# How DARE he park his plane there? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 1, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743 "2015-08-01T19:17:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/21 "2015-08-02T13:43:30Z")
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**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/22 "2015-08-02T15:03:17Z")
> [@oz0ne](#): > > All I know is if I pulled in my driveway and saw my neighbor had a plane in his, I would think it would be cool as fuck. I’m not sure how cool fuck is, but its up (down) there. I think that’s sort of what he’s counting on here, but it’s back firing on him. > [@Broomstick](#): > > Taking just the prop off should be enough, that and pulling the spark plugs. You wouldn’t be able to start it after that, and that’s the big danger. I’d be surprised if you could start it without the prop on, crank it, yes, but I don’t think it would start. I’m guessing the prop acts as a flywheel. But I say that armed only with the knowledge that the blade on a lawnmower is the flywheel and that (at least in the case that my shop teacher told me about) a lawnmower with no blade won’t start. Either way, if he took the prop off, he could just disconnect the battery or remove the the cable that (in automobile terms) goes from the coil to the distributor, or both to be extra sure. In fact, doing all three, on top of keeping it alarmed (with a PA) and locked would show that he took every reasonable measure to make sure that no one could hurt themselves on it. I’d probably (if I were him) go one step further and put a sign in the ground that says something like “No trespassing, please feel free to look, but do not touch the airplane, if you’d like see it close up, please call me at …” Again, it’s another step to show that he made it clear that he was actively trying to keep people off his property and away from the plane AND if someone wanted to see it he was happy to show it to them, with his supervision. It’s funny, when we get stuff stolen from out property (at work), one of the first things the cops say is “Is there a no trespassing sign back here? is there a sign that says these items are for sale? Is there a sign that says they can’t steal these things?” There is now, but a few people have gotten away with saying “what, this stuff, I thought it was garbage?” Yeah, if you thought it was garbage you wouldn’t show up at 2 in the morning to fill up your pick up with it. Anyways, the second someone so much as trips over a wheel or bumps their head on a wing because they were poking around in the middle of the night, it’ll be gone. The city will use that as an excuse to put it on a flatbed and pull it out of there, whether he wants them to or not. But he seems to be a ‘nothing to lose’ point in his life so if he’s right, I hope he takes the boat owners down with him. I don’t like the idea that he can’t have it just because they don’t want him to have it. If there’s a law and he broke it, fine, I’m okay with that. But it seems like that might not be the case. ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/23 "2015-08-02T15:25:14Z")
Knowing nothing about airplanes, would it be a good idea to drain the fuel system? I would have done that before I transferred it to my house. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/24 "2015-08-02T15:25:55Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I’d be surprised if you could start it without the prop on, crank it, yes, but I don’t think it would start. I’m guessing the prop acts as a flywheel. But I say that armed only with the knowledge that the blade on a lawnmower is the flywheel and that (at least in the case that my shop teacher told me about) a lawnmower with no blade won’t start. > > Either way, if he took the prop off, he could just disconnect the battery or remove the the cable that (in automobile terms) goes from the coil to the distributor, or both to be extra sure. Aircraft use a magneto ignition system, and there are two magnetos as each cylinder has two spark plugs. To start the engine – or at least get it to fire – all you have to do is have the switch turned to ‘Left’, ‘Right’, or ‘Both’, and swing the propeller. Like a lawnmower engine. So if the switch is off, what’s to worry about? There’s always the possibility of a frayed wire somewhere. If the mechanical switch is off, there still can be a short in the line that would allow the engine to fire if the prop is swung or even bumped. But accidental firing is not what I’d worry about. Airplanes tend to be very well maintained, and magneto shorts don’t happen very often. I’d be more concerned about some kid on a bicycle getting skewered by a prop that someone turned to the horizontal position. I think every Cessna pilot has gotten a temporary string of diamonds on his forehead from bumping into the trailing edge of a wing. You say ‘DOH!’ and get on with the flying. Non-pilots might take umbrage at such an ‘injury’. More than that, I wouldn’t want scores of untrained people milling about my aircraft unsupervised. ‘Hey, what does _this_ do?’ Or, control lock in, ‘Hey, this thing is supposed to move! Why doesn’t it? Maybe if I push harder?’ Or, ‘Whoops! I hope he doesn’t notice that dent.’ Even though I wouldn’t park _my_ (imaginary) plane in my front yard, and even though there are liability issues, I don’t see why his airplane should be treated differently from a boat or RV. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/25 "2015-08-02T15:31:31Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I think every Cessna pilot has gotten a temporary string of diamonds on his forehead from bumping into the trailing edge of a wing. I’ve always thought that a line connected by diamonds would be a pretty cool tattoo for those in the know. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/26 "2015-08-02T15:34:05Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Like a boat? > As he said, if he loses his case everyone is going to have to move their boats out of their driveways too. Presumably the boats are sitting on trailers registered for road use and displaying license plates. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/27 "2015-08-02T16:59:23Z")
