# How come you never hear of "home grown" cocaine? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 27, 2002, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391 "2002-03-27T16:09:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mad\_Matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Mad\_Matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mad_Matt)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2002, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/21 "2002-03-27T22:22:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jimbrowski \* > \*\* > > I am terribly, terribly ashamed for what I am about to do, but I am unable to stop myself. Please get me help. > “Is that a grand piano in your pocket, or …?” > > “Nope, just glad to see you.” \*\* Er… was that a pianist joke? ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2002, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/22 "2002-03-27T23:03:26Z")
**meta-x** , the name of this site notwithstanding, we are not a drug site. And we do not condone instructions on how to break the law. You know this; you agreed to cooperate when you registered. You are **not** to post instructions on how to break the law again. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/23 "2002-03-28T00:07:16Z")
I’m definitely not suggesting that anyone should do it, but I don’t think coca plants would stand out in the same way that cannabis does; cannabis is a very distinctive (and attractive, IMHO) plant; coca, on the other hand is a pretty nondescript evergreen bush - if the local conditions were right, I reckon it would never be noticed in a garden shrub border or even as a hedge. The processing is probably the stumbling block I’d say; from what I have read, you’d have to be mad to muck about with the chemicals needed to process the stuff. ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/24 "2002-03-28T00:12:10Z")
Who says it’s NOT being done? If anyone was growing that stuff in the US, they wouldn’t come out & say so. Frankly, I think that as they have said before, its too much work. As a landscaper, I don’t see why it cannot be grown in the US. ---
**Author:** ![DPWhite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d26b3c/32.png) [@DPWhite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPWhite)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/25 "2002-03-28T00:44:40Z")
There is at least one pharmacuetical company in the U.S. that makes pure cocaine for surgical use. One use I know of is to shrink sinuses for surgeries involving sinuses. It’s use is highly restrictive. I think Cecil had a column on it once. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/26 "2002-03-28T01:37:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by javaman \* > \*\*I doubt this thread will survive long. But, FWIW, I heard somewhere that the seeds keep their viability only for a short while. And they don’t grow well in most places…apart from the legal aspects, when’s the last time you heard of American cacao or coffee plantations? \*\* Hey **javaman** aren’t there (or at least used to be) coffee plantations in Hawaii? Also, I think that in some cases in Colombia they intermix the cocoa plants with coffee plants to throw off the Federales. So you might be able to grow it in Hawaii and probably places in California, but it’d probably be hard to keep it from being spotted rightaway, whereas in South America, there’s plenty of isolated locations one can grow the stuff and not have to worry too much about it being spotted before harvest time. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/27 "2002-03-28T02:55:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Great Dave \* > \*\*Coca tea, too? \*\* Well, I’m assuming that if it’s a drug offense to possess coca leaves, then it’s probably a drug offense to use them to make coca tea. ---
**Author:** ![sirkle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@sirkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sirkle)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/28 "2002-03-28T05:23:49Z")
Is cocaine legal in Colombia? ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/29 "2002-03-28T06:01:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zwaldd \* > \*\* > 8-ball…eighth ounce. Typical ‘party pack’ back in the day - enough to keep four or five friends in bathroom rotation for the night. \*\* Still typical as of about 3 years ago. How much did one cost back ‘in the day’? ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/30 "2002-03-28T06:04:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sirkle \* > \*\*Is cocaine legal in Colombia? \*\* No. The cultivation of the coca leaf was made illegal in Colombia in 1947. Cocaine (though not necessarily the leaf) was banned internationally by the 1988 United Nations Convention Against Illicit Traffic in Narcotic Drugs and Psycotropic Substances. Coca, but not cocaine, is legal in Bolivia. ---
**Author:** ![choosybeggar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@choosybeggar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choosybeggar)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/31 "2002-03-28T12:14:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KidCharlemagne \* > \*\*I know that cocaine production is much more involved than marijauna but im still surprised ive never heard of US coca growing facilities. I looked it up on the net and saw that it took roughly 250 lbs of coca leaves to make 22 lbs. of cocaine. Im not sure how many coca plants it would take to yield that, but it;s an awful lot of cocaine in any case. The other question is why coca plants arent genetically engineered to produce more alkaloid? \*\* "Clean that mess up else we’ll all end up in jail. The test tubes and the scale, Just get it on out of here. Get along, get along Kid Charlemagne." ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/32 "2002-03-28T12:21:04Z")
Beggar, Nothing brings a smile to my face quicker than someone who gets the name reference. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![red\_dragon60](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@red\_dragon60](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/red_dragon60)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/33 "2002-03-28T13:21:41Z")
Something you have to think about is the relative prices. If you can earn 2$ a day by growing coffee and 4$ for growing coca, you grow the coca. However, look at how little you’re earning! The reason they grow it is because it is the best-priced crop in that region. Growing makes tiny amounts of money. The big bucks go to the people who refine it. Also, if you are planning on refining it, you might want to take out a life insurance policy. I can assure you that the chemicals you use will catch on fire, and are very explosive. Something to think about: 55-gallon drums filled with ether. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/34 "2002-03-28T13:32:57Z")
