# How did Oprah become so powerful? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 20, 2011, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590 "2011-05-20T16:48:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/81 "2011-05-21T23:20:36Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Are you saying that all religious leaders are equal? That there’s nothing inherently sillier about worshiping a Cabbage Patch doll than worshiping Allah, or that moving to a jungle in Guyana or passing out flowers at the airport are no stranger than going door to door as a missionary or tithing 10% of your income? I’m an agnostic but I completely believe some beliefs are stranger and some “holy” men are more transparently charlatans or hypocritical than others. All those things are not equivalent ideas and comparisons, you know. Charlatans and hypocrites are bad. Worshiping a Cabbage Patch doll is almost certainly a sign of mental illness. Worshiping Allah, moving to a jungle in Guyana, going door to door as a missionary, handing out flowers at the airport and tithing 10% of your income are all eqaully valid acts expressing one’s personally and sincerely held belief systems about God and the nature of the universe. Are you really agnostic? > [@](#): > > **Agnosticism** is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity,\*\* but also other religious and metaphysical claims\*\*—is unknown or **unknowable**. I’m an agnostic. So while I do, personally, find some things more believable and likely than others, I don’t dismiss others out of hand..because I’m an agnostic: I don’t know and I don’t think it’s knowable at this point in our evolution. The only reason I singled out the Cabbage Patch doll is because it is a manufactured object, and therefore no one has any reason to believe that it deserves worship. However, if someone who otherwise appears sane expressed a sincere belief that the manufactured object had been revealed to them to contain some spirit or being that chose to inhabit it, I might even consider adding the doll to the list. I just appreciate consistency in one’s logic. If one dismisses the possibility of anything metaphysical, fine. But if you know you don’t know, then you don’t know, and there’s no real reason to think that Christianity might be true but a Universal Mind is ludicrous - the lack of evidence for both is the same. So while you might personally find yourself more persuaded that one is more possible than the other, there is no objective standard for saying that one absolutely IS more possible than the other, so neither genuinely warrants more or less scorn than the other. AS for the Dr. Phil thing, it certainly appears you may be right, but it doesn’t actually make any sense, given that Oprah is the producer of the show, and as such has the power to tell Dr. Phil to not book a guest. So my next query would be the nature of the contract between them…and king world and the other parties. But since part of the contract includes Dr. Phil never airing opposite Oprah, making it clear that the idea of competition was not on the table, it seems likely that Oprah does have the power to stop any unwanted poaching. But your evidence certainly is good… ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/82 "2011-05-21T23:26:43Z")
> [@LegsAkimbo](#): > > As far as I can tell, she (and Ellen) buy their audiences. Show up to be in the audience and you will go home with loot. What’s that about? If they didn’t bribe them to come in, no one would show up? Easily the dumbest remark in the thread so far. Asie from the fact that Oprah had giveaways once a year, do you have some way to explain how she and Ellen “bribe” the people at home to watch and give them their great ratings? > [@](#): > > I have no idea whether or not she deals with women’s issues since I have not seen a single one of her shows. I find her very phony and self-important. How could you possibly “find” her anything at all, never having seen a single show? Do you generally make such conclusive, concrete, not to mention harsh, judgments about things you have absolutely no meaningful knowledge of? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/83 "2011-05-22T00:57:50Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > As long as you are of the opinion that everyone who holds any religious or spiritual beliefs of any kind are idiots, this is valid. Anyone who believes in anything supernatiral lacks critical thinking skills. Anyone who believes in John Edwards an _The Secret_ is a fucking idiot, ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/84 "2011-05-22T01:00:09Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Anyone who believes in anything supernatiral lacks critical thinking skills. Anyone who believes in John Edwards an _The Secret_ is a fucking idiot, Your opinion is duly noted. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/85 "2011-05-22T01:11:58Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > All those things are not equivalent ideas and comparisons. Yes they are. All magical beliefs are equally irrational. > [@](#): > > Are you really agnostic? > I’m an agnostic. So while I do, personally, find some things more believable and likely than others, I don’t dismiss others out of hand..because I’m an agnostic: I don’t know and I don’t think it’s knowable at this point in our evolution. Agnosticism is a position on what can be proven. Much of the woo pushed by Oprah is provable bullshit. > [@](#): > > I just appreciate consistency in one’s logic. If one dismisses the possibility of anything metaphysical, fine. But if you know you don’t know, then you don’t know, and there’s no real reason to think that Christianity might be true but a Universal Mind is ludicrous All magical beliefs are equally irrational. It’s also fatuous to say that we “don’t know” whether some magical beliefs might be true. Impossible things can be safely assumed to be impossible until proven otherwise. You can’t disprove the existence of wood sprites, hobgoblins or Isis either, but we don’t act like those things are entitled to any default presumption of possibility. Non-existnece is the logical default. Belief in magic without evdience is irrational, and being routinely taken in by con artists the way that Oprah constantly gets taken (or holding prayer circles to combat “the forces of darkness” during vampire movies) is fucking DUMB. I bet she’s fallen for Nigerian email scams. That’s no stupider than falling for mediums. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/86 "2011-05-22T01:14:52Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Your opinion is duly noted. It wasn’t an opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/87 "2011-05-22T01:30:47Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > All those things are not equivalent ideas and comparisons, you know. I’m fairly certain that was the specific point he was trying to make. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/88 "2011-05-22T01:57:17Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > It wasn’t an opinion. Of course it was. I realize that you believe that your opinions are Absolute Truth, but that’s just your belief, not reality. Or perhaps it’s more accurate to say that it is your reality, because of course it is. But your reality is not THE reality…again, I recognize that this is outside your understanding, but that’s ok too. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/89 "2011-05-22T01:58:19Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I’m fairly certain that was the specific point he was trying to make. Badly, which is why I made it more specifically. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/90 "2011-05-22T02:00:09Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Impossible things can be safely assumed to be impossible until proven otherwise. Indeed. And assumptions are not facts, they are assumptions. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/91 "2011-05-22T03:48:51Z")
I never watched her show, or bought her magazine, or bought a book or other item she promoted. I don’t think I like her persona or would like her if I met her. But I think she is an incredibly impressive person. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/92 "2011-05-22T05:05:41Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Indeed. And assumptions are not facts, they are assumptions. It is a fact that impossible things are impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/93 "2011-05-22T05:07:14Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Of course it was. No, it was a statement of objective fact. Irrational beliefs show a lack of critical thinking. That’s not an opinion. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/94 "2011-05-22T05:16:01Z")
I agree she does have charisma. I saw some documentary about her that showed a clip from her time as a member of a local TV news team. I can only say that she practically shone personally. It was that obvious. But I’m not a fan. Charisma is not enough to make me buy a product she endorses, send her money, vote for her, find her ideas intriguing and subscribe to her newsletter, etc. And it says nothing about her actual honesty, intelligence or any other quality. But you don’t become a billionaire by being stupid (about business, at least). > [@Stoid](#): > > But your reality is not THE reality. Neither is yours. Or mine. “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn’t go away.” --Philip K. Dick > [@](#): > > Narcississm is not what you all seem to think it is. Or rather, you appear to confuse healthy narcississm with pathological or destructive narcississm. Oprah’s narcississm is of the healthy variety. Rather, your definition of narcissism is different from others. Personally, I confine “narcissism” to a pathology. I wouldn’t call Oprah a narcissist. From the Ebert link above. He was talking to Sophia Loren about a perfume she was endorsing: > [@](#): > > “It doesn’t matter what goes into it, as long as it smells so nice,” she said. > > I have found this a valuable rule over the years. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/95 "2011-05-22T06:07:46Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No, it was a statement of objective fact. Irrational beliefs show a lack of critical thinking. That’s not an opinion. Your opinion on the subject of what constitutes opinion vs. fact, and what actually falls into which category is duly noted. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/96 "2011-05-22T06:09:27Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > Rather, your definition of narcissism is different from others. Personally, I confine “narcissism” to a pathology. I wouldn’t call Oprah a narcissist. I don’t have a personal definition of it. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/97 "2011-05-22T06:10:03Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > An intersting article by [James randi](http://www.randi.org/jr/2007-03/030207harpo.html) on how Oprah fixes the editing and production of her show to promote psychics (including John Edwards and Allison DuBois who are every bit the sleazebags that Sylvia Browne is), and tries to marginalize and villify skeptics. > > Oprah is a piece of crap. Gah! I can’t get behind that, it goes against the very fiber of my being. [del]Oprah.[/del] ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/98 "2011-05-22T06:10:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > It is a fact that impossible things are impossible. Of course. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/99 "2011-05-22T10:37:29Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Badly, which is why I made it more specifically. :dubious: If you say so. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2011, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590/100 "2011-05-22T17:00:38Z")
O.K., Diogenes the Cynic, let me get this straight. Oprah has been the host of a TV show with her name on it for the past 25 years. She has owned a magazine with her name on it and her picture on the cover each issue for the past 11 years. (There’s a second magazine with just “O” on the cover.) She has published five books with her name on the cover. She runs a website with her name prominently displayed. She has a TV network with her name on it. She has a satellite network with her name on it. From these various businesses she has made $2.7 billion dollars, making her the richest American woman with a self-made fortune. You say that this makes her a narcissist, although it doesn’t fit the definition of a psychological pathology. Whatever you call it, it has made her a fortune. You have posted to the SDMB almost 18 times a day for almost 9 years. That’s more total posts than anyone else in the history of the SDMB. Has it made you a fortune? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-did-oprah-become-so-powerful/582590.md?page=6)