# How can we get pedestrians across the road safely? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 10, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893 "2013-08-10T19:49:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/41 "2013-08-12T14:06:45Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > Lessons at school on how to cross roads, and adverts about them. We used to have them in the UK - Darth Vader was the Green Cross Code Man first. In recent years there have been some quite graphic adverts with teenagers dying while crossing the road. You should see the chaos that reigns at one of the local elementary schools. Parents double, triple, quadruple parked to drop off/pick up, parking in red zones and even more fun, parking across the street and encouraging their kids to cross a six lane road rather than walk 50 yards to a guarded crossing(lights and crossing guards). Sometimes Mom escorts the youngest themselves by running into traffic. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/42 "2013-08-16T00:08:23Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Or, LOOK BOTH FUCKING WAYS! This. By the fundamental laws of physics, cars win in the fight with pedestrians. You can make all the laws and post all the lights and signs and crosswalks you want, and while that will certainly help, the ultimate responsibility for not ending up smeared on the pavement lies with the pedestrian. That’s not to say that we shouldn’t have laws and crosswalks and punish people who ignore them. But those stripes aren’t magic. The way to get safely across the street is to make sure that you don’t cross on a collision course with a car. Humans are pretty bad at judging the speed of something coming toward them. Maybe we should help educate people how to determine if they’ll make it across in time. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/43 "2013-08-16T00:29:06Z")
The problem with the educational videos is that they often wind up looking like all the educational shorts from RiffTrax, which has at least two shorts about how to be a safe pedestrian. I will say that when I have jaywalked (or crossed at an unmarked crosswalk), it always felt a lot safer if I had a decent sized raised median to stand on if needed. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2013, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/44 "2013-08-16T01:48:46Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > [That does’t actually appear to be the case (quoting state law)](http://www.nevadainjuries.com/Personal_Injury_Blog/2006/January/Nevada_Crosswalks.aspx): > > See above the two instances where posters have mentioned that one must have something before one can yield it. You forgot part of the law. > [@](#): > > 1. When official traffic-control devices are not in place or not in operation the driver of a vehicle shall yield the right-of-way, slowing down or stopping if need be so to yield, to a pedestrian crossing the highway within a crosswalk when the pedestrian is upon the half of the highway upon which the vehicle is traveling, or when the pedestrian is approaching so closely from the opposite half of the highway as to be in danger. > > 2. A pedestrian shall not suddenly leave a curb or other place of safety and walk or run into the path of a vehicle which is so close that it is impossible for the driver to yield. Item 1 says the pedestrian has the right of way. Item 2 says the laws of physics trump the laws of man. If you step out 30 feet in front of someone going 50 MPH in this particular case it isn’t the driver’s fault. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2013, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/45 "2013-08-16T20:59:29Z")
So why dont cars stop at pedestrian crossings in the USA? What is wrong with a pedestrian crossing having a set of traffic lights on them? The hawk system seems like a new solution where you dont need one. Do they have pedestrian crossings with speed humps? I dont understand the problem. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2013, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/46 "2013-08-16T21:21:43Z")
> [@antechinus](#): > > So why dont cars stop at pedestrian crossings in the USA? > > What is wrong with a pedestrian crossing having a set of traffic lights on them? The hawk system seems like a new solution where you dont need one. > > Do they have pedestrian crossings with speed humps? > > I dont understand the problem. Mainly pedestrians who cross in the middle of the street or cross against the light. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2013, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/47 "2013-08-17T02:03:45Z")
The op notes a person hit at one of these new crossing types. Why not have a normal set of lights instead of the new hawk system? ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2013, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/48 "2013-08-17T02:11:06Z")
> [@antechinus](#): > > Why not have a normal set of lights instead of the new hawk system? There’s a set of those at the corner. The pedestrians don’t use it. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2013, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/49 "2013-08-17T03:20:43Z")