> [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > I’ve always thought that a line connected by diamonds would be a pretty cool tattoo for those in the know. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/28 "2015-08-02T19:04:54Z")
Back in the 70s my Dad rebuilt two airplanes in our suburban garage. He got stalled partway through the second one and the fuselage sat untouched in the driveway for several years. He eventually hired somebody to finish the job & they hauled the half-done carcass away. Most neighbors were cool about it, as it was a good landmark on an otherwise nondescript street in suburbia. “Yeah, just go along until you see the airplane; we’re the 3rd house past there on the left. Yeah, I said airplane. You can’t miss it.” A few people were darn glad to see it go. And no, nobody ever called the cops or the planning commission. Although we didn’t live in an HOA area. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/29 "2015-08-02T19:10:55Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I’d be surprised if you could start it without the prop on, crank it, yes, but I don’t think it would start. I’m guessing the prop acts as a flywheel. But I say that armed only with the knowledge that the blade on a lawnmower is the flywheel and that (at least in the case that my shop teacher told me about) a lawnmower with no blade won’t start. The biggest problem with starting an airplane engine without a prop attached is that it is designed to have to load on the shaft - spinning without it can result in mayhem and destruction. Not that that is normally done, but mechanics working on the powerplants have to be very careful about testing engines. > [@](#): > > Either way, if he took the prop off, he could just disconnect the battery or remove the the cable that (in automobile terms) goes from the coil to the distributor, or both to be extra sure. In fact, doing all three, on top of keeping it alarmed (with a PA) and locked would show that he took every reasonable measure to make sure that no one could hurt themselves on it. > [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Aircraft use a magneto ignition system, and there are two magnetos as each cylinder has two spark plugs. To start the engine – or at least get it to fire – all you have to do is have the switch turned to ‘Left’, ‘Right’, or ‘Both’, and swing the propeller. Like a lawnmower engine. So if the switch is off, what’s to worry about? There’s always the possibility of a frayed wire somewhere. If the mechanical switch is off, there still can be a short in the line that would allow the engine to fire if the prop is swung or even bumped. Johnny covered it pretty well. Airplanes aren’t cars or lawnmowers. Accidental mishaps are rare (thank Og!) but airplanes don’t need batteries to start. In fact, I used to fly ultralight/sportplane types that had no batteries, you used a pull-start to get the motor and prop going. A lot of early small single-engine airplanes were _designed_ to be started by hand-propping. And, one fine summer day, when I failed to notice an alternator failure and ran the battery completely flat I got home by hand-propping a 4-seat Piper Warrior and then flew it back home without a working electrical system. So, really, if you want to be safe it’s not enough to disconnect the battery. Pulling out the magnetoes is a pain in the ass, so the sparkplugs it is. No sparky then no boom-boom in the cylinder and nothing goes 'round. > [@](#): > > I think every Cessna pilot has gotten a temporary string of diamonds on his forehead from bumping into the trailing edge of a wing. Well, not me - I’m so short my head reliably passes under the wind without requiring a duck on my part. 😃 I _did_ once get a faceful of airplane fuel while walking under a wing, though. Thank goodness I wear glasses, kept it out of my eyes. He probably should put something around the prop, though, some sort of padding - I had a friend who had his nose about half-torn off from running into a (not moving) prop blade in a dark hanger. Get some kid on a bicycle colliding with it yeah, there could be some damage. It’s sort of alarming just how many ways you can hurt yourself with an airplane that’s not moving and not turned on. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/30 "2015-08-02T20:07:15Z")
On the plus side, the guy got one hell of an advert. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/31 "2015-08-02T20:17:09Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Two things - > > Should he have his plane in his suburban driveway? Gawd no - stupid, counter-productive false economy. > > Should the neighbors be upset? To a large extent, yes - it looks ridiculous, out of proportion, and is certain to be a kid magnet. > Other motives? You Betcha! More than a few are upset by “different” and “more money than we have, we wanted a plane too, but got kids instead”. > > All said - it shouldn’t be there, and the motives of the crowd are suspect. the house in the picture is a McMansion. Nobody in the neighborhood is starving. it’s the equivalent of a 57 buick put on blocks in the hopes it will someday get fixed. In that neighborhood he might as well put a refrigerator on the porch. Given his economic situation it would make sense to sell it. If that particular plane is special to him he should pull the wings and store it in his garage to keep it out of the elements. He doesn’t have to annual it until he’s ready to fly again. the engine needs some storage TLC to keep it from rusting. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/32 "2015-08-02T20:35:06Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Given his economic situation it would make sense to sell it. There are twelve 152s listed at controller right now, ranging from $15,000 (1977) to $60,000 (1982). ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2015, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/33 "2015-08-02T21:00:17Z")
