot themselves in the foot. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > It’s going to be harder for them to fail when you are aiming at your own side. And you do exactly that when you claim that not forcing a rep to resign is the same as claiming election fraud stole the presidency from Trump. Nothing improves if we can’t even identify failures. Feinstein is certainly not the only drag on the party, but her situation has come to the forefront and how the party deals with it is important. Democrats were willing to pressure Al Franken to resign over bad jokes, shouldn’t we be working harder to get someone to resign when she can’t even go to work anymore? She’s not going to get magically healthier. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/484 "2023-04-13T16:50:57Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > It shouldn’t have to be done publicly either, the right people could talk to her now and find a way to close this out. And how do you know it’s not? Your complaint is that you don’t see enough public pressure, but suggest that they use pressure in private, do you see how that doesn’t actually make any sense? What is it that you actually want them to do? If she doesn’t want to resign, how do you propose they _make_ her? > [@TriPolar](#): > > If the party can’t stand to criticize itself over it’s ability to successfully fend off the judgeship rigging, jerrymandering, and voter restricting Republicans then the situation will not improve. Her not stepping down from the committee and her seat is what is causing “judgeship rigging, jerrymandering, and voter restricting”? > [@TriPolar](#): > > We are supposed to be the adults in the room. We are, agreed. Which is why it is silly to concentrate your ire at Feinstein and the Democrats who have not somehow forced her to resign, rather than at those actually doing the judgeship rigging, jerrymandering, and voter restricting. Your concentrating on Feinstein is exactly the sort of distraction they love to take advantage of. While you are calling for a circular firing squad, they are calling in an airstrike. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/485 "2023-04-13T16:59:22Z")
@TriPolar you could just admit that you went a bit far with your statement that _“The cult of personality is as much of a cancer on the Democratic party as it is to the Republicans”_. That is bothsidism, and is not really a statement that can be defended, hence why you haven’t tried. Your other points I agree with: Democrats in general are far too soft, both in terms of calling out right-wing lies and hypocrisy, and in getting rid of people who don’t have any fight left in them. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/486 "2023-04-13T17:10:23Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > @TriPolar you could just admit that you went a bit far with your statement that _“The cult of personality is as much of a cancer on the Democratic party as it is to the Republicans”_. I don’t know why you see my statement that way but I do not mean that the MAGAism and people defending Feinstein are the same thing, or that it is a cancer that has metastasized in the Democratic party the way it has in the Republican party. We can identify the problem and treat it. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/487 "2023-04-13T17:11:28Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Your other points I agree with: Democrats in general are far too soft, both in terms of calling out right-wing lies and hypocrisy, and in getting rid of people who don’t have any fight left in them. Yes. And that doesn’t mean we need to employ the tactics of the other side to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/488 "2023-04-13T17:14:46Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Your concentrating on Feinstein is exactly the sort of distraction they love to take advantage of. While you are calling for a circular firing squad, they are calling in an airstrike. They’re calling in an airstrike, and your big complaint is that we’re being mean for pointing out that the people in charge of our air defense are asleep at the wheel. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/489 "2023-04-13T17:17:04Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Really, it’s the same people? Exactly the same people? [Yes, the very same people.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-diane-feinstein-resign-from-the-senate-she-has-missed-some-60-of-80-votes-this-year/982629/18) ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/490 "2023-04-13T17:19:52Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Nowhere did I say that. > [@TriPolar](#): > > The cult of personality is as much of a cancer on the Democratic party as it is to the Republicans. The cult of personality of the Republicans caused Jan 6th. You are claiming that the cult of personality of the Democrats is keeping her in office. So, are you saying that it _is_ as much a cancer on the Democratic party, as you just said? If so, then you are making the equivalence between her staying in office and attempts at keeping Trump in office. Do you want to clarify what you meant by your statement, if you are now saying that they are _not_ the same? > [@TriPolar](#): > > Not a straw man, exactly the question that needs to be answered. Do you think the Democratic party is effective? Your earlier question _was_ a strawman, as the Democrats have been effective for the two years that they had power. Less than I’d like them to have been, but that’s due to people like Sinema or Manchin, one of whom is no longer a Democrat, and the other that barely is. Now that they don’t have the house, their effectiveness is substantially lower, but that’s not Feinstein’s fault. That’s the fault of voters who believed the message that both sides are the same, as well as the fault of those who keep sending that message. > [@TriPolar](#): > > We can’t count on the Republicans to shoot themselves in the foot. I mean, they do, but that somehow makes them into martyrs. > [@TriPolar](#): > > Nothing improves if we can’t even identify failures. Feinstein is certainly not the only drag on the party, but her situation has come to the forefront and how the party deals with it is important. I’d say that if the party does anything more than suggest that she step aside, then we’ve failed. Finding a way to force her out is extremely anti-democratic, she was voted into office. If I were one of her constituents and she was forced out by the Democrats, I’d have a hard time voting for her replacement. > [@TriPolar](#): > > Democrats were willing to pressure Al Franken to resign over bad jokes, That’s a bad example, as I think the Democrats overreacted in pressuring him out, and I think that he gave in to that pressure too easily. That was the sort of knee jerk reaction that I personally find to be one of the biggest faults of Democrats. > [@TriPolar](#): > > shouldn’t we be working harder to get someone to resign when she can’t even go to work anymore? What, specifically, do you mean by working harder? I’m sure that they could probably work with the Republicans to expel her, is that what you mean? If not, what exactly do you think the Democrats should do to force her out? > [@TriPolar](#): > > She’s not going to get magically healthier. You never know. My grandmother bounced back at 92 from cancer and lived another 6 years. She was active and fully competent until the end. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/491 "2023-04-13T17:28:47Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > What, specifically, do you mean by working harder? This, too, I wonder about. Is it some sort of combination of magic words, phrases, and actions that will produce a desired result? Because that smacks of sovereign citizen lunacy. Or perhaps some kind of decision by fiat via back office politicking? Because that sounds more than a little anti-democratic for somebody duly elected by the citizens of her state ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/492 "2023-04-13T17:29:02Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > They’re calling in an airstrike, and your big complaint is that we’re being mean for pointing out that the people in charge of our air defense are asleep at the wheel. Hmmm, no, that’s not even close. One of my complaints is that those on supposedly my side keep making shit up and misrepresenting what is said, just like you did in this post. I didn’t say _anything_ about “being mean.” And no one is pointing out anything like them being asleep behind the wheel. They are pointing at one person who is suffering health issues and thinks that they should be forced out for it. If she were replaced with a perfectly healthy 25 year old, they would be no more effective in that position. I don’t get it, why do you do that? Do you really think that lying helps? > [@TriPolar](#): > > Yes, the very same people. Hmmm, your cite doesn’t back up your claim. > [@TriPolar](#): > > I don’t know why you see my statement that way but I do not mean that the MAGAism and people defending Feinstein are the same thing, or that it is a cancer that has metastasized in the Democratic party the way it has in the Republican party. Okay, so you do _not_ think that “_The cult of personality is as much of a cancer on the Democratic party as it is to the Republicans_” Glad you cleared that up. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/493 "2023-04-13T17:41:27Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Hmmm, no, that’s not even close. One of my complaints is that those on supposedly my side keep making shit up and misrepresenting what is said, just like you did in this post. I didn’t say _anything_ about “being mean.” I misrepresented nothing. You’re pitching a fit because people aren’t being properly deferential to a useless lump of a senator. Correctly characterizing your tantrum in this thread isn’t dishonest, it’s just unflattering. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/494 "2023-04-13T18:20:55Z")
I’d kind of like to see Al Franken move to California, then have Feinstein retire and Governor Newsom appoint Franken to serve out her term. And as long as I’m dreaming, I’d like a pony, and for the Dope to adopt standardized spelling of _bothsidesism_ and _gerrymandering_. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/495 "2023-04-13T19:15:19Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Your earlier question _was_ a strawman, as the Democrats have been effective for the two years that they had power. Effective at what? Doing something about gun violence? Enforcing voting rights? Protecting reproductive rights? How about keeping Republicans who hate this country out of office? I’m only pointing at Feinstein because she’s in the news right now. I’m perfectly fine with going over each and every Democrat in office and evaluating them on their effectiveness. I think an awful lot of them will look bad but at least be alive long enough to learn and get better. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/496 "2023-04-14T01:10:49Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Doing something about gun violence? > > [@TriPolar](#): > > Enforcing voting rights? > > [@TriPolar](#): > > Protecting reproductive rights? > You didn’t ask, but also… > When Democrats get control they do the things you want them to do. You’re too busy nursing your Clinton hate boner to help us out with that. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/497 "2023-04-14T02:30:13Z")
Great stuff about Whitmer and Michigan. Couldn’t find a senator could you? Why don’t you hate the people who brought Trump upon us? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/498 "2023-04-14T02:35:09Z")
What do you think I’m doing, dipshit? ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/499 "2023-04-14T03:15:15Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Why don’t you hate the people who brought Trump upon us? The Americans that voted him into office? (And will again if given that choice?) ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862/500 "2023-04-14T03:37:54Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > You’re too busy nursing your Clinton hate boner to help us out with that. …I don’t have a _“Clinton hate boner”_, and what you’ve posted here doesn’t mean a lot, to be honest. Because New York has a Democrat for Mayor, and a Democrat for Governor, and they are both pro-police, anti-bail reform, slashing budgets for social programmes, they are an absolute shit-show for Black and marginalised communities that live there. There is no nationwide democrat _strategy_ at play here. Nothing. Zero. Zilch. No strategy to combat abortion roll-backs. No strategy to protect trans people. No strategy to retake the courts. No unified mission or vision. You are increasingly seeing the increased irrelevance of the Federal government. You are on the path to Balkanization, where it will be up to individual states to provide protection to its people, where people escaping from one-state-to-another becomes a very real thing. **This** is what your cite is showing. Feinstein is just emblematic of this. Judges should _absolutely_ be a priority for the Democrats right now. They should be ruthless here. This is entirely within their control. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-are-the-clinton-hating-dems-feeling-now/966862.md?page=26)