# How difficult would it be to disappear today in the USA? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 3, 2018, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684 "2018-09-03T12:08:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2018, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/41 "2018-09-05T05:38:52Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > Also, many (most?) DMVs would take your your fingerprint, and conceivably find a match if you already have gotten an ID with your true identity. As I understand it, unless you live inside a CBS-TV cop show, it’s functionally impossible that your biometrics alone can be used to identify you. They’re not going to have any clue from the fingerprints themselves that you have changed your name, and even if you give them some other clue that that has happened, comparing your biometrics to every other person you could possibly be is cost-prohibitive. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2018, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/42 "2018-09-06T15:14:53Z")
First off; if you want to disappear from the police, that will be really tough. Sooner or later you will have contact with the law, a routine identity check will be made, and the red light flashes. Living any sort of normal life means that you in various databases and your face is on the surveillance videos. The Chinese have started checking public surveillance footage with face recognition software to find known people who are wanted. The software does not always work, but it’s creepy, and you risk getting caught sooner or later. How far behind is the USA? Getting ID of any kind, such as a driving license or a passport, is very risky. I read that some long-escaped prisoners were rounded up when face recognition software was used on the application photos. Without those, you cannot drive or leave the country. You have committed an offense if you try to get ID under a false name, and you ill be picked up if it is under your real name if the police are looking for you. Stealing an identity would work for a while, but with the amount of electronic cross-checking that goes on you will be picked up sooner or later, and then you have to try to explain why you committed an offense. Live somewhere remote? OK, if you like the lifestyle, but if the place is small, then everybody knows everybody. Life as a vagrant? Is that an improvement over your current situation? Not on the lam? The suggestions already given above sound best; move away and use another name - maybe a different first name would do. That would work best in a big city. I get the PT information about paying less/no taxes and living abroad. It sounds great, but it is not that easy. What you really need for that is a network of contacts so that you can switch countries at least twice a year and avoid any tax liability, but have cheap places to live. Unless the police are looking for you, nobody knows where you are. Probably this is the best solution if your reason for moving off is to avoid an unwanted spouse who won’t give a divorce. After the divorce will be too late if you are legally required to pay alimony. Again, take care to avoid breaking any regulations or falling foul of court orders before you head off. Nobody will bother looking for you if you have a clean record. You can of course go to a Third World country such as India, maybe some of the Latin American countries as well, and just stay there illegally and under the radar. That is OK up to a point. Where the point lies is a matter of personal taste. You have more money? Maybe head off to Monaco - but it is a very expensive place to live. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/43 "2018-09-07T04:27:50Z")
If the movies have taught us nothing else, it’s that every town has some seedy bar where the local document forger hangs out. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/44 "2018-09-07T04:44:44Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > MIght be as good, might be stored improperly, too old, etc. > Pretty much true. The same drugs are sold for much less in other countries than they are in the US. > Walmart insulin is perfectly fine and effective. I don’t know why anyone would claim it’s nowhere near as good. It’s the same version of Regular and NPH that’s been used for decades to treat insulin and help diabetics. > > Now the Walmart NPH won’t be the fancy long-acting insulins like Lantus, purported to last for 24 hours or more (but not found to be particularly more effective than NPH, tho it was until recently priced to be 10 x more expensive). > > Nor will the Walmart Regular be the ultra-fast acting insulins like the novologs and humalogs. Which can be more convenient for _some_ diabetics in some cases. Again, at 10+ x the cost of good old Regular. > > But it’s getting harder and harder for diabetics to get access to the low priced versions anymore. For one thing, the prices are getting jacked up by a LOT of manufacturers of these versions. For another, some health care systems (like those in prisons) are no longer allowed by Walmart and similar discount retailers to buy tons of cheap insulin there. They must use the institutional suppliers, whose prices are much higher. > > It’s not a good situation. > > But don’t diss NPH and Regular. :mad: I was in school when the old animal insulins were being phased out. I’ll never forget the elderly man