# How could World War II have impoverished a wealthy Briton? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 2, 2025, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683 "2025-09-02T18:40:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/41 "2025-09-05T01:58:46Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > The first published book (and first chronologically within the series timeline, other than one book) starts in 1940. (Specifically, the text says the children were evacuated because of German bombing of London, which started September 1940.) Yes, my thought too was the series started with the Blitz evacuations. Therefore, if this is about someone at that time (which book is it?) it would be a result of the onset and ongoing war, not the aftermath of loss of empire. I would imagine between the bombing, the submarine attacks on shipping, and the general disruption of employees enlisted and shortage of material, or simply the general impact on business due to lack of frivolous or luxury spending because of economic disruption - a lot of businessmen would experience tough times. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/42 "2025-09-05T03:11:50Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > IMO the bigger miracle would be to be a 1912 UK fatcat who was still a fatcat in 1946. Similarly, I’d be very surprised that someone who lost their fortune before 1918 had held onto their real estate until 1940, ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/43 "2025-09-05T03:22:04Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > it would be a result of the onset and ongoing war, not the aftermath of loss of empire. The series sets its last book in 1949 (_The Last Battle_), so “post-war” is hypothetically possible. But I don’t remember at all the originally-cited “made poor by the war” quote, so I can’t make any claims about the timeframe of it. ---
**Author:** ![gkster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gkster/32/14107_2.png) [@gkster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gkster)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/44 "2025-09-05T04:28:53Z")
Professor Kirk/Kirke (Lewis spells the name both ways) is the person who’s become poor, after WWII. Here’s the quote, from _The Voyage of the Dawn Treader_: “Peter was working very hard for an exam and he was to spend the holidays being coached by old Professor Kirke in whose house these four children had had wonderful adventures long ago in the war years. If he had still been in that house he would have had them all to stay. But he had somehow become poor since the old days and was living in a small cottage with only one bedroom to spare.” In _The Magician’s Nephew_ we find out how young Digory (later to be Professor Kirke) acquires the country house: “Old Great-Uncle Kirk had died and this meant, apparently, that Father was now very rich. He was going to retire and come home from India forever and ever. And the great big house in the country, which Digory had heard of all his life and never seen, would now be their home: the big house with the suits of armour, the stables, the kennels, the river, the park, the hot-houses, the vineries, the woods, and the mountains behind it.” _The Last Battle_ says that the big country house was destroyed: "But she [Lucy] looked harder and saw that it was not a cloud at all but a real land. And when she had fixed her eyes on one particular spot of it, she at once cried out, “Peter! Edmund! Come and look! Come quickly.” And they came and looked, for their eyes also had become like hers. “Why!” exclaimed Peter. “It’s England. And that’s the house itself—Professor Kirk’s old home in the country where all our adventures began!” “I thought that house had been destroyed,” said Edmund. “So it was,” said the Faun." So it looks like Digory Kirk’s father inherited the family house and money in the 1890s. (_The Magician’s Nephew_ says “In those days Mr. Sherlock Holmes was still living in Baker Street.”) In the 1940s, during WWII, Digory (now known as Professor Kirk) still has enough money to maintain the house with three servants and a housekeeper, as described in the opening paragraph of _The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe_. Possibly the house is destroyed by a bomb in WWII, but that doesn’t explain what’s happened to the money. It doesn’t seem like they were in a failed business. Maybe the inherited money just ran out, or the professor had made bad investments? Or, like characters in Victorian novels, _Little Women_ for example, he trustingly lent too much money to a friend who lost the money? All the books are available online here: > **[Search: fadedpage.com](https://www.fadedpage.com/csearch.php?author=Lewis,%20C.%20S.%20%28Clive%20Staples%29)** ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/45 "2025-09-05T08:55:09Z")
The big house in the country is something very different to a nice house in London. > the big house with the suits of armour, the stables, the kennels, the river, the park, the hot-houses, the vineries, the woods, This is a proper country estate. and ruinously expensive to keep up. You don’t just have a couple of maids. This is the Arcadian Britain of the empire years. The England of Jane Austen and > a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife. A good fortune might be such an estate and the external income to maintain it. Such income often did depend on the empire. And not always in happy ways. The loss of the empire, and dramatic shifts in society and the economy caused the ruination of many estates and their manors. There was a time when the manors were impossible to even heat economically let alone afford the staff and upkeep and a huge number were demolished and the estates cut up. The era of inherited easy living vanished. Another example. My paternal grandfather was the vicar for a tiny village. The rectory he lived in was not all that far off the description of the country house above. Not quite as grand, but it had stables, servants wing, its own kitchen garden and extensive grounds. My grandfather arrived there in about 1925. By then there were no servants, no horses, and a large cold building that the family lived in one corner of. The rectory still stands and has been cut up into a set of holiday rentals. Even the stables have been converted. The current vicar lives in a flat in a nearby village and does the rounds of half a dozen villages now all forming his parish. The rectory and the living (ie the income for the vicar) came from the estate of the local squire. Who essentially lived of the back of income from the farmland he owned in the region. (The local diocese was responsible for upkeep of the rectory as well as the church.) The squire owned a lot of land, including hunting and fishing rights. All of this vanished after WW2. The easy, mostly unearned, money dried up and the cost of staff rose enormously. Gone were the days when staff lived on the estate and were happy to have little more than a bed, clothes, and to be fed. It isn’t unreasonable for someone to fall from an idyllic life in the country based on an inherited source of income to one of seriously reduced circumstances. With the income gone, and these country manors becoming essentially worthless, getting out with somewhere to live and a little money to live on might be considered fortunate. ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2025, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/46 "2025-09-05T16:05:40Z")
