How did you run into debt?

Heh, what mortgage? That’s all student loan debt there. And I’m not out of school yet. I’ll hit 160-170k in pure principle by the time I graduate. Add in four years of interest. And then add in another three-five years of interest as I finish my training. I don’t like to think about it, but I’d imagine any amount of interest on a principle that large is going to be substancial.

I don’t have any car debt (17yr old beater), credit card debt (pay it off as I go) or undergrad loans either. I live in a convenient, rather than trendy (or some may argue, safe) area of town. I wear sweatshirts instead of turning up the heat, etc. etc.

I really don’t like thinking about this.

That’s going to feel so great when you pay off the final bill. It doesn’t matter whether that last payment is $1,000 or $10 – the important thing is that you’ll be debt free. Congratulations! :slight_smile:

My only debt-related payments each month are for my student loan (which I consolidated a few years ago) and my car loan. I don’t have any credit cards. If I need to make a big purchase, I get financing through my bank. Otherwise I save up for things that I want.

I’m always amazed when my friends routinely whip out the Visa or Mastercard to pay for lunches, drinks, etc. It seems that credit cards have become an alternative to budgeting. I worry sometimes about this instant gratification mindset.

Excellent rules. I’ll add a third trick that I use:

  1. Treat credit card debt as if it were coming straight out of your bank account. That means that every time you use a credit card, you record the debt as if it were a check or debit. I am not allowed to buy anything with my credit card until I have written it in my check register and subtracted out the amount. No money, no purchase. And if you don’t currently keep a check register or running balance of your bank account, you need to start doing it. Willful ignorance plays a big part in debt getting out of control.

I had some bad spending habits, but I could have paid the debts those put me into…
until…
A 5.25% rate I could get on a mortgage loan…
caused me to buy a house I could afford…
if myself and the wife each wife worked 40 hours a week, and no big new bills happenned.
Then my wife lost her job, had a brother commit suicide [makes you kind of bummed out during a job search!], and had serious medical problems.
After that happenned… bankruptcy city.
Now I’m working two jobs and putting the wife through college.
There are about 5 mistakes or bad luck events in my story.
If you take any 2 of those events out, I’d have been able to work my way out of debt.
The ultimate cause? Poor planning.
If you set up your finances such that you only need 50% of your income to pay mandatory expenses, you’ll be fine.
I make enough money that I COULD have done that, but I was young and didn’t realize how tricky being a grown-up was going to be.

Your parents sound like mine. Except that they spent all their disposable income at the tavern. Credit cards didn’t exist then, but they had store credit and got loans from a finance company. They didn’t start saving until they were in their 50’s and by then, they had enough money that they never needed to budget.

I think the first paragraph shows part of the problem – there’s more stuff to buy, and more choices among all that stuff. When I was growing up (get off my lawn!), there was one brand of tennis shoe – PF Flyers. Jeans were Levis or Wranglers. They were cheap enough that anyone could afford them. Clothing brands weren’t important until the 70’s.

Some people had nicer houses, cars, and furniture than others, but there was easy credit, if you wanted to compete, you got a better job, or a second job. Or you borrowed from rich relatives, spent your inheritance before you got it.

My husband and I both come from poor families, but went to a fairly expensive college (which is where we met, freshman year). Aside from a few thousand dollars donated by my grandmother and a thousand or so a year that he managed to blackmail from his father, we were on our own to cover the cost. Both BSs were heavily subsidized by scholarships and grants, but of course loans made up the difference. His living expenses were covered by those loans, while I received $50 a week from my father in child support (we - my mother and father and me - went to court to have it switched from my mother to me).

We graduated with about $1000 of accumulated credit card debt (mostly from schoolbooks and other supplies), decent credit, and a little over $50,000 in student loans to pay back over periods ranging from 3 to 10 years. We had decent full time jobs in New Jersey (well distant from our parents, so unfortunately we couldn’t live at home if we wanted to), but no car or furniture, or anything to our names other than clothes, personal items, and basic dorm accoutrements.