One of the problems is that our pedestrian system is built as an afterthought to the vehicular traffic system. Pedestrian crossings are tacked on to vehicular crossings. Pedestrian patterns are worked in to the spaces of vehicular traffic patterns. In most cases, crosswalks and other systems were not really designed for pedestrians. They are just extras added on to a purely vehicle-based system. There is little thought given to how pedestrians will actually use them, it’s just considered enough that there is something there, even if it is not particularly useful. A better system would look at what pedestrians need first- where they need to cross, what patterns they take on, etc. and then try to integrate that in to the larger traffic system. People don’t jaywalk for thrills. they jaywalk because the options available to them aren’t working. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2013, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/50 "2013-08-17T03:38:59Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > One of the problems is that our pedestrian system is built as an afterthought to the vehicular traffic system. Pedestrian crossings are tacked on to vehicular crossings. Pedestrian patterns are worked in to the spaces of vehicular traffic patterns. In most cases, crosswalks and other systems were not really designed for pedestrians. They are just extras added on to a purely vehicle-based system. There is little thought given to how pedestrians will actually use them, it’s just considered enough that there is something there, even if it is not particularly useful. > > A better system would look at what pedestrians need first- where they need to cross, what patterns they take on, etc. and then try to integrate that in to the larger traffic system. **People don’t jaywalk for thrills. they jaywalk because the options available to them aren’t working.** Go visit San Francisco and say that again. 😉 People jaywalk almost entirely because they’re lazy, stupid and/or selfish. I’ve seen jaywalkers cross in the middle of the street, disrupting traffic by darting out at the last second then continue on the other side to the corner where there is a light and marked crossing. ---
**Author:** ![FeAudrey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7feea3/32.png) [@FeAudrey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FeAudrey)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/51 "2013-08-19T03:45:35Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > … Pedestrians don’t look over their shoulder to see if parallel traffic is going to turn right and flatten them … I look over my shoulder, but resent having to do so. I’m _in front_ of the right-turning driver; he/she is _behind_ me. Why should I have to keep looking behind me, and they not look forward? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/52 "2013-08-19T09:33:09Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > You forgot part of the law. > Item 1 says the pedestrian has the right of way. > Item 2 says the laws of physics trump the laws of man. If you step out 30 feet in front of someone going 50 MPH in this particular case it isn’t the driver’s fault. I didn’t forget jack. And what you’re quoting doesn’t contradict my assertion; to wit: pedestrians do not always and automatically have the right of way. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/53 "2013-08-19T12:41:56Z")
> [@FeAudrey](#): > > I look over my shoulder, but resent having to do so. > > I’m _in front_ of the right-turning driver; he/she is _behind_ me. Why should I have to keep looking behind me, and they not look forward? Survival. ---
**Author:** ![Longshanks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Longshanks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Longshanks)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/54 "2013-08-19T13:03:08Z")
Foot bridges and/or foot tunnels. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/55 "2013-08-19T13:12:45Z")
Tunnels are problematic in the OP’s state of Michigan, it’s cold there. Bridges aren’t much better. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/56 "2013-08-19T16:28:12Z")
Tunnels and bridges are very expensive to build and require ongoing maintenance. Tunnels require security. Bridges require wheelchair ramps. I propose trebuchets, for both flinging pedestrians (trebuchians?) across the street, and for bombarding cars that do not stop for pedestrians who chose not to be flung. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/57 "2013-08-19T16:39:32Z")
Now I’m thinking a large trampoline park built on both sides of the road would work perfectly. Pedestrians, or trampolians? can simply jump across the road as needed. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893/58 "2013-08-19T17:11:18Z")
> [@FeAudrey](#): > > I look over my shoulder, but resent having to do so. > > I’m _in front_ of the right-turning driver; he/she is _behind_ me. Why should I have to keep looking behind me, and they not look forward? So you won’t get hit? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-can-we-get-pedestrians-across-the-road-safely/665893.md?page=2)