How can we test for sentience/cognition in animals?

Great Debates
21

AFAIK, use of language shows that the being understands that the symbols used in language are abstract representations, not just a cause-effect type thing, and is capable of communicating to other beings using those symbols.

Merely saying “I want food” when hungry does not count as language. That’s just uttering a certain combination of syllables to produce a certain desired effect. Learning that “broken toy” means a toy can no longer be used, and then referring to spoiled meat as “broken food” DOES count as language: the being is expressing an idea in a novel (i.e. untrained) way. It has clearly associated “food” with meat, and “broken” with useless.

In short- language is defined by the association and expression of individual objects and actions with abstract representations of such. Many animals can communicate in a cause-and-effect type manner, but that cannot be considered language.

Language has also been one of the largest steps in human evolution: it’s what’s enabled us to communicate, coordinate and survive, and was the platform that has fueled the rest of our intellectual development. Animals have shown no conclusive evidence of communication - see Cecil’s article, as I mentioned above.

22

The mirror test is not designed to measure intelligence, per se, but to measure self-awareness. Chimps, orangs, and dolphins have “passed” the mirror test, to my knowledge. One would expect gorillas to pass, but I’ve never seen it documented. Put a mirror in front of a monkey (which is a pretty smart animal) and he’ll threat display in front of it forever. Put a mirror in front of a chimp and he’ll use it to examine the inside of his mouth (and a few other interesting body areas).

It’s so unfortunate that we don’t have any of our more closer relatives around to give us a better view of the continuum of intelligence. What a different world it would be if there were still bands of Homo erectus wandering around…

23

As I said, for the purposes of this particular test, I’m specifically looking for the ability to make logical deductions; displaying appropriate, reasoned responses to novel stimuli.

InquisitiveIdiot hit the nail on the head with the ‘broken food’ example.

24

I’ve heard that one of the standards for sentience used to be the ability to make a tool. When it was found that chimps use tools, it was changed to the ability to * use * a tool to * make * a tool.

I’ve also read that sentience is the ability to see one’s self through others eyes, and alter your behavior to project the image you wish them to see. Until Jane Goodall’s studies, it was believed this was unique to humans.

The more animal behavior is studied, the more surprised we are by the workings of their minds. Who knows? Where we once considered them furry robots (some even declared they were incapable of feeling pain) we’re now starting to see signs of self-awareness in a lot of different creatures. Maybe someday, we’ll find that dolphins are more sentient than we!

25

Wasn’t that demonstrated in the 60’s with Washoe the chimp?
http://www.uapress.arizona.edu/samples/sam1011.htm

26

Thanks to Rickjay and John Mace - they’ve made me realise i have been using the word sentient all my life incorrectly. Apologies - the mirror test is of course a test for self awareness, not sentience. I thought they were the same thing!

27

This may be something of an aside, but I don’t see that the “mirror test” really demonstrates anything about self-awareness, either. We, as humans, are familiar with the concept of a mirrored reflection. I rather doubt most other animals would be, simply because encountering a reflection in the wild is going to be a rare event. Where they are encountered, they tend to be in horizontal pools of water. So a vertical mirror is likely to simply be outside of the typical animal’s conceptual domain.

Similalry, birds frequently fly into windows, not because they’re “stupid”, or blind, but because the concept of “transparent, but solid” probably falls outside their realm of understanding or experience. Again, one does not encounter windows in the wild, so it should not be surprising to anyone that birds would lack an understanding of such structures, and probably expect that that clear space up ahead is really empty space.

As such, all I see the mirror test as demonstrating is familiarity with the concept of a mirror, not necessarily self-awareness.

Having said that, my two pet cockatiels seem to know that a reflection is just that. One fears other people, and will not allow them anywhere near her (including my roommate, who has shared an apartment with me, and the birds, for the past three years. Thus, she certainly recognizes him, but still won’t let him get close). Yet, when I hold her in front of a mirror where she can clearly see my reflection, she does not fear the reflection, even when brought close. Nor does she hiss at her own reflection, as she does at my other cockatiel. This would indicate she understands that the “man in the mirror” is not someone else, and that the bird in the mirror is likewise not a different bird.

The other one is just strange,and I have no idea what the hell goes through his mind…

28

I was just thinking that it would probably be a sign of understanding if we were able to put an object (say a tasty seed) behind the bird in such a way that it was visible in the mirror, and the bird turned around to eat it… but it would ba almost impossible to engineer this because of the bird’s field of view.

29

I would say the mirror test is a sufficient, but not necessary condition for determining self awareness. Part of the test is figuring out what a mirror is. Most animals seem unable to do that.

The raven studies I mentioned above are very interesting. They seem to be able to “size up a problem” very much like a chimp does and not always just pounce on the problem with a “trial and error” approach.

30

Possibly do it with an owl?

I agree with Darwin’s Finch though- as far as I can see the only thing the mirror test indicates is whether or not the animal knows how reflections function.

