# How can someone screw up so much and still have a nontrivial support base? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 20, 2012, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293 "2012-09-20T18:04:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/21 "2012-09-20T20:53:59Z")
Consider the [Rassmussen daily tracking poll](http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2008/2008_presidential_election/general_election_match_up_history). In 2008, five months before election day, the day Hillary Clinton formally dropped out of the race, Obama led McCain by seven points. During the next five months of continuing charges that Obama was a Kenyan-Muslim-socialist, McCain picks Palin, Obama picks Biden, the October financial meltdown and bailout package, the debates, and on and on. . . After all that, on election day, Obama won by 6 points. Which means after all that, the polls only changed by ONE POINT – which is, in public opinion research terms, not at all! ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/22 "2012-09-20T22:06:01Z")
> [@MDKSquared](#): > > It really makes me wonder what it takes to actually outright lose a Presidency when you can pretty much botch everything up and still come out with a decent shot. How do we, as a society, teach people to acknowledge the merits of evidence? How can people look at all these obvious mistakes and bend over backwards/undergo countless mental gymnastics to justify them? Most of Romney’s critics have been preemptively discredited. The people speaking against him are the mainstream media, ivory-tower academics, Hollywood liberal elites, layabout students, etc. And you know how those people are, don’t you? And when the occasional Republican says something, he can be singled out from the herd with “that doesn’t sound like the X I know.” It’s rather a brilliant strategy, really. Gain your audience’s trust by marginalizing and dismissing those who disagree with them. They are beyond untrustworthy. When they criticize Romney it probably reinforces his stature to some people. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/23 "2012-09-20T22:39:56Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Consider the [Rassmussen daily tracking poll](http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2008/2008_presidential_election/general_election_match_up_history). In 2008, five months before election day, the day Hillary Clinton formally dropped out of the race, Obama led McCain by seven points. > > During the next five months of continuing charges that Obama was a Kenyan-Muslim-socialist, McCain picks Palin, Obama picks Biden, the October financial meltdown and bailout package, the debates, and on and on. . . After all that, on election day, Obama won by 6 points. > > Which means after all that, the polls only changed by ONE POINT – which is, in public opinion research terms, not at all! I used to follow 538 daily back in 2008 during the election. In the days and weeks after Mccain picked Palin, McCain was actually winning in the poll predictions. Many of the swing states turned red and Obama was losing the election. The McCain camp tried to keep Palin out of the media (the same way Romney is trying to avoid all media outlets other than echo chamber softballs like fox and talk radio). But once Palin started going on the news, the maps and predictions on 538 changed. Soon Obama was doing as well or better than he was before Palin. It actually made me gain faith in people, because people must’ve been paying attention to what Palin was saying on the news. So it did make a difference. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/24 "2012-09-20T23:05:07Z")
> [@Kevbo](#): > > Jackie Robinson was born in Kenya? Ignorance fought, thank you sir! Yes that is a joke, but a Romney voter would be unlikely to notice. > > Romney has 100% of the “Anybody but Obama!” vote, and 0% of the “Let another Republican into the oval office…are you out of your everlovin’ mind?” vote. And that isn’t going to change excepting a dead woman or a live boy…and maybe not then. The remaining voters are perhaps 10%. That means to shift the polls by 1% you have to cause a 10% shift in those voters that are sway-able, and that is a huge shift, and only shifts the aggregate number 1%, which is near, or even below the margin of error for most of those polls. > > As entrenched as most of the electorate is in this election, it takes a lot to make a small shift in the numbers, so those small shifts should not be discounted. Well Jackie Roosevelt Robinson was born in CAIRO… (Georgia) I couldn’t resist. And then Just yesterday, the Chair gets Lynched in Texas… seriously > **[Vavada ➤ Error](https://burntorangereport.com/404/)** ---