who came in to pick some up while I was doing rotations, and he said, “I’ve been using this for 42 years. I don’t know what I’ll do if it’s gone.” Change his regimen, I guess, which isn’t always a good thing. The first time I ever rung up insulin, I was a teenage Target cashier in 1980, and even though I was years away from deciding I wanted to be a pharmacist, I knew what it was, and I called the pharmacy to ask if there was a mistake because it was $6.28. Nope, that was the correct price. I kinda figured that something that important would be, like, $300 or something. And now it is. I read about some people who were stranded in China during WW II (IIRC, missionaries and their families) and while this area was relatively unaffected by the war, they couldn’t get commercially produced insulin for a while, and asked the local butchers to save the pancreases and found someone who had enough knowledge of chemistry to extract the insulin. It wasn’t pure or standardized, but it did keep them alive, and when pharmaceutical-grade insulin became available again, they held onto each other and cried tears of joy. Now back to our regularly scheduled programming… I suppose disappearing would be possible IF someone was willing to live a cash-only existence, and figured out a way to pull it off. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/45 "2018-09-07T05:29:05Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > I’ve been to India. Tall white guy with red hair. Real hard for me to blend in. And Indians stare at foreigners the way it is. Even in a country of over 1 billion I just don’t think I’d be comfortable hiding out there. Plus don’t get me started on how much I hated the place, and I was all over that country. > > But YMMV. :dubious: More a case of you weren’t trying to hide. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/46 "2018-09-07T05:53:35Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > If the movies have taught us nothing else, it’s that every town has some seedy bar where the local document forger hangs out. Unfortunately the local scammers also hang out there and they are more than willing to take your money giving you nothing of value or simply disappearing. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/47 "2018-09-07T11:24:54Z")
My guess is that if you are not visible in the electronic world it would be very hard to find you. Avoid the social media and the forums. I would like to locate some friends from my past, in the nicest possible way, and I can’t find them. They haven’t changed their names or anything, and I know where they used to live, but I still can’t find them. I read that this is a requirement for the FBI; avoid anything that you are known for, including your pastimes. Things like scuba diving or flying, or something very unusual, would be relatively easy to scrutinize. Also, you have a big problem if you are known to need some sort of medication. That’s how the head of the Luminoso Senderoso (Shining Path) got nabbed in Peru. Actually, even with the police after you, people still disappear. One or two of the German Baader-Meinhof gang turned up in France only a few years, where they had lived quietly for over 20 years. The irony is that they adopted the bourgeois lifestyle that they had so despised. What did they do? Practically nothing. They just kept off the radar, did nothing to attract notice. They were found by chance. And there are other members of the gang still at large, probably in Germany, but who knows. It just comes down to one thing; if they are no court orders or arrest warrants out for you, the police will at most file a missing persons report, if anyone cares. If you want to disappear for financial reasons, then you need to look at the PT literature and see whether it is worth the bother. The point that the PT crowd emphasize is that you need to do something \*\*\*before \*\*\*you get into trouble. Afterwards you will have the law on your heels. If you have money and can get it out of the USA, followed by your good self, then the world is your oyster - if you have enough money. You still have the problem that the IRS taxes US citizens worldwide and it is really difficult to give up US citizenship and acquire another passport and citizenship legally. It all boils down as to why you want to hide. Bear in mind that it probably means abandoning your friends and relatives. Well, mostly. The gangster “Whitey” Bulger joined his relatives for Christmas for many years, even though there were search warrants out for him. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/48 "2018-09-07T17:52:15Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > **Moderating** > > Let’s not provide detailed advice on how to break the law or forge documents. > > Colibri > General Questions Moderator > [@pkbites](#): > > I meant to add “don’t try this at home” 😃 Plus, doesn’t the SSN sequence tell you roughly how old the number is? I would imagine assorted people who come across your number who might have even a passing familiarity with the system would say “Huh? This looks like a recently issued number!” Then there’s the line in \*Parker \*where Penelope Cruz says to Jason Latham, “I did a credit check on you and until 6 months ago you didn’t exist.” I suspect any attempt to do anything credit-wise, like renting an apartment from a large company or getting a credit card - going to arouse suspicion. I read