As far as self-awareness goes, I don’t see it as being of imminent importance in determining intelligence. Since the idea that we have a “seat of conciousness” is disappearing, the idea that self-awareness comes with intelligence is also fading. Anything with a cortex can be considered self-aware, albeit to varying degrees of such.

31

Chimps have also been shown to understand models as a representation of the “real thing,” something which children can’t comprehend until around age three or four.

In one experiment, a model of a room was shown to a chimp. A food treat was shown hidden inside a tiny model barrel. When the chimp was let into the real room, he went directly to the barrel and looked underneath. The children who also participated in the study had lower success than did the chimps.

In one mirror test experiment, brightly colored dots were painted on the chimps’ heads while they were sleeping. When they awoke and looked into the mirror, they immediately raised their hands to their heads and rubbed the dots.

Mangetout, they did do a similar bird-mirror experiment to what you’re suggesting. Here’s a link.

Other experiments in animal intelligence/self-awareness include dolphin research which showed that dolphins understood images on television as representing reality and passed the “mirror test.”

32

The smarter animals usually taste better (sorry).

Logic tests that require specific steps would be my choice. You could gauge the results numerically based on the number of steps required. If you look at chess masters, they are critiqued by how many advance moves they can perceive.

33

**

Well, I’ve never eaten chimpanzee, so I can’t really judge whether it tastes better than cow. Cow tastes wonderful, and they’re as dumb as rocks. Chimp must be incredible.

In this test, monkeys could apparently see three steps ahead to their reward, which is more than most young children (or adults, for that matter!) can do:

34

You’re not wrong at all. According to both Merriam-Webster and The American Heritage Dictionary, awareness/conciousness is one of several definitions of the word. Sentience and self-awareness are practically synonymous in the psychological community

35

I always thought this would be funny scenario: Imagine a scientist concluding a day’s work, chuckling to himself about the silly monkey who will push a button over and over again in order to get some food. He walks out of the lab to the elevator, and pushes the elevator button over and over again, hoping it will get there faster…

36

I do think the principle of the mirror test is a good one - show a living creature an image of itself, and see if it can work out it is seeing itself, and not another creature. You have to have a sense of self, be self aware to work out that the image is in fact yourself. Problems do arise though because an image in the mirror might not be perceived as something “real” . So it might be possible to be self aware and not pass the test.

The problems arise in the actual nuts and bolts of the test, but i don’t think this is a sign that the principle of the test itself is incorrect.

Not quite on topic but bo989 - dictionary.com gives this definition of sentient:

Having sense perception; conscious: “The living knew themselves just sentient puppets on God’s stage” (T.E. Lawrence).

Experiencing sensation or feeling

It doesn’t to be a word with a clear well defined meaning. Conscious mean aware of ones own thoughts, so this would be the same as self aware. The second definition of sentient though is clearly not the same as self aware.

37

I’ve had cats my whole life, and it’s true that Adult cats will ignore the mirror. However if you stick a kitten in front of a mirror for the first time, it is VERY interested. They do automatically think that it’s another cat, but they realise pretty quickly that it’s themselves, and lose interest.
I redecorated my room some years ago, took down a mirror and shoved it against the wall. When my (aged) cat walked in the room, she immediately jumped at her reflection, not used to there being a mirror there, she assumed it was another cat, it took her all of about a second to realise it was herself and forget about it.

If a human had never seen it’s own reflection or didn’t understand what reflection was (so no mirrors, no water reflections, etc) I’m pretty sure that the first time they did look in a mirror they would firstly assume it was another person, and then work out it was themselves.

38

Oh, sorry, just had another thought…
My kitties certainly have no difficulty ‘seeing’ the mirror. I have quite often picked my cats up and held them up to the mirror, although they are not interested in looking at themselves, They often try to ‘look around’ into the mirror. They realise the cat in the mirror is themselves, but I think they are a little confused about the reflection of the room, although I’ve never had a cat try to jump into a mirror. But then I can recognise myself in a mirror, but the rest of it confuses the crap outta me. :wink:

39

You’re right, it’s a bit off-topic, but important none-the-less. I never implied that self-awareness or conciousness was the only definition, nor that there was any clear definition of the word. I only pointed out that several of the definitions of the word supported its usage as self-awareness or conciousness. I also further cited that the practical use of the word in an important academic field treats the words synonymously. Finally, to ‘experience’ anything, you have to be self-aware. An organism can not ‘experience’ something without the knowledge that it is seperate and independent from the environment around it. So your final statement that the second definition is clearly not the same as self-aware is not completely accurate.

40

Sorry about the thread hijack everyone…

Bo989 - Apologies - I did misunderstand you a little. I guess self awareness can be one of the definitions of sentient, but not the only one. As you said, there is no single meaning of the word.

I would disagree though that to experience something you have to be self aware. I don’t believe less intelligent animals have a clearly defined sense of self, but they can still experience pain or hunger for example.