When did the inheritance (estate?) taxes kick in that made it prohibitive to pass these mansions on to heirs? I was under the impression it was after WWII with the Labour government? IIRC from my tourist visits a lot were converted to National Trust properties, and some take advantage of tax loopholes by being open to visitors a short time each year? (Was there also an issue with the level of income farms provided? (rented out land, I assume?) ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/47 "2025-09-06T12:39:53Z")
> [@gkster](#): > > Professor Kirk/Kirke (Lewis spells the name both ways) is the person who’s become poor, after WWII. Here’s the quote, from _The Voyage of the Dawn Treader_: > > “Peter was working very hard for an exam and he was to spend the holidays being coached by old Professor Kirke in whose house these four children had had wonderful adventures long ago in the war years. If he had still been in that house he would have had them all to stay. But he had somehow become poor since the old days and was living in a small cottage with only one bedroom to spare.” > > In _The Magician’s Nephew_ we find out how young Digory (later to be Professor Kirke) acquires the country house: > “Old Great-Uncle Kirk had died and this meant, apparently, that Father was now very rich. He was going to retire and come home from India forever and ever. And the great big house in the country, which Digory had heard of all his life and never seen, would now be their home: the big house with the suits of armour, the stables, the kennels, the river, the park, the hot-houses, the vineries, the woods, and the mountains behind it.” > > _The Last Battle_ says that the big country house was destroyed: > > "But she [Lucy] looked harder and saw that it was not a cloud at all but a real land. And when she had fixed her eyes on one particular spot of it, she at once cried out, “Peter! Edmund! Come and look! Come quickly.” And they came and looked, for their eyes also had become like hers. > > “Why!” exclaimed Peter. “It’s England. And that’s the house itself—Professor Kirk’s old home in the country where all our adventures began!” > > “I thought that house had been destroyed,” said Edmund. > > “So it was,” said the Faun." > > So it looks like Digory Kirk’s father inherited the family house and money in the 1890s. (_The Magician’s Nephew_ says “In those days Mr. Sherlock Holmes was still living in Baker Street.”) In the 1940s, during WWII, Digory (now known as Professor Kirk) still has enough money to maintain the house with three servants and a housekeeper, as described in the opening paragraph of _The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe_. Possibly the house is destroyed by a bomb in WWII, but that doesn’t explain what’s happened to the money. It doesn’t seem like they were in a failed business. Maybe the inherited money just ran out, or the professor had made bad investments? Or, like characters in Victorian novels, _Little Women_ for example, he trustingly lent too much money to a friend who lost the money? > > All the books are available online here: > [Search: fadedpage.com](https://www.fadedpage.com/csearch.php?author=Lewis,%20C.%20S.%20(Clive%20Staples)) Thank you. That timing works a lot better. In 39-40 when we first meet the children he still had money and the big country house. The change happened in the following years. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/48 "2025-09-06T14:22:17Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > When did the inheritance (estate?) taxes kick in that made it prohibitive to pass these mansions on to heirs? I was under the impression it was after WWII with the Labour government? There had been estate duties for years, apparently simplified in 1894, but becoming more progressive in the aftermath of WW1, and yes, under Labour in the financial crises post WW2 > **[History of inheritance taxes in the United Kingdom](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_inheritance_taxes_in_the_United_Kingdom)** > > The history of inheritance taxes in the United Kingdom has undergone significant change and mutation since their original introduction in 1694. > Probate duty was introduced as part of the Stamps Act 1694, in order to help finance England's involvement in the War of the League of Augsburg. It originally applied to all probates of wills and letters of administration for personal estates valued greater than £20, at a fixed duty of 5 s. (one crown, or a quarter of a pound). It was converted into a ... ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/49 "2025-09-06T17:11:57Z")
Maybe he bet his life savings on a game of cornhole with Hitler and lost. That’s how I lost my life savings, although it was with a different Hitler. I could see endless ways to lose your fortune during WWII Huge tax hikes on the wealthy De-colonization during and after the war German bombing raids destroying his facilities His business could’ve produced luxury goods that were not a priority during and after the war The war destroying shipping lanes needed for commerce The government confiscated his business to convert it to the war effort, then he wasn’t able to convert it back into civilian use after the war ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/50 "2025-09-06T17:20:59Z")
Thanks. Yikes, more detail than I really want to know. 80% - no wonder so many manor houses became national treasures. I presume there was a contemporary decline in demand and value for large manor houses during the tough times after the war, and the proceeds of the sale would also then net around 80% tax… No wonder someone would become in poor circumstances, once they realized they could no longer support the upkeep of a large house. It would be something like - business income declines and taxes are high. Can’t afford the upkeep. Sell the big house for not very much, government takes 80%. Find a small cottage. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/51 "2025-09-06T17:52:33Z")
