# How Can 59,054,087 People Be So Dumb? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 4, 2004, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995 "2004-11-04T17:09:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Hamish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a5b964/32.png) [@Hamish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamish)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/141 "2004-11-04T23:37:29Z")
I think we’ve all forgotten the important thing – is **gobear** planning to run for the American presidency on the Democrat ticket? Come on, **gobear**! You could be your country’s first homosexual president since Eleanor Roosevelt 😃 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/142 "2004-11-04T23:49:15Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > Because reasoned, intellectual discourse doesn’t appeal to them. And if you present things in a manner of respectful deference, they aren’t even remotely interested. The fun part is that this applies to both sides of the aisle. 😃 **gobear** for President! ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/143 "2004-11-04T23:55:50Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Don’t get me wrong – I’m not sitting here choking back tears at you lumping me in with 59,054,086 other people that you call dumb. But that attack is symptomatic of what drove me crazy these past five years here on the board: that if a political view doesn’t match yours, it’s dumb. It’s NOT, necessarily. It is different. Calling it dumb is both wrong and a practical error in strategy, as has been demonstrated. I started a thread about this, **Bricker** , which was nonpartisan. I said in my OP (among other things) that Bush isn’t an idiot. I was branded as a Bush apologist and the thread turned into a Bush-bashing thread. No _wonder_ so many Republicans don’t want to post here. I have some very liberal friends and some very conservative friends. Considerably to the left and right of my own views. You know what? None of them are idiots. None of them are dumb because they voted differently that I did. I don’t vote a straight party line, because I don’t like the way the Republicans want to interfere in my private life and I don’t like the way the Democrats want to climb in my wallet. But all of my friends who disagree with me are still intelligent people who just happen to disagree (I tend not to make friends with idiots). With some exceptions (your “HAHAHAHAHA” post was a real turn-off), most of the demeaning, nasty, “you’re all idiots and fools” messages I’ve seen on this board have been from the anti-Bush crowd. Is _that_ any reason to call the liberals “the smart guys, the intelligentsia, the progressive, sensitive, New Age, enlightened party”? Judging from this thread, it’s more like the intolerant party. ---
**Author:** ![laigle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@laigle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/laigle)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/144 "2004-11-04T23:56:41Z")
Come on Diogenes. A LOT more than 60 million people are that stupid. Those just happen to be the ones who made it to the polls. ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/145 "2004-11-05T00:03:00Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > [Stevens](http://www.oyez.org/oyez/resource/legal_entity/101/) is almost 85. > > [Ginsberg](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=5454909) is 71. She’s the “maybe 4th”. I am in no way saying that you feel this way John, but what is really sad is that there are many Republicans out there licking their lips and anticipating the death of these justices (or a debilitating health condition that forces retirement) so they can appoint the judges from their side. There is almost a glee being expressed by many Republicans that they will have this opportunity to appoint judges, that they are overlooking the fact that bad things must happen to a person to make it a reality (at least most of the time). I hope everyone of the justices live on and that they wheel Rehnquist in there on a respirator to spite all of the people that feel that way. As for those who are not acting like vultures and are simply discussing likely political reality, I must agree that Bush will likely get 2-4 appointments. However, I find it sickening that people are celebrating the demise of other people simply to advance thier own political agendas. And, BTW… were not Supreme Court Justices supposed to be apolitical? Designed to interpret the law, not values? Have we gotten so far away from that idea that any candidate (Dem or Rep) will only look at their politics and not their ability to interpret and argue law? ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/146 "2004-11-05T00:27:51Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The fun part is that this applies to both sides of the aisle. 😃 Ah, but **silenus** , I only have those near me in real life as a sample and I _do_ live on the buckle of the bible belt. I have very few friends that would identify as even Democratic-_leaning_, let alone full-blown liberal (… tree hugging, hippies – like me). So, most folks fall into the other category. And I know it happens on both sides, I’m definitely not pointing fingers, but IMlimitedE, I only have had negative results with the latter mentioned. No matter how hard I try to agree to disagree, or see things from their point of view, or talk it through, I get nothing but vehement tongue lashings, recriminations of being evil or unGodly, or despite any evidence to the contrary, pure disdain for any facts or logic. I desperately want us all to be equal (cue the hold-hands music!) and united, that’s why I’m trying to understand other mindsets and behave accordingly. But I can’t do that if I don’t get any advice on how to combat the problems mentioned above. What do I DO? I’m drowning here! [P.S. Again, the characterization I mention, _only_ pertains to those I know IRL. Members of this message board are far too intelligent for me to assume that I could offer anything in the way of ‘something they hadn’t already thought of.’ Therefore, _I_ read to learn. Not so that I can pass judgement on difficult times. Like after the election. On both sides.] ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/147 "2004-11-05T00:49:04Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Was it just me, or did anyone else think the _Mirror_ was scraping the bottom of the barrel drumming up anti-Bush quotes? This is a paper whose editor and stocks writers collaborated to “boost” stocks they held for personal gain, and yet the editor was not sacked. The editor in question eventually lost his job for publishing fake photos showing British Abu Ghraib-style abuses. They don’t just scrape the bottom of the barrel, they scour it. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/148 "2004-11-05T02:50:44Z")