that even some employers do credit checks on prospective employees. (Don’t hire someone who’s always got money problems…) So are you just trying to avoid old friends and family, or any serious attention? The “use a dead baby’s ID” is very old, it was a plot point in the “Day of the Jackal” novel and original movie. I had read that after 9/11 the authorities had made additional efforts to ensure that they could catch such attempts at fake IDs. As for India, etc. - on a short visit to India I found it a very nice place, but my impression is you don’t want to be there without a decent income. (YMMV) Plus, we are spoiled in North America where it seems there is not (yet) exit controls at the borders. I have to fill out a comprehensive Visa and pay a fee to simply visit India as a tourist, and it was checked coming and going. Most third world countries (actually, most other countries) seem to have all sorts of departure checks; I do wonder what happens to foreigners who grossly overstay their welcome. Even Tanzania was doing photos and 10-fingerprints for arriving tourists. (I did hear story from someone who worked for a company in Indonesia on a 6-month term. They warned - “leave before the last day on your visa.” In the pre-revolution days, apparently one fellow had planned to depart the last day. They pulled him aside for questioning at the airport, until after midnight at which point they arrested him for overstaying his visa, and he sat in jail until the head office realized there was a problem - and paid the appropriate, now much larger bribe to get him out of jail.) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/49 "2018-09-07T18:04:57Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > … become an accountant… I’d rather just kill myself. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/50 "2018-09-07T18:09:42Z")
Remember the U.S. has 12 million or so illegal aliens. How could this possibly be if it is so difficult to disappear in the U.S. as some posters here seem to think? And remember most of them look different from mainstream white Americans. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/51 "2018-09-07T19:06:16Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > I’d rather just kill myself. And as someone once said… “What’s th difference between an auditor and an accountant?” “An auditor is someone with the training to be an accountant, but lacking the personality…” ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/52 "2018-09-07T20:24:44Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > The gangster “Whitey” Bulger joined his relatives for Christmas for many years, even though there were search warrants out for him. Whitey Bulger had FBI agents helping him. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/53 "2018-09-07T20:51:17Z")
Who are you trying to disappear from, why, and what kind of life you want to lead, and where, makes a huge difference. Like there’s a world of difference between disappearing from some local lowlives that you used to hang around with, avoiding the mob after informing on them, avoiding your direct family, and avoiding the police or feds after doing something to piss them off. And it’s pretty easy to vanish into a life of day labor or petty crime and live entirely on cash, but harder to live a regular on the books life with a fake identity, and even harder to live as some kind of public figure, and even harder to make an identity that will stand up to serious police scrutiny. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/54 "2018-09-07T21:05:30Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > My guess is that if you are not visible in the electronic world it would be very hard to find you. Avoid the social media and the forums. I would like to locate some friends from my past, in the nicest possible way, and I can’t find them. They haven’t changed their names or anything, and I know where they used to live, but I still can’t find them. Check places like [findagrave.com](http://findagrave.com) or the Social Security Death Index to see if they’re still alive. Sadly, I’ve “found” a few people from my past that way. ☹ There are a few people I looked for, and it seemed that their only online presence was an address that may or may not be current, and if they want it that way, that’s how it should be. If they want to contact me, they know how. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2018, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/55 "2018-09-07T22:58:22Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > My guess is that if you are not visible in the electronic world it would be very hard to find you. Avoid the social media and the forums. I would like to locate some friends from my past, in the nicest possible way, and I can’t find them. They haven’t changed their names or anything, and I know where they used to live, but I still can’t find them. I signed up for [Beenverified.com](http://Beenverified.com) to do this and discovered 7 people I was close to years ago had died. That was a bad weekend. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2018, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/56 "2018-09-08T00:28:17Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > I signed up for [Beenverified.com](http://Beenverified.com) to do this and discovered 7 people I was close to years ago had died. That was a bad weekend. I started a thread about this a while back. > **[That explains it. 8( \[What ever happened to... untimely deaths of random...](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=698914)** > > In the late 1980s, I knew a very interesting man who was a few years older than me through a club we were both in (we were both in our 20s). I even asked him for a date; he declined, but IDR why. :o I wondered what ever became of him, and just plain... ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2018, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/57 "2018-09-09T00:54:19Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Remember the U.S. has 12 million or so illegal aliens. It’s not that they have disappeared, its just that no one is looking for them. If immigration wanted to, they could scoop them up like _Soylent Green._ ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2018, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/58 "2018-09-09T23:12:24Z")
Just a couple of thoughts: The idea some of you have to leave the U.S. and hide in a foreign land just seems completely unthought out to me. Unless one has some serious connections to another country like family and a fluent knowledge of the language I think moving out of the U.S. would trip someone up faster than just staying here and moving out of the area they were from. And taking over the identity of someone else, living or dead, is not a permanent fix and will also quickly trip you up. Even if you keep changing said identities. I suppose if one were trying to evade authorities they have to move quick and dirty. But a planned disappearance could be set up months, even a year ahead of time. Alternate ID obtained in another state, etc take time to do covertly. And then when one makes the big move they can slip right into their new person with nothing more to do. Also, I highly doubt the drones working at the DMV or the human resource dept of a company have deep access to Social Security records. If the person at the DMV counter believes you are who you say you are they aren’t going to go any further than putting the SS number down on the form. And unless you come across as a foreigner the hiring man probably isn’t going to pay attention to the number sequence of a Social Security card. Disappearing in America is a lot harder today than it was 30 years ago, but not as hard as some are making it out to be.\* \*I had an in-law pull it off. And she did it for over 20 years. That’s why this topic fascinates me so. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2018, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/59 "2018-09-10T05:53:57Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > The idea some of you have to leave the U.S. and hide in a foreign land just seems completely unthought out to me. Unless one has some serious connections to another country like family and a fluent knowledge of the language I think moving out of the U.S. would trip someone up faster than just staying here and moving out of the area they were from. Again, not true. Thailand and, increasingly these days, Cambodia are used for just that. Outlaws have managed to hide out in Thailand for a good long time. That’s not to say the law never catches up with them, but it can take a long time, and they don’t catch everyone. For example, I remember one long-running farang (Western) bar owner who used to tell everyone there was some minor reason why he could not return to his country. He was always vague about it but left a definite impression that it might be related to taxes maybe or even a lawsuit. He lived in Pattaya for many, many years. Then one day Interpol took him away. It turns out the “minor reason” was murder. This is one example of several similar ones I’ve known. And there are many others I’ve always felt they were hiding out but could not be sure. Thailand attracts that sort of crowd, and it is easy for a foreigner to set up there. Or at least used to be. Thailand is tightening up on being used as a hideout but still has a long way to go, and Cambodia is starting to take up the slack. I’ve also heard the Philippines does not have an extradition treaty with the use and that it is being used in a similar manner, although that information may not be up to date now. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2018, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684/60 "2018-09-10T06:49:03Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Again, not true. So say a middle class white guy living in Chicago wants to drop out. He’s had it with his battle axe wife but doesn’t want to pay her alimony or child support because he’s already up to his eye balls in debt. He’s never really been anywhere outside the mid-west. But you’re saying that instead of maybe disappearing and starting over in the U.S. with another ID he should go to Thailand or Cambodia, or some other place this guy has never been and he’ll be better off than staying in his own country where he’s comfortable moving around. I don’t buy it. I’m a very well traveled person and even I would feel more secure disappearing in America. I have relatives in Germany and speak some German and I wouldn’t feel comfortable hiding out there. Me thinks you give the average shmoe too much credit in their ability to adapt. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-difficult-would-it-be-to-disappear-today-in-the-usa/820684.md?page=4)