We found a small, very basic one bedroom apartment (which required a down payment and security deposit, and northern NJ is a very expensive area), bought one decent used car (Phill drove me to work and picked me up every day, in addition to his commute, for a couple of years), and bought the necessities of life that we didn’t get donated by family (sofa, lamps, blinds, work appropriate clothing, etc.).

And after all of the set up costs for our lives together, the sad truth was that our incomes still weren’t quite enough to cover our bills each month. So we used our credit cards to buy gas and groceries, and fell a little more in debt each month. And then I got a raise, and he got a new job that paid a little better, and I got another raise, and after a year and a half we made enough to cover what we spent each month. And a year after that, we were making enough to whittle down a little of the outstanding debt each month. And each year our incomes went up, and we could whittle a little faster.

So now, nine and a half years later, we own a house (with a monthly mortgage payment of roughly the same amount we were spending for a two bedroom apartment), two cars that were new when we bought them, a large chunk of money built up in our 401(k)s, and some fairly nice personal stuff. We also still have about $30,000 in credit card debt, two car loans, our remaining student loans, an outstanding loan against my 401(k) (taken for the downpayment towards the house), and very, very, very good credit.

Our current financial plan:

  • Christmas and other extras are coming out of our yearly profit sharing and bonuses (as normal the last several years).
  • IRS return goes to pay off either a credit card or the 401(k) loan, or is held onto in case of emergency (last year was a new water heater when ours died).
  • The student loans will be paid off in November next year. The freed up cash goes towards increasing the credit card payments each month after that.
  • My husband’s car will be paid off in December next year. Again, the freed up cash goes towards increasing the credit card payments each month after that.

Once we get to that point next year (or if we encounter a financial emergency such as a major medical debt), we will look at our total outstanding debt again and readjust our plan as necessary. We’re currently projecting ourselves as debt free (aside from the mortgage) in anywhere from three to five years.

Unlike most people who have been posting in this thread, I don’t feel ashamed of our debt, or any real regret about it. Sure, there have been individual financial decisions that we’ve made over the last decade+ that we could have made better. We didn’t really need that motorcycle or that trip to Orlando. But, by and large, we’ve made the conscious decision to invest in our future. And we’ve been responsible enough to pay the money we owe. And we’ve been able to live a lifestyle that no one else in our family can afford, and I can help my mom pay her heating bill each winter, and pay for my father’s phone and TV when he’s in the hospital for two weeks. And we’ll probably be helping out on his cousin’s school bill when he starts college next year.

That’s not to say that I think that everyone should do it the way that we did. But it worked for us.

By the way, my step-mother (and by extension, my father when they still lived together), has the OTHER kind of debt. She believes that the people and companies that she owes money to don’t deserve to get paid since they have more money than her (boggles), so she withholds payment even when she has it, and then pays as little as she can get away with. :confused: :mad: :frowning:

For me, it was student loans and … beer. I developed a major drinking problem in my early 20s, and by my mid-late 20s I had only two bills as far as I cared: rent and beer. I completely ignored my student loan and credit card payments.

The shit hit the proverbial fan about a year after I quit drinking when, in the same month, my roommate bailed on me without paying his half of a large winter electric bill and one of the collection agencies started garnishing my wages. Suddenly, I found myself with just enough money to pay either the next month’s rent or the past due electric bill. Since having electricity would do me no good without an apartment, and having the apartment was no good without electricity (I actually spent my last two weeks in that place with no electricity), I ended up paying neither, and simply moving out of the apartment and into the local homeless shelter. I spent the next eight years in the shelter, and managed to clear most, but not all, of my debt.

Was working part time while in school part time and got hurt. Had no insurance and new job wont cover pre-existing condition so I’m paying off as much as I can monthly with several thousands more to go.

I went into debt when I married a disabled man. (Expected medical expenses, rather than unexpected. It doesn’t help when they’re expected if you still can’t afford them.)

His bills ate up my savings, then started to pile up the debt. I don’t even know how high the debt was at its highest point. It’s about 40 thousand now.