**Author:** ![Enkel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/df705f/32.png) [@Enkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enkel)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/25 "2012-09-21T01:53:53Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > And then Just yesterday, the Chair gets Lynched in Texas… seriously > [Vavada ➤ Error](http://www.burntorangereport.com/diary/12756/republican-lynches-empty-chair-in-racist-presidential-effigy-in-northwest-austin) From your link (bolding mine): > [@](#): > > However, in light of Clint Eastwood’s speech at the Republican National Convention, in which he had a **largely one-sided** conversation with an empty chair he pretended was Barack Obama, this imagery is now associated with the President. I submit that the author of the article is not among our most intelligent citizens or he has a special TV channel that I don’t have access to. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/26 "2012-09-21T02:02:56Z")
You don’t like that article? Well how about this one. It’s not the only chair lynching > **[U.S. News: Latest Breaking Stories, Video, and Photos on American Politics,...](https://www.nbcnews.com/us-news?lite)** > > Get the latest news headlines and top stories from NBCNews.com. Find videos and news articles on the latest stories in the US. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/27 "2012-09-21T02:08:03Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > …a dead girl or a live boy. > [@Voyager](#): > > …a dead girl or live boy… > [@Kevbo](#): > > …a dead woman or a live boy… Three times and the first page is only half done. It’s worn out and needs a replacement. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/28 "2012-09-21T02:11:31Z")
Why hang a fucking chair, nuke the Ikea factory. Sure, its Sweden, NATO, all that, but we can only be expected to take _just so much_ of that shit. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/29 "2012-09-21T02:19:16Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Why hang a fucking chair, nuke the Ikea factory. Sure, its Sweden, NATO, all that, but we can only be expected to take _just so much_ of that shit. I say why not grab a table and put a white hood I mean table cloth over it. Nobody wants to see the lynching of invisible, I mean inanimate objects. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/30 "2012-09-21T02:36:15Z")
> [@boytyperanma](#): > > Mitt Romney regardless of who he is personally still represents idea’s that you can’t get in a Democratic candidate. If you believe in those ideas of the Republican party you don’t have a choice. If you’re actually _informed_ you most certainly do. [ul] [li]Want “smaller” government? [Democrats win](http://www.politicususa.com/big-government-obama-reagan.html) on that score.[/li][li]Want fiscal responsibility? [Democrats win](http://www.examiner.com/article/damning-evidence-from-cbpp-lays-responsibility-for-budget-deficit-on-republicans) on that score.[/li][li]Want personal responsibility? [Democrats win](http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2012/0906/Obamacare-champions-personal-responsibility.-The-states-that-hate-it-don-t.-video) on that score.[/li][li]Want a strong and rising Stock Market for maximum investment payoff? [Democrats win BIG](http://washingtonexaminer.com/80-year-study-democrats-better-at-economics/article/2505194) on that score.[/li][li]Want less government intrusion into your personal life? [Democrats win](http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/03/15/444999/pennsylvania-governor-supports-ultrasound-bill/) [on that](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/03/democratic-party-platform_n_1853120.html) so hands-down it’s not even a contest.[/li][li]You want less federal government spending? Democrats—[particularly President Obama—win](http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/national-affairs/why-obama-is-no-big-spender-20120531) on that score.[/li][li]Want the immigration reform championed by Republicans ([introduced by Orrin Hatch](http://www.dreamactivist.org/statement-of-senator-orrin-hatch-on-the-dream-act/))? [Democrats will give it to you](http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/dream-act-7-100-eligible-illegal-immigrants-have-applied-more-come)![/li][/ul] The problem is, Republicans have been selling lies for so many years that millions of people believe them. And Democrats have been so bad at debunking those lies that they don’t enjoy nearly the support they should if even half the low-information voters paid attention to reality. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293/31 "2012-09-21T02:39:30Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > …a dead girl or a live boy. … > [@dropzone](#): > > Three times and the first page is only half done. It’s worn out and needs a replacement. 😃 A wide stance or an Argentine journalist? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-someone-screw-up-so-much-and-still-have-a-nontrivial-support-base/635293.md?page=1)