> [@Legolamb](#): > > Yeah, pretty much. > Even if you don’t take into account the Iraq war, you have to remember that, even without a Labour government, we in the UK are significantly to the left politically of the US and that France and the rest of western Europe are even further to the left of us. The prospect of another four years of the so-called “leader of the free world” being that right-wing is pretty scary. Given the enormous divide politically between Bush and Europe, maybe it’s time he was deposed as “leader of the free world.” Surely you have some articulate leader over there who could give voice to European opposition to Dubya and his gut-driven policies. Dubya and his neocon puppeteers need to be made to FEEL the limitations of their powers. As an American, I just don’t feel Dubya deserves to lead the world. He’s not a leader worthy of us, I don’t care what my countryment think. They have sold their souls for a pittance. Don’t you do the same. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/149 "2004-11-05T10:23:41Z")
> [@Dead Badger](#): > > I’ve not met anyone here in London who’s pleased Bush was re-elected. Most, however, can see that the alternative wasn’t exactly stellar. No-one’s particularly surprised. > > That said, the Mirror is a godawful pile of shite not fit for wrapping fish and chips. The best thing I can say of it is that if I were given the choice of reading the Mirror or the Daily Mail, I would beat myself to death with the Mirror to avoid reading either. 😛 That about nails it. The Mirror was once a ‘thinking’ tabloid, in some senses. It’s always tried to carry news but every time it does, circulation falls. The Mail is just a right wing rag dedicated to telling inflammatory lies about immigration. Neither are proper newspapers. ---
**Author:** ![Go\_You\_Big\_Red\_Fire\_Engine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/eada6e/32.png) [@Go\_You\_Big\_Red\_Fire\_Engine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_You_Big_Red_Fire_Engine)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/150 "2004-11-05T10:41:07Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > My did lives on France. He was saying Europe thinks we’re fucking nuts. Any intl dopers want to shed some light? Yes, we do think you’re nuts. But I knew it was going to happen. A lot of people were like “No, Kerry will win” to which I replied, “you have too much faith in the nation of America. These are the people that brought you Everybody Loves Raymond, they can’t be that bright.” Not to say us Australian are brighter, we elected Mini Bush. The world shakes it’s head. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/151 "2004-11-05T10:42:52Z")
I like this one: [http://www.arabnews.com/cartoon/2004/11/05.jpg](http://www.arabnews.com/cartoon/2004/11/05.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/152 "2004-11-05T10:52:37Z")
Surely this is a misrepresentation. After all, GWB had to vote Bush surely. And his wife and mum and dad and all the kin. Why should they be lumped in with others? After all blood is thicker than stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/153 "2004-11-05T10:55:20Z")
> [@Go You...](#): > > These are the people that brought you Everybody Loves Raymond, they can’t be that bright. I shudder to imagine what you think of Cecil, whose message board brought the world December and Reeder. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/154 "2004-11-05T11:19:37Z")
> [@Dead Badger](#): > > This is a paper whose editor and stocks writers collaborated to “boost” stocks they held for personal gain, and yet the editor was not sacked. The editor in question eventually lost his job for publishing fake photos showing British Abu Ghraib-style abuses. They don’t just scrape the bottom of the barrel, they scour it. And the killer is, there are at least 3 tabloids in the UK that make the Mirror seem like The London Times edited by Jesus Christ and George Washington. And these are what most people in the UK treat as newspapers. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/155 "2004-11-05T12:57:05Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I shudder to imagine what you think of Cecil, whose message board brought the world December and Reeder. Where has **Reeder** been anyway? I just realized I haven’t seen anything lately. ---
**Author:** ![cedric45](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d07c76/32.png) [@cedric45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cedric45)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/156 "2004-11-05T13:30:21Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > You were wrong on monday, you were wrong on wednesday and you will still be wrong on saturday. Just because there’s more of you doesn’t mean you’re right. Wrong again **DtC.** It’s been a long time since I studied physiology but it is a well known fact that the majority of people in a given group are sane (although the minimum size of the group **is** a factor.) Just because you believe a certain thing doesn’t mean you’re right either. How can I/we take you seriously when, by your own admission, you live in a place surrounded by camo wearing gun nuts that scare you to death but you don’t have sense enough to move somewhere else? Maybe somewhere warmer? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/157 "2004-11-05T13:44:48Z")
> [@cedric45](#): > > How can I/we take you seriously when, by your own admission, you live in a place surrounded by camo wearing gun nuts that scare you to death but you don’t have sense enough to move somewhere else? Maybe somewhere warmer? :rolleyes: I just figured it out. He’s a masochist and wants to stay close to his beloved Vikings. See you guys next weekend. 😉😃😛 ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/158 "2004-11-05T13:47:07Z")
> [@cedric45](#): > > Wrong again **DtC.** It’s been a long time since I studied physiology but it is a well known fact that the majority of people in a given group are sane (although the minimum size of the group **is** a factor.) Just because you believe a certain thing doesn’t mean you’re right either. Sanity =/= being right. Many Republican voters were quite sane. They were also quite [wrong](http://www.pipa.org/). ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/159 "2004-11-05T14:05:14Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Where has **Reeder** been anyway? I just realized I haven’t seen anything lately. Self-immolated? Either that or halfway to Canada? ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995/160 "2004-11-05T14:36:50Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > Self-immolated? Either that or halfway to Canada? Right after I posted that, I thought maybe he had a meltdown and got himself banned. Then I searched his threads and saw he’s still active. My next thought was he swallowed the pistol, but 1) I’d feel really fucking bad if something actually did happen to him, or 2) he’s taking stock and avoiding the outside world for a bit to cool off so he doesn’t get banned after returning for the first 4 seconds. Or he’s having trouble typing with the straight-jacket so tightly tied. I think he’s taking this harder than anyone in the known world and I don’t want to gloat, well, to him. But I really am curious what happened. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-59-054-087-people-be-so-dumb/272995.md?page=9)