Airplane engines are marvels of 1930’s engineering. The cost of getting an new design certificated is several times what one could ever hope to recover. The worst thing is to let it sit and rot - it should be run up to temperature at least 3 or 4 times a year. It is going to rot in that driveway. At the San Carlos airport there was a Piper Tomahawk (I heard the sniggering). It sits on a grass spot and hadn’t moved in 10 years. The story was that some guy thought it was a good candidate for an IFR platform. There was also an old Arrow with flat, sun-rotted tires, but it was at least at a real tie-down. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/34 "2015-08-03T00:30:18Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > There are twelve 152s listed at controller right now, ranging from $15,000 (1977) to $60,000 (1982). I’m kinda fond of my plane because I and some friends assembled it from a pile of parts. But I’m not married to it and it could be replaced if necessary. I had to sell stuff to make ends meet the last 6 years and I don’t miss it. It’s just stuff. I understand the neighborhood’s position. It’s truly out of place and I’m not that fussy about what people park in their driveway. I’m trying to figure out how he got it home. It can’t be trucked with the wings on so he must be REALLY near an airport and just walked it home late one night. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/35 "2015-08-03T00:42:56Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I’m kinda fond of my plane because I and some friends assembled it from a pile of parts. But I’m not married to it and it could be replaced if necessary. I had to sell stuff to make ends meet the last 6 years and I don’t miss it. It’s just stuff. > > I understand the neighborhood’s position. It’s truly out of place and I’m not that fussy about what people park in their driveway. > > I’m trying to figure out how he got it home. It can’t be trucked with the wings on so he must be REALLY near an airport and just walked it home late one night. NY Post says he brought it home in pieces, then reassembled it after the first complaints came in. > [@](#): > > First, he amputated the wings of the 24-foot-long, 38-foot-wide two-seater, and had the body driven on a flatbed truck to his home. > He then had the wings brought over on top of a van. It also says that he was a student pilot that couldn’t pass his medical, so it’s not like that plane is some long-owned prized possession. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/36 "2015-08-03T00:44:55Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I’m kinda fond of my plane because I and some friends assembled it from a pile of parts. But I’m not married to it and it could be replaced if necessary. I had to sell stuff to make ends meet the last 6 years and I don’t miss it. It’s just stuff. > > I understand the neighborhood’s position. It’s truly out of place and I’m not that fussy about what people park in their driveway. > > I’m trying to figure out how he got it home. It can’t be trucked with the wings on so he must be REALLY near an airport and just walked it home late one night. NY Post says he brought it home in pieces, then reassembled it after the first complaints came in. > [@](#): > > First, he amputated the wings of the 24-foot-long, 38-foot-wide two-seater, and had the body driven on a flatbed truck to his home. > He then had the wings brought over on top of a van. It also says that he was a student pilot that couldn’t pass his medical, so it’s not like that plane is some long-owned prized possession. ETA: from the tail number, it looks like he bought it in 2012. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/37 "2015-08-03T00:57:59Z")
> [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > NY Post says he brought it home in pieces, then reassembled it after the first complaints came in. > > It also says that he was a student pilot that couldn’t pass his medical, so it’s not like that plane is some long-owned prized possession. O…K… Really expensive lawn ornament? Monument to cluelessness? World’s worst driveway tarp? ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/38 "2015-08-03T01:06:46Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > O…K… Really expensive lawn ornament? Monument to cluelessness? World’s worst driveway tarp? Get a lawn jockey and tether the plane to it. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/39 "2015-08-03T01:14:48Z")
I’m going to take Broomstick’s word for it that the plane would need the plugs pulled to prevent it from starting. I have some other ideas, but that would work just fine. Another thing I’d suggest is to get rid of the weights he’s using to keep it in place and epoxy into the driveway with eye bolts. That would keep people from kicking the weights (and the plane) down the driveway if he padlocked cables to them. Anything he can do to show he’s doing everything reasonable to keep the plane as safe as possible is going to be a point in his favor. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/40 "2015-08-03T01:18:34Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > … > Actually, under some circumstances pulling the prop CAN start the airplane/“spin it up”. That is, after all, what hand-propping a plane entails. There are safety features that are supposed to prevent that but if it’s out in the open in a suburban area it’s better to err on the side of caution. > > … Every Cessna pilot knows that you can spin that prop all day long, and unless someone has the key in the ignition set to one or both mags, the mixture set to rich, and most likely the engine primed, it’s not starting. No matter how many kids “spin it up.” > [@Broomstick](#): > > Accidental mishaps are rare (thank Og!) but airplanes don’t need batteries to start. In fact, I used to fly ultralight/sportplane types that had no batteries, you used a pull-start to get the motor and prop going. A lot of early small single-engine airplanes were designed to be started by hand-propping. And, one fine summer day, when I failed to notice an alternator failure and ran the battery completely flat I got home by hand-propping a 4-seat Piper Warrior and then flew it back home without a working electrical system. Which was illegal and something no pilot would ever do. > [@Broomstick](#): > > I did once get a faceful of airplane fuel while walking under a wing, though. Thank goodness I wear glasses, kept it out of my eyes. Airplane fuel? I thought pilots called it avgas? > [@Broomstick](#): > > It’s sort of alarming just how many ways you can hurt yourself with an airplane that’s not moving and not turned on. I’ve never heard of anyone, even a psychotic wino hurting himself on an airplane that’s not moving or “turned on.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743.md?page=3)