This is the longest-lived thread of this type that I’ve ever seen. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/35 "2002-03-28T13:51:09Z")
Coca is also legal in Peru. In fact it is a tradition to be given a cup of coca tea by your host (or hotel) upon arrival in Cuzco. You can also go to the market and buy a large bag of coca leaves for really, really cheap and it includes a lump of something to use with the leaves while chewing to get the maximum effect. ---
**Author:** ![zwaldd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a9adbd/32.png) [@zwaldd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwaldd)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/36 "2002-03-28T15:34:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Badtz Maru \* > \*\*Still typical as of about 3 years ago. How much did one cost back ‘in the day’? \*\* $250, give or take. ‘The day’ being mid 80’s. ---
**Author:** ![meta-x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@meta-x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/meta-x)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/37 "2002-03-28T17:33:07Z")
I feel i should apologize to you guy… i went a little far with my little recipe. hopefully, manhattan was kind enough just to chop a part of my message instead of shutting this thread down … ouf. To to go forward with this question 😃 Here’s a little tough of mine. Those who actually control the cocain cartel take a lot of risk getting the cocaine in other country. Obviously they must already be searching way to produce it where they sell it. I guess this would be less risky. Those guy are after profit, so i think that the reason is mainly cost effectiveness. Does anyone know how much can cost all the greenhouse material needed for such massive production. Then we could compare this with relative cost of delivering the substance to verify if its indeed a cost question. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2002, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/38 "2002-03-28T18:49:58Z")
> [@](#): > > Does anyone know how much can cost all the greenhouse material needed for such massive production. It’s a question not only of cost-effectiveness, but of simple logistics. According to the [CIA,](http://www.cia.gov/saynotodrugs/cocaine_l.html) a typical coca farm in Bolivia will be 2 to 4 hectares (5 to 10 acres) but the individual fields will be much smaller, and the size of a typical family coca field is 1 hectare in size–a hectare is the area of a square measuring 100 meters on a side, or about 2.5 acres. So let’s talk about 1 hectare of coca plants. > [@](#): > > Coca plants are generally planted in rows about one meter apart, but the space between plants can be much more or less depending on the type of coca plant. There is an average of about 45,000 plants per hectare in Bolivia and an average of about 25,000 plants per hectare in Peru. So, where are you going to put 25,000 coca plants? In a greenhouse? You’ll need a really big greenhouse. Quite a few greenhouses, in fact. The biggest greenhouse these folks offer is 30 feet by 96 feet, or 2880 square feet, priced at between about $8,000 and $10,000 per greenhouse, although they do run specials sometimes. [http://www.growitgreenhouses.com/commercial/commpages/30x96\_1.html](http://www.growitgreenhouses.com/commercial/commpages/30x96_1.html) [http://www.growitgreenhouses.com/commercial/commpages/30x96\_2.html](http://www.growitgreenhouses.com/commercial/commpages/30x96_2.html) If it won’t cause all the anal-retentive Dopers out there to shriek in unspeakable agony, I will seat-of-the-pants assume that a meter is about a yard, or 3 feet, and that a hectare is therefore a square measuring 300 feet by 300 feet, which is 90,000 square feet. To provide 90,000 square feet of greenhouse space, you’re going to need 31 maximum-size, professional-type 30’ x 96’ greenhouses. If you can get them on sale for $5,000, that’s going to run you $155,000, and that’s not including heating costs. Coca is not frost-tolerant at all, so if you’re growing your coca anywhere besides Central Florida or Southern California, you’re going to need a serious professional-type heating system. You’re going to need potting soil, fertilizer, pesticide, etc. I’m not even going to try to price that out. And here’s the biggest problem: where in the world, literally, are you going to hide something like 30 or 40 greenhouses full of coca plants? The neighbors will want to know what you’re growing in there, and I doubt whether you can persuade them that it’s “hybrid poinsettias”. So assuming that you buy a remote estate somewhere in Idaho, and manage to set up your 30 or 40 greenhouses, and miraculously nobody notices, what do you have for your money? Once your bushes are mature enough that you can start harvesting, if you’re working alone, you’ll be basically spending all your waking hours picking leaves. > [@](#): > > It can take up to almost 300 man days to harvest one hectare-or about 2.5 acres-of coca bushes. That’s the equivalent of 300 men working one day or 1 man working for 300 days. > [@](#): > > Depending on where the coca bush is grown and the type of bush, dried leaf amounts vary from less than 1 metric ton (about nine-tenths of a US ton or 2,200 US pounds) to nearly 3 metric tons per hectare. And finally, what do you have, for all your investment, not to mention the grunt labor of picking leaves? > [@](#): > > Depending on the country where grown, coca leaves from a 1 hectare field can be processed into 4.0 to 7.4 kilograms (about 8.8 to 16.25 pounds) of cocaine. Gee, five whole keys of coke. :rolleyes: I doubt if the Cartel would be terribly worried about the competition, but I know the DEA would be mighty interested. And remember, if you go to jail, the Feds get to keep all your nice greenhouses, not to mention the estate in Idaho. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2002, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/39 "2002-03-29T05:22:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zwaldd \* > \*\* > $250, give or take. ‘The day’ being mid 80’s. \*\* Not that much more expensive…up until 1999 or so I had seen it go for everything from $120 to $200 for an 8, usually somewhere between $140 and $160. At least one thing is cheaper now than in the 80s… ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2002, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391/40 "2002-03-29T14:41:07Z")
Duck Duck, Im not sure about your numbers but im assuming that’s a pretty huge operation - like cartel size. Someone said you need 1000 lbs of coca leaves to make 2 lbs of cocaine. Id be curious to know how many coca plants you;d need to yield that. And what the growing time on a tree to produce x amount of leaves be. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-come-you-never-hear-of-home-grown-cocaine/100391.md?page=3)