Getting married was the stupidest financial decision I’ve ever made in my life.

I’d do it again.

My first go-round was medical. Collapsed at work, taken to emergency room, had all the symptoms of a stroke so they did a whole shitload of tests. The company I worked for did not offer health benefits. Turned out the symptoms were due to stress, unfortunately California had just changed the worker’s comp rules such that stress claims could not be made if you had been working for a company less than a year–I was at ten months tenure. Company decided they didn’t want to deal with all this and fired me. Took three months to get another job, had to put all the bills onto a credit card, because kids gotta eat and have utilities, not to mention a roof over their heads. Ended up filing bankruptcy.

Ten years later, bankruptcy discharged, I got many, many offers for credit cards but every single one of them was roundfiled. I took out a 12 month high interest loan to buy my van so I could get a higher percentage commission as an owner/operator delivery courier. Paid the van off three months early, then made a bunch of money–enough to buy my house. I was approved for a certain amount, but wouldn’t even look at any house that was more than 70% of the approved amount. Thirty year fixed mortgage that I’ve refied twice for no fees (I love my mortgage company!) to drop my interest rate from 8.5% to 6%, used a first time buyer program so my out of pocket expense for my house was $500 earnest money–cash. Still no credit cards to this day. I run into situations constantly where in spite of the fact that I can get a loan for a car or a house I can’t get a 90 days same as cash loan for a couch because I don’t have any credit card history since the bankruptcy. I tend to save for things.

Then a company I worked for screwed up my withholding and I had to go 'round with the IRS and state tax board to get that cleared up–penalties suck! So I ended up getting a home equity line of credit for 10K because the interest rate is fixed at 8.25% which is infinitely better than any credit card I’ve ever been offered (not to mention what the tax people charge! :eek: ) and the minimum payment is also fixed–hundred bucks a month, but I always pay more than that and any windfall goes into paying that down. There have been a few purchases on that–mostly stuff for the house that’s too spendy to be handled out of a paycheck, occasionally car repairs. I’m in debt less than half the limit and won’t raise the ceiling on it barring a huge catastrophe. My first mortgage + LOC balance is is about 65% of the county assessed value of my house, about 50% of the actual market value.

I have two cars that are almost twenty years old–I have an excellent mechanic who works on the barter system for computer repair, maintenance and upgrades. No high payments, no high insurance rates, very low repair costs compared to newer cars. My only real vices are high speed internet and electronic gadgets and toys, but the SO is a wizard at cobbling together “outmoded” (read: inexpensive) hardware to do cutting edge things so that habit isn’t nearly as ruinous as it could be. We don’t have cable tv–do have cell phones but no home line so it works out.

My only great fear is medical–again, I’m working for a company that doesn’t have health care available and if I get hurt or sick we’re basically fucked. I really hope that if something catastrophic happens again I just die of it because I absolutely do NOT want to go through that shit again–twenty years older. And they say the American health care system is the best in the world and universal health care isn’t needed. :rolleyes:

You seem to be fairly well skilled in handling your money…have you considered that they DO sell health insurance to individuals for catastrophic events? It won’t make your occasional checkups any cheaper, but it WILL catch the $125,000 severe event.

What are your experiences with medical insurance quotes for catastrophic events? I was turned down once but picked up a job/insurance and never followed up on it. I wanted to challenge the process of rejection without any form of counter offer. I was expecting an offer of higher premiums but was rejected outright. I’m hardly a medical basket case.

Urgh not me.

It started off with a small bill to a telephone company. I paid it off a little every week, then though I’d pay it off all at once with a CC. Why? I don’t know, it made no difference really to the payment, perhaps made it a little worse adding on interest. My plan was to save up and pay off a lump sum to the CC each month rather than to the phone company each week.

So the bill was paid and I used the card’s cheque book once or twice to pay rent then to buy something on EBay. Then I got another card with the intention of transferring the balance to pay it off at a better rate. I just ended up maxing two cards :rolleyes:

Got a loan to pay them off, kept the cards and ended up with a loan and three cards maxed out :rolleyes: x2.

