# How DARE he park his plane there? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 1, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743 "2015-08-01T19:17:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/41 "2015-08-03T02:53:32Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Every Cessna pilot knows that you can spin that prop all day long, and unless someone has the key in the ignition set to one or both mags, the mixture set to rich, and most likely the engine primed, it’s not starting. No matter how many kids “spin it up.” I may be wrong but I believe the switch grounds the mags to shut them off. That can fail and you have a live mag. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/42 "2015-08-03T03:05:52Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Every Cessna pilot knows that you can spin that prop all day long, and unless someone has the key in the ignition set to one or both mags, the mixture set to rich, and most likely the engine primed, it’s not starting. No matter how many kids "spin it up. You need fuel air and spark to get an engine to start. You don’t prime the engine it won’t have a rich enough mixture to start. However if you want to be a belt and suspenders kind of person pull the leads off the spark plugs. Doesn’t matter what you do with the master switch or fuel. No spark = no start. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/43 "2015-08-03T03:13:55Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > You need fuel air and spark to get an engine to start. > You don’t prime the engine it won’t have a rich enough mixture to start. > However if you want to be a belt and suspenders kind of person pull the leads off the spark plugs. > Doesn’t matter what you do with the master switch or fuel. No spark = no start. You could take the engine out too. But that’s totally unnecessary. A kid is never going to figure out the steps to get fuel to the engine, let alone how to prime it. (you don’t prime it with the throttle) ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/44 "2015-08-03T03:54:28Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > You could take the engine out too. But that’s totally unnecessary. A kid is never going to figure out the steps to get fuel to the engine, let alone how to prime it. (you don’t prime it with the throttle) No, but it’s one more thing he can say to the city council that he’s done to make it safe. However, my original comment about pulling the plugs was just to make sure there’s not compression. If someone turns the prop past a compression stroke, it could move a few degrees (to another compression stroke on another cylinder) on it’s own. _That_ could turn out poorly. Locking the prop would prevent that, pulling the plugs would prevent it as well (except then it could ‘freewheel’ so to speak). The best, and probably easiest, thing for him to do is just to take the prop off the plane, secure the plane to the ground better and put up “no trespassing” signs (specifically the ones I mentioned earlier). Without the prop, even in the unlikely scenario that someone could break into it, hot wire it and start it without a prop (and I’m guessing it can’t be done since I assume the prop is a flywheel), then it’s not going anywhere and the only danger is an axle sticking out the front and some exhaust. But at that point, even if he couldn’t legally have it there I don’t think anyone would say he didn’t take all reasonable precautions to prevent it. At that point it’s not much different than someone stealing a car out of your driveway, crashing it, then blaming you for owning an Ferrari. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/45 "2015-08-03T11:00:10Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Every Cessna pilot knows that you can spin that prop all day long, and unless someone has the key in the ignition set to one or both mags, the mixture set to rich, and most likely the engine primed, it’s not starting. > [@Magiver](#): > > I may be wrong but I believe the switch grounds the mags to shut them off. That can fail and you have a live mag. ^ This. Also, I’ve gotten into rental planes where the the mix is still set on “rich” even after the shut down (sometimes combined with the fuel shut-off set to “off” - you really have to wonder about some folks). Some people are careless, yes, even some pilots. > [@](#): > > Which was illegal and something no pilot would ever do. Oh, right, everyone always follows all the rules all of the time… we actually had a thread on that one some years ago, discussing whether it was illegal or not, ferry permits, and the like. At this point, it was long enough ago that no one in authority is going to ding me for it. > [@](#): > > Airplane fuel? I thought pilots called it avgas? The majority of people reading this forum are not pilots and might not know what “avgas” means, especially those who read English as a second language. “Airplane fuel” is understandable and clear to more people, thus I used the term. Just because I’m a pilot does not mean I’m compelled to use jargon. > [@](#): > > I’ve never heard of anyone, even a psychotic wino hurting himself on an airplane that’s not moving or “turned on.” Right - moving around in a dark hanger and hit the tip of the prop edge-on - it’s not razor sharp but it’s a thin piece of metal. Sure, it was one of those dumb, embarrassing accidents. There are also records of people doing stuff like impaling an eyeball on an antennae, walking into pitot tubes, tripping over wheel struts, and doing other dumb stuff around airplanes. Get distracted, complacent, careless, any combination of them… accidents happen. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/46 "2015-08-03T12:03:11Z")
Wait a minute… In order to save $150/month, he had his plane disassembled, loaded on a truck, driven to his house, unloaded, then reassembled? Unless he has friends who are willing to do all that labor gratis and to supply the truck, I’m guessing he spent more than a couple of months’ rent on this evolution. And to \*reassemble \*it - sorry, I’m changing my mind. I was sympathetic at first, thinking he was able to somehow tow it from a nearby field to his house. But this is looking like a major league dick move. I like airplanes as much as the next pilot (OK, I haven’t flown one since 1978, so I’m kinda no longer current) but suddenly this story smacks of asshole. He could have parked the un-winged plane in his drive and covered it with a truck cover or something similar, and I might have been on his side. Now, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/47 "2015-08-03T12:20:32Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I think it would be _great_ if someone parked a plane in my neighbourhood! I’m with you and the others in the “That would be seriously cool” camp. People are so damn boring. > [@usedtobe](#): > > To a large extent, yes - it looks ridiculous, out of proportion, and is certain to be a kid magnet. What are children to you? The equivalent of rats and cockroaches? And you do understand that the “attractive nuisance” doctrine is only going to hurt the plane owner, not any of his neigbours, right? ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/48 "2015-08-03T13:34:04Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > But I say that armed only with the knowledge that the blade on a lawnmower is the flywheel and that (at least in the case that my shop teacher told me about) a lawnmower with no blade won’t start. Your shop teacher was wrong. Lawn mower engines have a flywheel and will run fine without the blade. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/49 "2015-08-03T13:44:16Z")
> [@FairyChatMom](#): > > Wait a minute… > > In order to save $150/month, he had his plane disassembled, loaded on a truck, driven to his house, unloaded, then reassembled? Unless he has friends who are willing to do all that labor gratis and to supply the truck, I’m guessing he spent more than a couple of months’ rent on this evolution. It’s actually not that hard to find plane-crazy people to help you do that. I know - I’ve helped a number of people disassemble/re-assemble/move airplanes. > [@](#): > > And to \*reassemble \*it - sorry, I’m changing my mind. I was sympathetic at first, thinking he was able to somehow tow it from a nearby field to his house. But this is looking like a major league dick move. Yeah, if you’re going to store an airplane at home having the wings off makes it a lot easier. For instance, you could store it in your garage if you did that. Dick move? Well, maybe there’s a reason this guy is going through a divorce, maybe he’s a dick? ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/50 "2015-08-03T13:46:42Z")
I have a hard time believing you’re a pilot Broomstick. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/51 "2015-08-03T14:19:27Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I have a hard time believing you’re a pilot Broomstick. OK, don’t believe me, I frankly don’t care if you do or not. Strangely enough, I have two logbooks, a license from the FAA, photographic evidence, and quite a few other pilots, including many here, do believe I’m a pilot. I could produce some of the evidence, but you’d probably accuse me of photoshopping the images so why bother? Most of my threads on aviation pre-date you joining this forum, so you probably missed them. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/52 "2015-08-03T15:22:34Z")
> [@Encinitas](#): > > You’d think old Wilford Brimley could afford to keep his plane at the airfield. The diabeetus business isn’t as profitable as it once was. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/53 "2015-08-03T22:54:27Z")
I haven’t looked it up - where is this thing? Note the lack of tie-downs. Airplanes are tied down because, when it moves through air, it moves. It doesn’t matter if the air is stationary and the plane moves, or the plane is stationary and the air moves. IOW: A gust of wind can make a plane jump. With the wings off, it was not a risk. That he actually had them off and then put them back on as spite is proof of both arrogance and incredible stupidity. Not good qualities in a pilot. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/54 "2015-08-04T00:09:06Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Note the lack of tie-downs. What are those straps going down to the ground from each wing and the tail that are shown in the pictures? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/55 "2015-08-04T01:28:20Z")
They’re tie-downs. There are temporary tie-downs which are, well, temporary - they attach to something like a tent stake you drive into the ground, or a heavy weight. There are other tie-downs anchored deeply and permanently into concrete or similar foundations sunk into the ground. The latter are more secure. Tie down “ropes” can be actualy rope, nylon strapping, or metal chains. Again, some are more secure than others. Although with sufficient wind you’re still screwed - I saw a small Cessna that had been hit by a EF0 tornado. The tie-downs (metal chain, in sunk concrete) were still intact, it was the point where they attach to the wings that had ripped out of the wings. The rest wasn’t too bad at first glance, but on closer inspection the tail had been twisted in relation to the front of the fuselage. Totaled. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/56 "2015-08-04T01:33:08Z")
I missed this thread; all the villagers with torches and pitchforks are long gone and I didn’t get to point at Any of them and yell, “Land-Ho…!” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/57 "2015-08-04T01:45:52Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > They’re tie-downs. Yeah I knew that, it was a rhetorical question. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/58 "2015-08-04T04:25:34Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Right - moving around in a dark hanger and hit the tip of the prop edge-on - it’s not razor sharp but it’s a thin piece of metal. Sure, it was one of those dumb, embarrassing accidents. Dark hanger? HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa. Try a hanger lit with (10) 300 watt bulbs and 4 shop lights. Turn around and step into a prop tip and it will slice you open. Terrible thing to have in a neighborhood full of curious kids. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/59 "2015-08-04T06:09:24Z")
Thank God I had better parents than kids today. And was a better parent, my kids got to do a lot of things, they did not / do not mess with others stuff and now my grand kids don’t either. Airplanes in yards was not that unique a thing back then in that place. Lucky me. 😃 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743/60 "2015-08-04T10:28:43Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Dark hanger? HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa. > > Try a hanger lit with (10) 300 watt bulbs and 4 shop lights. Turn around and step into a prop tip and it will slice you open. Terrible thing to have in a neighborhood full of curious kids. You realize that Morgenstern will now declare that you are not a pilot either, right? 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-dare-he-park-his-plane-there/726743.md?page=4)