# How close to Nazism is US , really ? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 12, 2015, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483 "2015-10-12T22:26:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![solosam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@solosam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solosam)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/21 "2015-10-13T00:47:11Z")
And FWIW, the US has been Israel’s staunchest (and at times, only) ally for generations. It’s safe to say that Israel would no longer exist if it were not for US weapons, and our unflinching support for Israel has won us many, many enemies in the world. Hardly the stuff you’d expect of a “Nazi” nation. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/22 "2015-10-13T01:24:08Z")
> [@Alkash](#): > > Just because \*\*Ravenman \*\* invented an extremely large strawman ([using Alkash’s criteria, Russia is 18 times closer to Nazism](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18762893&postcount=89)), and then repeateadly failed to provide a link to a statement of mine, where I claimed that Russia is 18 times closer to Nazism, should on no account result in his ban. > Freedom of speech is a right, even if it’s exercised by liars and intellectually dishonest people, such as the case here. > Sure, an apology would be nice (not that one is forthcoming, knowing \*\*Ravenman \*\*quote well by now), but no ban, please. Alkash, you can’t call another poster a liar. Warning issued. Don’t do it again. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/23 "2015-10-13T02:13:09Z")
> [@XT](#): > > … the comparison is ridiculous. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Any such comparison is ludicrous. Which is it? I don’t know who to believe. ---
**Author:** ![MrQwertyasd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@MrQwertyasd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrQwertyasd)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/24 "2015-10-13T04:55:31Z")
I’ll get to the nazi question but I think there’s some important stuff about Al Sharpton and Jewish riots that we need to discuss first. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/25 "2015-10-13T05:04:05Z")
Ok, maybe, MAYBE, if someday there was this huge calamity, end of the world event like say a nuclear holocaust or a massive asteroid strike that wiped out most of the population and what little government was left had to resort to martial law, then yes, I can see some type of dictator taking over. At least for a short time. Such a person might adopt some sort of symbol and might target some group of people but I doubt it would be Jews. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/26 "2015-10-13T05:13:17Z")
A really severe economic depression might be enough. Germany was a modern and advanced nation, but the depression (and, yeah, other calamities too) manured the ground for the growth of Nazism. I’m afraid it might come more easily than after a nuclear war or asteroid strike. I fear that a severe depression would be enough. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/27 "2015-10-13T05:17:05Z")
Among the liberal western democracies, the U.S. is probably closer than most. ---
**Author:** ![MrQwertyasd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@MrQwertyasd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrQwertyasd)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/28 "2015-10-13T05:26:17Z")
Paranoia about internal enemies, strong hard line nationalist views, deliberate humiliation by foreign powers - Russia sounds more like pre war Germany that the USA. All you need is a good economic disaster and it would go full crazy. Next - what happened to Germany after the war - occupation and partition. Is a nuclear war worth this goal ? No. Is it possible to occupy a pile of radioactive rubble ? No. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/29 "2015-10-13T14:03:49Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Among the liberal western democracies, the U.S. is probably closer than most. Now, would you be substantiating that remark there, laddie? I can’t see it. The US has been through financial panics, Civil War, Depression, the turbulence of the 1960’s-70’s, and our first black president and somehow we still have elections, still have a functioning (albeit slightly kooky) republic, and compared to other times in our history (see what Wilson and Congress imposed on the American people at the start of WWI, or Lincoln suspending habeus corpus, or the Japanese-American interment, and the Alien and Sedition Acts). But most importantly, every “Nazi” or ‘totalitarian’ state had a definitive leader, a totem to look up to and follow. Who is that here? Trump? (_snort_) Bush? (_Ha!_) Cruz? (\*Hmmm, OK, him I could see, but he has virtually no following to date). So I’ll be asking again, Mr. Ekers, by waht basis do you make such an accusation? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/30 "2015-10-13T14:45:59Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > A really severe economic depression might be enough. Germany was a modern and advanced nation, but the depression (and, yeah, other calamities too) manured the ground for the growth of Nazism. “Yeah, other calamities too” is a heck of a flippant way to describe the First World War, which at the time was regarded as an event of such apocalyptic proportions that it created serious doubt in the very validity of the Enlightenment ideas that had guided the development of European civilization for centuries. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/31 "2015-10-13T15:15:40Z")
