# How do I go about renouncing my U.S. citizenship? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [February 22, 2008, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689 "2008-02-22T04:24:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/1 "2008-02-22T04:24:24Z")
An oldie but a goodie: [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a4\_229.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a4_229.html) An earlier thread that may be of interest (I referred to the _Manashian_ case in post 14): [Can I renounce my citizenship? - Factual Questions - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=365078) And lastly, a typographical suggestion: the references to the U.S. State Department are inconsistent. Usually it’s (properly) capitalized. However, it’s lowercase in numbered paragraph (3) of Cecil’s column, numbered paragraph (5) of Jose Diaz’s story, and in [Little Ed’s bracketed reference]. * * * MODERATOR COMMENT: This thread is from 2008, update in Post #25 in 11/2013 and again in post #26 in 2/2014 – CKDH ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/2 "2008-02-23T02:34:44Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] And lastly, a typographical suggestion: the references to the U.S. State Department are inconsistent. Usually it’s (properly) capitalized. However, it’s lowercase in numbered paragraph (3) of Cecil’s column, numbered paragraph (5) of Jose Diaz’s story, and in [Little Ed’s bracketed reference]. [/QUOTE] Looked into it, being one of the parties to the correspondence in question. In this case there is a difference between the online material and the print published version – In the paperback _The Straight Dope Tells All_, pages 231-234, it is properly capitalized, so it may be that the online version was copied more immediately from drafts/e-mails before the style editing for publishing. My first correspondence with Cecil and later with Zotti on the issue was in '97 (that’s before I joined the SDMB but I was already a regular at alt.fan.cecil-adams) and I would not be surprised it did go out missing that. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2008, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/3 "2008-02-24T14:34:06Z")
I point out that since this column was first produced it has been through more than one editor in more than one location including the Chicago Reader, AOL, and Ballantine Books. All have their own editors and their own styles. Lemme ask Ed what to do in this instance. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2008, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/4 "2008-02-24T15:50:29Z")
> [@](#): > > (2) Apply for citizenship somewhere else. Strictly speaking this is optional, in the sense that it’s optional to put on the parachute before you jump out of the plane. But if you’re a stateless person living abroad and you get in a jam with the local authorities, or you want to get a passport to travel to yet another country (or back to this one), you’re up fecal matter creek. What if you renounce your citizenship and you haven’t applied for citizenship elsewhere? You’re hanging out in Italy or someplace, and suddenly you’re not a U.S. citizen. The Italian (or wherever) government says, ‘You must leave.’ But as pointed out, you don’t have a passport. Do they deport you? Where to? Or do they lock you up as an illegal immigrant until such time as you can find someplace to go (while being locked up)? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2008, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/5 "2008-02-24T16:01:01Z")
OK, I hadn’t read the second link when I posted that. That link had a link to a government page. > [@](#): > > Nonetheless, renunciation of U.S. citizenship may not prevent a foreign country from deporting that individual back to the United States in some non-citizen status. So in the scenario above, the government would (or could) deport the ex-citizen back to the U.S. But would the U.S. be required to accept him? I know that there have been people confined for years here in prisons while awaiting a determination of their status. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2008, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/6 "2008-02-24T17:03:14Z")
There’s always the guy whose story was fictionalized in the Tom Hanks movie _The Airport_: [Has a Guy been Stuck in a Paris Airport.. - Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=288643) ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2008, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/7 "2008-02-25T14:10:42Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] There’s always the guy whose story was fictionalized in the Tom Hanks movie _The Airport_: [Has a Guy been Stuck in a Paris Airport.. - Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=288643) [/QUOTE] The movie was _The Terminal_, of course. Duh. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/8 "2010-04-26T03:10:23Z")
Looks like there’s an uptick in American expats seeking to do so: [http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/26/us/26expat.html?emc=eta1](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/26/us/26expat.html?emc=eta1) ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/9 "2010-04-26T03:27:45Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > What if you renounce your citizenship and you haven’t applied for citizenship elsewhere? You’re hanging out in Italy or someplace, and suddenly you’re not a U.S. citizen. The Italian (or wherever) government says, ‘You must leave.’ But as pointed out, you don’t have a passport. Do they deport you? Where to? Or do they lock you up as an illegal immigrant until such time as you can find someplace to go (while being locked up)? > [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > OK, I hadn’t read the second link when I posted that. That link had a link to a government page. > > So in the scenario above, the government would (or could) deport the ex-citizen back to the U.S. But would the U.S. be required to accept him? I know that there have been people confined for years here in prisons while awaiting a determination of their status. Hasn’t the US done that in the past? For instance, with certain mafiosi. Stripped of citizenship and deported back to Italy. Or did they still hold dual nationality? The main reason Americans and other Westerners take Thai citizenship is for the fantastic tax breaks in business and benefits like being able to own land. They’re supposed to renounce their old citizenship, as Thailand does not allow dual nationalities for adults – children must decided which nationality to take upon reaching legal age in the event the parents are not both Thai – but usually they don’t really do so. No one checks, and they tend to retain their original nationality on the sly. There is one prominent white American businessman here, very prominent, who has Thai citizenship, but no one believes he _really_ renounced his US status. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2012, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/10 "2012-09-11T02:23:20Z")
Bumping this thread, since Cecil’s column is back on the front page. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2012, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/11 "2012-09-11T15:15:58Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Bumping this thread, since Cecil’s column is back on the front page. Link? I really do want a link because I hate to miss anything written by and about our Master. However, this post is also partly a ploy to knock that goddam stupid jerkoff-shrunkdick thread out of the most recently viewed position, forcing me to look at the title half the time I navigate to the site home page. How administration could fail to appreciate how stupid such a title makes the entire site look to first-time viewers is beyond me. That is, to the caliber of first-time viewers we might want as new members. There are of course lots of people who will never make it past a mental age of 13 who will see it and sign right up. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2012, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/12 "2012-09-11T17:01:11Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > Link? > > I really do want a link because I hate to miss anything written by and about our Master… See the original post. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2012, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/13 "2012-09-16T01:37:01Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > They’re supposed to renounce their old citizenship, as Thailand does not allow dual nationalities for adults – children must decided which nationality to take upon reaching legal age in the event the parents are not both Thai – but usually they don’t really do so. No one checks, and they tend to retain their original nationality on the sly. There is one prominent white American businessman here, very prominent, who has Thai citizenship, but no one believes he _really_ renounced his US status. Well, it turns out that is not true, at least not anymore. An American friend just obtained Thai citizenship, a five-year effort, and he was not asked to renounce his US citizenship. He has three children with his Thai wife, and he’s pretty sure they will be able to keep their dual nationalities in the future (although being a military officer – not being in the military, but rather being an officer – is not condoned by the other country). ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2012, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/14 "2012-09-20T21:17:42Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > See the original post. I understood your post #10 to indicate there might be a recent update to OP. And I am getting damn sick and tired of that transsexual thread too. This thread of yours should come in handy for knocking that one off the site HP too. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2012, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/15 "2012-09-21T04:05:18Z")
No, it’s just that the column itself was (at the time I last posted) back on the front page of the Dope. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/16 "2012-09-30T16:23:32Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > No, it’s just that the column itself was (at the time I last posted) back on the front page of the Dope. (1) Thanks for the reply. (2) Time to start bumping the word castration off HP whenever I see it. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2012, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/17 "2012-10-04T20:35:16Z")
I believe a “Thanks again” might be in order: As soon as “masturbation” and “transsexual” get bumped into oblivion “castration” and most recently “faggot” show signs of becoming permanent HP fixtures. 50+ replies, several of them quite lengthy, should be more than enough to cover the etymology of any word. ---
**Author:** ![bigkimshew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d26b3c/32.png) [@bigkimshew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bigkimshew)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/18 "2012-10-10T01:42:52Z")
if u do,they treat u like in the story"man w/out a country."cant come back ever.denial of visa.vindictive,heh\> ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/19 "2012-10-10T15:17:03Z")
You gotta cite for that, or just like spouting off in gibberish? Note to **bigkimshew** , this isn’t Twitter. You can actually type full words, use spaces and capitalization, and don’t need random periods between words. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689/20 "2012-10-11T00:43:52Z")
> [@bigkimshew](#): > > if u do,they treat u like in the story"man w/out a country."cant come back ever.denial of visa.vindictive,heh\> Not a great first post. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-go-about-renouncing-my-u-s-citizenship/438689.md?page=2)