# How did Gandalf plan on getting into Mordor? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 28, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793 "2010-01-28T18:49:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![furryman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/furryman/32/99_2.png) [@furryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furryman)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/1 "2010-01-28T18:49:16Z")
This is pure speculation of course because it doesn’t even hint about it in the book. Maybe he knew about a secret entrance? Maybe he knew about Cirith Ungol? ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/2 "2010-01-28T19:09:40Z")
Well he knew about Cirith Ungol since he reacts badly to Faramir’s report on Frodo’s planned path. Given his reaction I’d bet he wasn’t planning on passing that near the Morgul Valley or the spider’s lair. I’d wager Gandalf didn’t have a plan and simply hoped that a path would open up as they neared their goal. The Ainur didn’t have perfect knowledge of what would happen in the future and Gandalf, even less so given his incarnation. ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/3 "2010-01-28T19:13:41Z")
To Gandalf, “Hope for a miracle” counts as a plan. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/4 "2010-01-28T19:16:06Z")
All that rock climbing and rappelling Frodo and Sam had to do in the Emyn Muil? That was just a warm-up. Gandalf. Servant of The Secret Fire. Wielder of The Flame of Anor. Master Mountaineer. (edit: in a more serious vein, I wonder whether the Council had any plan at all as to how they were going to get in. Perhaps they (Gandalf and Elrond) had a secret plan but were unwilling to reveal it until it was time. Something involving eagles, I expect.) ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/5 "2010-01-28T19:16:18Z")
He was going to get to the Black Gate, realize there’s no way in, then call on the Eagles for help. You know, like he should have thought of back in Rivendell. ---
**Author:** ![Emily\_Litella](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emily_litella/32/3370_2.png) [@Emily\_Litella](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emily_Litella)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/6 "2010-01-28T19:22:22Z")
Another question: In the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring, he knew that Gollem was tortured to spill the beans about “Hobbit” and “Shire”. How did he find that out? Did he have spies, and if he did, how did they get in and out? Or was there another palintir? ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/7 "2010-01-28T19:25:08Z")
This ties back in to the Bilbo/Smaug thread. Gandalf was a confirmed believer in the theory of divine providence. You just point yourself in the right direction, and eventually, good things happen. Ways open up. Even the most seemingly unlikely strategy will work. Witness his determination from the beginning to go through Moria. I doubt he had any good idea because he couldn’t know what the situation was going to be at the time. Who was still going to be with him, and who was going to go off to Minas Tirith? What was Sauron going to be doing at the time? What about Saruman? With so many variables, he just would have kept chugging along toward the ultimate goal. Better question: what would the Fellowship have done after Lothlorien had Gandalf still been in charge? ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/8 "2010-01-28T19:26:23Z")
> [@Emily\_Litella](#): > > Another question: In the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring, he knew that Gollem was tortured to spill the beans about “Hobbit” and “Shire”. How did he find that out? Did he have spies, and if he did, how did they get in and out? Or was there another palintir? Gollum was released from Mordor and captured by Aragorn near the Dead Marshes and brought to Gandalf who then interrogates him. Gollum is then left in the care of the elves of Mirkwood. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/9 "2010-01-28T19:26:50Z")
> [@Emily\_Litella](#): > > Another question: In the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring, he knew that Gollem was tortured to spill the beans about “Hobbit” and “Shire”. How did he find that out? Did he have spies, and if he did, how did they get in and out? Or was there another palintir? If you will recall, Aragorn manages to capture Gollum in the Dead Marshes, and takes him to the elves in Mirkwood, where he is held for Gandalf to interrogate. It is during the interrogation that Gandalf determines that Gollum made it into Mordor, was captured, tortured, and released. Of course, you won’t recall that if you watched the movies and didn’t read the books, since they didn’t cover that fine detail in the movies. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/10 "2010-01-28T19:27:53Z")
> [@Emily\_Litella](#): > > Another question: In the beginning of the Fellowship of the Ring, he knew that Gollem was tortured to spill the beans about “Hobbit” and “Shire”. How did he find that out? Did he have spies, and if he did, how did they get in and out? Or was there another palintir? He ran across Gollum and asked him. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/11 "2010-01-28T19:31:52Z")
There is an old Vulcan proverb: only Gandalf could go to Mordor ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/12 "2010-01-28T19:35:09Z")
Teleport. C’mon, it’s only a 5th-level spell, so you’d figure a epic-level character with divine rank would know it. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![StoutHearted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@StoutHearted](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StoutHearted)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/13 "2010-01-28T21:11:43Z")
He was simply going to walk into there. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Emily\_Litella](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emily_litella/32/3370_2.png) [@Emily\_Litella](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emily_Litella)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/14 "2010-01-28T21:29:06Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > Gollum was released from Mordor and captured by Aragorn near the Dead Marshes and brought to Gandalf who then interrogates him. Gollum is then left in the care of the elves of Mirkwood. You’re right, it’s long past time for a re-read, starting with The Hobbit. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/15 "2010-01-28T21:29:46Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Teleport. C’mon, it’s only a 5th-level spell, so you’d figure a epic-level character with divine rank would know it. 😉 Whatever happened to _Find the Path_? An epic character ought to have access to Greater Divination spells. ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/16 "2010-01-28T21:49:50Z")
> [@StoutHearted](#): > > He was simply going to walk into there. 😉 You do not simply WALK into MORDOR. GOD. :rolleyes: 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/17 "2010-01-28T22:16:21Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > You do not simply WALK into MORDOR. GOD. :rolleyes: > > 🙂 Sure you do. You totally do. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/18 "2010-01-28T22:18:53Z")
Rumors of Gandalf exclaiming, “I love it when a plan comes together” should be ignored. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/19 "2010-01-28T22:20:40Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > Sure you do. You totally do. Who does Gandalf think he is, Chuck Norris? ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793/20 "2010-01-28T23:13:21Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Who does Gandalf think he is, Chuck Norris? Oh, c’mon! Chuck doesn’t need to drop the One Ring into molten lava; he simply breathes on it and it falls apart. 😛 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-gandalf-plan-on-getting-into-mordor/526793.md?page=2)