The wealth one can derive from being an agricultural landowner was huge in the 1600s - 1800s but was rapidly declining as the 1800s wound down and the 1900s began. Even setting aside a calamity connected to warfare, there’d be lots of ways for the landed gentry to find themselves slowly drowning financially as their ag land earned them less every year and costs of everything else, especially labor, went up as industrialization took hold and the countryside emptied out. Add in an aging generation that ends up thinking they’ll just hang out in the slowly failing Manor until they die and leave the mess for the kids and that can all converge very harshly in the early 20th century. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2025, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/52 "2025-09-06T20:53:42Z")
I read someplace that the repeal of the [Corn Laws](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corn_Laws), which limited the importation of cheaper crops from North America, was a factor in the declining fortunes of the landed gentry. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2025, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/53 "2025-09-07T06:46:57Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > Sell the big house for not very much, government takes 80% Well, 80% above whatever exemption level. ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2025, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/54 "2025-09-07T11:00:15Z")
By the late 1940s the big aristocratic country houses were being demolished at the rate of around one a week, both in England and Ireland. The wealth of the country had been in land, but now it was in industry. They required a midlife upgrade, which they weren’t going to get, and fewer people were willing to work as domestic servants now that better employment opportunities were available, particularly for women. The death of the designated heir in the First World War upset the inheritance planning of many estates. Houses which had been requisitioned during the war generally suffered in the process, with minimal maintenance work done by the government. Agricultural estates frequently had to be broken up and/or reduced in size to pay death duties. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2025, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/55 "2025-09-19T02:58:49Z")
> [@HeyHomie](#): > > Could it be that his business depended on unmolested trade in the North Atlantic, where there was always the possibility of ships being sunk by German ships? I don’t know about “impoverished”, but at the start of WWII, there were American ship owners who continued to send their ships to sea, out of a sense of patriotism and morality. Those that did certainly wound up a lot poorer than they had been. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2025, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/56 "2025-09-20T08:42:20Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > I don’t know about “impoverished”, but at the start of WWII, there were American ship owners who continued to send their ships to sea, out of a sense of patriotism and morality. It was no more of a sense of patriotism and morality than the millions of men who were drafted. The US had the merchants marine system during the war in which the national government took control of American civilian ships and paid for their use, as well as providing compensation if the ship was sunk. There was a program where the government subsidized the cost of ship building (and IIRC, operating as well) starting in 1936, with the condition that the ships be used if war broke out. While US operators may have been unhappy about the amount of compensation, it wasn’t as you suggest that they would be completely out. OTOH, AFAIK, the Japanese ship owners were completely screwed, and the vast majority of them lost it all. While Japan also subsisted the building of civilian ships in anticipation of war, a far greater percentage of shipping was lost. Japan started with 6 million tons of shipping and added another 3.3 million tons and 8.6 million tons were sunk. Virtually all merchant ships of 1,000 tons and greater were sunk. There were a bunch of fishing boats left and not that much more. I don’t know if they were compensated but I doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2025, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/57 "2025-09-20T14:23:15Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > The US had the merchants marine system during the war in which the national government took control of American civilian ships and paid for their use, as well as providing compensation if the ship was sunk. The US still has something similar for commercial passenger & freight airlines: > **[Civil Reserve Air Fleet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Reserve_Air_Fleet)** > > The Civil Reserve Air Fleet (CRAF) is part of the United States's mobility resources. Selected aircraft from U.S. airlines, contractually committed to Civil Reserve Air Fleet, support United States Department of Defense airlift requirements in emergencies when the need for airlift exceeds the capability of available military aircraft. > In 1952, after aircraft were commandeered for the Berlin Airlift, the Civil Reserve Air Fleet (CRAF) was created as a more orderly way of serving emergency milit... If the US still had a merchant shipping industry of any size it’s a good bet they’d be subject to something similar. They may in fact be; it’s just not an area I know anything about. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2025, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/58 "2025-09-20T22:37:16Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > If the US still had a merchant shipping industry of any size it’s a good bet they’d be subject to something similar. China is doing the same thing that Japan did prior to WWII; subside the building of dual purpose ships. I get the impression that they are even more extensive about it. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2025, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/59 "2025-09-21T04:29:40Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > There was a program where the government subsidized the cost of ship building (and IIRC, operating as well) starting in 1936, with the condition that the ships be used if war broke out. I was thinking of those shipowners who continued to send their ships to sea out of sense of patriotism and morality. Not the ones who were paid to do so, or had been paid to do so. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2025, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683/60 "2025-09-21T05:07:00Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > I was thinking of those shipowners who continued to send their ships to sea out of sense of patriotism and morality. While that may or may not have happened, the point is that you are wrong that ship owners became much poorer because of patriotism. There was a program in place which provided compensation for the losses. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-could-world-war-ii-have-impoverished-a-wealthy-briton/1022683.md?page=4)