I finally got it together and got another loan (yes, another one) to pay off everything and this time I’ve managed to get rid of the cards and I’m just paying off that one loan. I’d have a car by now, a nice one, if I’d used the money wasted on the cards on a brand new motor. Embarrassing that I’ve allowed the debt to spiral to over twenty times what it was originally :o

Lesson learned for life…

It’s spendy and quite frankly I don’t think it’s all that good of a deal. With no kind of wellness or preventative care available the likeliest scenario healthwise is that something will go very wrong with me requiring long term care and those insurance companies are pretty notorious for figuring out how they don’t have to take care of you after you’ve paid the premiums. With a significant portion of my monthly budget going to what is most likely a worthless panacea of an insurance policy rather than into better food and taking care of myself I think I’m more likely to hurt my chances than help. So the next most likely scenario is a nasty car accident, but I’m banking on my experience and skills to maximize my chances of surviving one intact–same reasoning that applies to the decision NOT to carry comprehensive/collision insurance on twenty year old vehicles–worse than Vegas odds for a minimal possible payout!

I found that in order to pay less than 300/month (3600/year! Half as much as I pay for my mortgage!) the deductible goes up to 5-10K, the copayment is 30% of everything and you have to pay the deductible first! So in order to actually GET any health care that isn’t due to something huge and sudden I have to pay 1000-3000/year in premiums, PLUS 5-10K in deductibles–in order to get a 70% reduction in any further fees. Not to mention that as soon as I get sick I don’t have a job any more, so my ability to pay for the insurance policy goes bye-bye. Fuck, why not just shoot myself? Bullets are cheap!

Not to mention that health plans do NOT commonly cover dental which is what I need more than standard health insurance. Do not EVEN get me started on how deficient individual dental plans are!

Really, at my level of income ten thousand is just as catastrophic as a hundred thousand or a million–so I just take my chances and try not to get sick. The house is the only large asset I have going, once that’s eaten up I’m done anyway.

Well, THIS is cheerful! Paging Captain Bringdown! :stuck_out_tongue:

I have a friend who makes more money than me, but never seems to have any spending money. He’s 30-something and lives in an apartment, I tell him he needs to invest in a house or some real estate if he’s not going to save money any other way, like a savings account. I get the impression that he spends his money on beer, cigarettes, premium TV channels (HBO, Starz, etc.), and cell phone bills.

My ex wife is terrible with money, she doesn’t make much but is always buying shoes, clothes, and getting her hair and nails done. And she’s constantly on the road, in a truck that probably gets 20mpg. She drives her boyfriend to work in one town that’s 25 miles away, then drives to another town 20 miles from there to her job, then picks him up after she gets off work. All that gas ain’t cheap. At least she doesn’t have any credit cards, it’s all cash she’s wasting.

Just a note… I’m one of those people who uses the credit card to pay for every little thing. I do it for the rewards, and I pay the bill in full each month and have never carried a balance. Hopefully I’m not the only one!

Nope, you’re not. I put every possible expense on my credit card and pay the bill in full. Not only does it make management and spend tracking easier for me, I spend enough to accumulate decent rewards. I also work for the credit card company whose product I use. :wink:

No one I work with, nay, no one I know at my company carries a balance.

My only two debt items are my mortgage and student loans. One year of grad school set me back $50k. It will take me another 22 years to finish paying that down.

My wife and I just bought a new apartment in the past month and sold our old one. Although we got excellent prices on both transactions, we took a grade A beating due to taxes, fees, and bullshit & mayhem regarding the deal. Our nest egg is effectively gone. My wife is also disabled, and is only able to work a few hours per week. If she has a major medical issue this year, it might sink us.

As do I. And I pay it off in full every month. I like getting the miles.

I never used credit cards for day-to-day expenses until gas prices went up and you were expected to go in and pay before pumping gas. There’s no way I’m wasting my time standing in line behind people buying cigarettes and lottery tickets just to hand them my $20.