Guys, guys, guys. Do you really think this thread is about the US being NAZI? No. It’s about Al Sharpton. Period. The OP is on a mission to “out” Sharpton. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/32 "2015-10-13T15:16:39Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Now, would you be substantiating that remark there, laddie? > > I can’t see it. The US has been through financial panics, Civil War, Depression, the turbulence of the 1960’s-70’s, and our first black president and somehow we still have elections, still have a functioning (albeit slightly kooky) republic, and compared to other times in our history (see what Wilson and Congress imposed on the American people at the start of WWI, or Lincoln suspending habeus corpus, or the Japanese-American interment, and the Alien and Sedition Acts). We are also indefinitely detaining suspected terrorists without trial by claiming they are not on US soil (while simultaneously telling the other government that claims sovereignty over that soil to stuff it). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/33 "2015-10-13T16:46:43Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > We are also indefinitely detaining suspected terrorists without trial by claiming they are not on US soil (while simultaneously telling the other government that claims sovereignty over that soil to stuff it). And? Seriously, I can agree with your point, that the US is, like every other nation-state that ever was or is (and probably will be), will do devious, illegal and possibly (depending on your interpretation) immoral acts. See my list in my post. But responding to the OP and Mr. Ekers, does that bring us closer to Nazism? I don’t see it. If you do, I would really like to have it explained to me. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/34 "2015-10-13T17:02:36Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > So I’ll be asking again, Mr. Ekers, by waht basis do you make such an accusation? A combination of guns and evangelism, mostly, with a bit of prudery and racism thrown in. It’s a big country, anyway, roughly the size and population of western Europe, so there’s quite a lot of variability. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/35 "2015-10-13T17:02:47Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Guys, guys, guys. Do you really think this thread is about the US being NAZI? > > No. It’s about Al Sharpton. Period. The OP is on a mission to “out” Sharpton. And Obama, by association. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/36 "2015-10-13T17:16:26Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Guys, guys, guys. Do you really think this thread is about the US being NAZI? > > No. It’s about Al Sharpton. Period. The OP is on a mission to “out” Sharpton. Exactly. If Alkash wants to make the argument that Al Sharpton is an anti-semitic asshole, I’m in full agreement. If he wants to say that President Obama should avoid Sharpton like a disease-infested rat, I’d agree with that also. But arguing that the United States is on the verge of becoming the Fourth Reich? No, that’s not happening. A violent riot in a Jewish neighbourhood twenty-four years ago is not the foundation of Nazism. This is just a dead horse that Russian apologists want to beat. ---
**Author:** ![sciurophobic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@sciurophobic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sciurophobic)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/37 "2015-10-13T17:23:23Z")
Other than right wing militias calling for the overthrow of the government, a dysfunctional legislature incapable of selecting a leader, and a candidate who’s appealing to the masses through racist demagoguery we’re not close at all. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/38 "2015-10-13T17:23:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > This is just a dead horse that Russian apologists want to beat. Who can blame them? Russians are so completely enlightened that anti-semitism, like HIV/AIDS, has been virtually eliminated in the mother land. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/39 "2015-10-13T17:26:52Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > A combination of guns and evangelism, mostly, with a bit of prudery and racism thrown in. It’s a big country, anyway, roughly the size and population of western Europe, so there’s quite a lot of variability. What do guns, evangelism, and prudery have to do with Nazis? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2015, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483/40 "2015-10-13T17:27:15Z")
Well, the Nazis were pretty bad on gay rights, and the US has a spotty gay rights record at best. Not like Russia, which… oh, wait. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-close-to-nazism-is-us-really/734483.md?page=3)