# How did faith healers in ancient days do what they do **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 9, 2013, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447 "2013-09-09T22:15:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/41 "2013-09-10T17:40:10Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I have read all about her. She was trying to measure HEF (Human Energy Field) which is not used for healing. It is the Life Force Energy that is used for healing. It is the force flowing through your body not the field that maintains your body. There is a difference. One is the aura the other is a tool for you to use. Cite, please, for any actual proof of the existence of either. (Hint: The [Kirlian aura](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirlian_photography) is not a “Human Energy Field,” not being a thing found only around human bodies.) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/42 "2013-09-10T17:42:41Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If I told you the sun comes up in the morning you would probably say prove it. I would say just observe it. So you keep asking me to prove faith healing and I say just observe it. James Randi has done a **lot** of observing it. Guess what? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/43 "2013-09-10T17:48:16Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > So you keep asking me to prove faith healing and I say just observe it. Point to just one specific current case, and I will take an honest look at it. ---
**Author:** ![Strassia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@Strassia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strassia)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/44 "2013-09-10T17:49:10Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > So midichlorians were involved. > > Seriously, do you just make this shit up as you go? > > Why won’t you offer any proof? If it did anything, it would leave evidence behind that can be seen. > > Ftom the Wiki article Czarcasm linked to. > > So the “authorities” in **the field** say you’re wrong. I see what you did there. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/45 "2013-09-10T18:57:11Z")
I can’t prove anything to James Randi skeptics, it just isn’t possible. So you guys win, Randi rules. I am tired of explaining the “how” when no one is listening. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/46 "2013-09-10T19:02:16Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I can’t prove anything to James Randi skeptics, it just isn’t possible. > > So you guys win, Randi rules. > > I am tired of explaining the “how” when no one is listening. You can’t prove jack if you ain’t got jack. Wherever did you get the idea that piling anonymous stories upon unsubstantiated claims would work on a site dedicated to fighting ignorance? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/47 "2013-09-10T19:02:53Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I can’t prove anything to James Randi skeptics, it just isn’t possible. > > So you guys win, Randi rules. > > I am tired of explaining the “how” when no one is listening. You don’t need to explain the how, you need to show proof of works. If someone claims their car can do 200mph, you don’t need to know how the engine works to see proof of the speed. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/48 "2013-09-10T19:08:08Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I am tired of explaining the “how” when no one is listening. When come back bring reality. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/49 "2013-09-10T19:18:37Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I am sure some healers are wannabees while others can actually get the job done. You are always making claims that you can’t substantiate. This might be expected from those on SD that have been here a year or less. You, OTOH, have no excuse. You, by far, write more checks that your ass can’t cash than any other poster on SD I’ve known. Then we continually have to ask you to substantiate it, and you continually crawfishing out of it without ever claiming you’re wrong, but just making up more unsubstantiated bullshit to follow which repeats the cycle. When pressed, you’ll eventually cave in with cites of pseudo-scientists or use more anecdotes which you think still qualifies for good evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/50 "2013-09-10T19:20:31Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > It just ticks me off that **lekatt** , who is always going on about being open minded, obviously dismissed her without knowing anything at all about her. Not sure if it has ever been suggested or not, but seems like there should be a limit of how many times a poster can make a claim without ever having to substantiate it. We can cut some slack to newbies. You would think **lekatt’s** pony would have learned a few more tricks by now. Seems like he exceeds his quota of what should be allowed. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/51 "2013-09-10T21:29:42Z")
> [@razncain](#): > > Not sure if it has ever been suggested or not, but seems like there should be a limit of how many times a poster can make a claim without ever having to substantiate it. We can cut some slack to newbies. You would think **lekatt’s** pony would have learned a few more tricks by now. Seems like he exceeds his quota of what should be allowed. The OP of this thread is **How did faith healers in ancient days do what they do** Now where in hell does it say anything about proof of their accuracy, If anyone is off topic or out of line it is you and the rest of your skeptic friends. But I will bet you will ask for proof of this. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/52 "2013-09-10T21:35:40Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The OP of this thread is > > **How did faith healers in ancient days do what they do** > > Now where in hell does it say anything about proof of their accuracy, If > anyone is off topic or out of line it is you and the rest of your skeptic friends. > > But I will bet you will ask for proof of this. Your posts #16 and #21 are the cause of any supposed hijacking. You don’t get to make unsubstantiated claims then say that questioning them are off-topic. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/53 "2013-09-10T21:37:51Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The OP of this thread is > > **How did faith healers in ancient days do what they do** > > Now where in hell does it say anything about proof of their accuracy, If > anyone is off topic or out of line it is you and the rest of your skeptic friends. > > But I will bet you will ask for proof of this. Obviously, there will be little/no objective evidence for the ‘ancient faith healings’, we can surmise that currently active practicioners of said ‘faith healing’ would have the same tools a thier disposal - which is what you did when you posted this and brought the ‘debate’ to the current times - > [@lekatt](#): > > **I don’t think faith healing has changed any since ancient times. I am sure some healers are wannabees while others can actually get the job done.** > > There are two elements of spiritual healing. One is faith or the placebo effect and the other is the use of energy or vitality. Usually both of these come into play in tandem in the typical healing event. The most effective is energy, spiritual energy. We are basically energy and this energy passes through us all the time. Healing takes place when a person with an excess of energy encounters a person with low energy and a transfer takes place. We have all known people who drain us when we are around them and others that can energize us. Some people know and can feel this energy and use it to help others. > > Jesus was a good example. He used both methods usually saying “your faith has made you whole.”" On one occasion Jesus was touched by a woman with issue. He turned around and said “who touched me, I felt the vitality leave me.” So basically that is the 101 course in healing. \ Now, back up your claims with actual objective evidence or admit that you cannot. Who can ‘currently get the job done’ ? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/54 "2013-09-10T21:38:51Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If I told you the sun comes up in the morning you would probably say prove it. I would say just observe it. So you keep asking me to prove faith healing and I say just observe it. > > The method Emily Rosa uses to measure energy is flawed in many ways. > > Yes I can feel the energy of life sometimes called Ki. > > You cannot judge faith healing until you know how and what it is. > > **Faith healing is done by people and anything done by people is not 100%** This is not telling **how** it’s done but rather that it is **being** done. Prove it. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/55 "2013-09-10T21:41:04Z")
To me, the interesting question is about what time in history was your outcome actually better if you went to a regular physician as opposed to a faith-healing fraud when you were really sick? Reading about some of the medical practices of the past, seems that avoiding the doctors was actively good for your health until reasonably recently … 😃 ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/56 "2013-09-10T21:45:37Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Jesus was a good example. He used both methods usually saying “your faith has made you whole.”" On one occasion Jesus was touched by a woman with issue. He turned around and said “who touched me, I felt the vitality leave me.” So basically that is the 101 course in healing. Snipped by me - Also - if you are reffering to Mark 5:21-42 - where does Jesus say “the vitality left me” ?? - secondly, at the end of the passage, he gave strict orders not to tell anyone - nice that people disregarded that too… ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/57 "2013-09-10T21:49:01Z")
While science based medical care has steadily improved over the centuries, there has been no improvement at all when it comes to faith healing-it’s stuck on the bottom rung, mired in superstition, flim-flam and tradition. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/58 "2013-09-10T21:51:23Z")
> [@simster](#): > > lso - if you are reffering to Mark 5:21-42 - where does Jesus say “the vitality left me” ?? Is he actually making up Bible verses now? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/59 "2013-09-10T21:54:03Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Is he actually making up Bible verses now? Not quite. I looked at several versions and most are a variation of “He felt the (healing) power go forth from him.” So **lekatt** is making up a translation that suits him. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2013, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447/60 "2013-09-10T21:56:12Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Snipped by me - > > Also - if you are reffering to Mark 5:21-42 - where does Jesus say “the vitality left me” ?? > [@](#): > > A large crowd followed and pressed around him. 25 And a woman was there who had been subject to bleeding for twelve years. 26 She had suffered a great deal under the care of many doctors and had spent all she had, yet instead of getting better she grew worse. 27 When she heard about Jesus, she came up behind him in the crowd and touched his cloak, 28 because she thought, “If I just touch his clothes, I will be healed.” 29 Immediately her bleeding stopped and she felt in her body that she was freed from her suffering. > > 30 At once Jesus realized that **power** had gone out from him. He turned around in the crowd and asked, “Who touched my clothes?” > > 31 “You see the people crowding against you,” his disciples answered, “and yet you can ask, ‘Who touched me?’ ” > > 32 But Jesus kept looking around to see who had done it. 33 Then the woman, knowing what had happened to her, came and fell at his feet and, trembling with fear, told him the whole truth. 34 He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be freed from your suffering.” Of course, that’s just one translation. I suppose it might also be rendered as “vitality,” unless Greek has a completely different word for that. Anybody know? I also wonder whether “bleeding” here means hemophilia, or really bad menstrual cycles, or something else. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-faith-healers-in-ancient-days-do-what-they-do/668447.md?page=4)