# How do I respond to this? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 30, 2015, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913 "2015-06-30T22:36:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2015, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/101 "2015-07-03T12:31:48Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > Or at least, that’s what white Democratic pols tell themselves as they pat themselves on the back. Ask black voters in Missouri what they think of (Democratic Governor) Jay Nixon right now. > > Republicans want to live on Lincoln’s rep. Democrats boast that they have Dems in their coalition, then take them for granted. The question both groups of privileged white folk ignore is what they’re doing for the downtrodden and despised now, and in the next term. > > Seriously, there’s good reason for blacks in this country to despise both parties. I used a little too praiseworthy language for the Democratic party – but the two parties are not seen nearly equally by many/most black Americans, based on polling I’ve seen, and based on the interactions with black people that I’ve had. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2015, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/102 "2015-07-03T13:13:53Z")
In addition, amusingly, it is conservative white voters who vote against their own economic interests. As discussed in the book _What’s the Matter with Kansas_, conservative white people will routinely vote for policies that starkly favor the wealthy, even though they themselves will never benefit from them, and even though they actually end up suffering from those policies. And based on the campaign messaging to which they seem to be responding, many are making decisions based on the color of their skin. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2015, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/103 "2015-07-04T23:55:10Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’d probably say something like “So you think Obamacare is equivalent to slavery?” Because that’s the level of discourse on Facebook. Obamacare is but one act of Congress and not the last 100 years of political discourse. What you should look at is the level of debt that was created in the last 6 years and what we got in return for it. Almost nothing. “Obamacare” was supposed to help 45 million people. To date it’s helped about 11 million. It probably harmed more people than it helped and the cost of it is staggering. Any jackass can spend other people’s money. In this case it’s literally the symbol of the party responsible for 9 trillion additional dollars of debt. That’s more than all the debt from all the previous administrations combined. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/104 "2015-07-05T00:12:55Z")
> [@sqweels](#): > > Slavery is making people work without giving them money. Welfare is giving people money without making them work. Welfare destroyed the nuclear family for millions of people and it occurred in a single generation. It has enslaved people into poverty just as heroin enslaves it’s victims. The current unemployment rate for African Americans is 10.4% which is double that of the national average. His answer to their unemployment problem is a policy favoring illegal immigrants. He is basically telling Black people to go fuck themselves. The KKK couldn’t have elected a better President if they tried. ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/105 "2015-07-05T00:17:44Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Any ideas? How snarky do you want to be? I’d be tempted to go with: “That’s true. The Republicans were absolutely on the right side of history in the 1860s and 1870s. Unfortunately, they were on the wrong side of history in the 1970s, and the 1980s, and the 1990s, and the 2000s, and the 2010s… but hey, maybe the 2020s will be your decade! Keep hope alive!” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/106 "2015-07-05T00:22:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Obamacare is but one act of Congress and not the last 100 years of political discourse. What you should look at is the level of debt that was created in the last 6 years and what we got in return for it. Almost nothing. “Obamacare” was supposed to help 45 million people. To date it’s helped about 11 million. It probably harmed more people than it helped and the cost of it is staggering. > > Any jackass can spend other people’s money. In this case it’s literally the symbol of the party responsible for 9 trillion additional dollars of debt. That’s more than all the debt from all the previous administrations combined. How could you get nearly everything so very wrong? It’s stunning. Fox News? That’s my guess. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/107 "2015-07-05T00:46:43Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > How could you get nearly everything so very wrong? It’s stunning. Fox News? That’s my guess. [National debt](http://useconomy.about.com/od/usdebtanddeficit/a/National-Debt-by-Year.htm): 2007 9 trillion. [Today:](http://www.usdebtclock.org/) 18.29 trillion. [black unemployment:](http://www.ibtimes.com/black-unemployment-rate-2015-better-economy-african-americans-see-minimal-gains-1837870) In “February, the unemployment rate for African-Americans was 10.4 percent, while the comparable rates for whites, Hispanics and Asians were 4.7 percent, 6.6 percent and 4.0 percent, in that order,” That’s the official unemployment rate. It doesn’t count people who stopped looking. As for Obama’s open door policy on illegal immigrants that goes without comment. He’s using tax dollars to buy votes. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/108 "2015-07-05T01:07:25Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > As for Obama’s open door policy on illegal immigrants that goes without comment. He’s using tax dollars to buy votes. Illegal immigrants can’t vote. Do you actually read what you write before you hit “Submit”? ETA: Sorry…I forgot you’re the “airdrop assault vehicles over Benghazi” person. Obviously, you don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/109 "2015-07-05T01:21:11Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Illegal immigrants can’t vote. Do you actually read what you write before you hit “Submit”? They can when you make them legal. [from the White House website:](https://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/immigration) The President’s actions will also streamline legal immigration to boost our economy and will promote naturalization for those who qualify. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/110 "2015-07-05T01:21:36Z")
You say, "Look, I know that the Really Old wrinkled guys who do all your thinking for you SEEM like they’ve been sitting in Congress and out of touch with America since the 19th century, but they haven’t been. They even check for a pulse now and again. As a party, I’d recommend you consider it. Can’t Hurt…" 😃 ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/111 "2015-07-05T01:29:09Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The current unemployment rate for African Americans is 10.4% which is double that of the national average. His answer to their unemployment problem is a policy favoring illegal immigrants. He is basically telling Black people to go fuck themselves. The KKK couldn’t have elected a better President if they tried. I trust black people and not you for an accurate analysis of the plight of black people, and what would help black people, and most of those I’ve spoken to (including members of my family), young and old alike, think America today is a much better place for black people than America in past decades. Black people aren’t stupid, they’re not dupes, they’re not idiots – they’re as rational and intelligent as anyone else, and most choose to support the Democratic party for reasons that are entirely rational. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/112 "2015-07-05T01:30:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > [National debt](http://useconomy.about.com/od/usdebtanddeficit/a/National-Debt-by-Year.htm): 2007 9 trillion. [Today:](http://www.usdebtclock.org/) 18.29 trillion. Obama took office in 2007? And 2009 was his budget? Man, we learn all kinds of things from Fox News! ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/113 "2015-07-05T01:30:40Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > He is basically telling Black people to go fuck themselves. I guess they should vote Republican, who tell Black people… Reduce Medicaid End Minimum Wage Restrict Welfare Cut Food Stamps Increase Taxes (on the 47% “freeloading lucky ducks” who should have “some skin in the game”) Decrease Taxes (on really rich “job creators”) ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/114 "2015-07-05T01:35:07Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > My Conservative friends like to post [this image](http://thefederalistpapers.integratedmarket.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/poster.jpg) to ‘prove’ the Democrats are Teh Evil. > > For those who don’t want to click: > [ul][li]13th Amendment Abolished Slavery. 100% Republican support, 23% Democrat [sic] support [/li][li]14th Amendment Gave Citizenship to Freed Slaves. 94% Republican support, 0% Democrat [sic] support[/li][li]15th Amendment, Right to Vote for All Men. 100% Republican support, 0% Democrat [sic] support[/li][li]Obamacare. 0% Republican support, 86% Democrat [sic] support[/ul][/li]I’ve tried to explain that the Democratic and Republican parties are not the same as they were 100 or 150 years ago, but it’s not sinking in. I’ve explained how Teddy Roosevelt broke up corporations, I’ve explained how the Democrats shifted toward The Common Man under FDR, I’ve explained the Dixiecrats… Nothing seems to work. > > Any ideas? Expound on how the Republican Party were the front runners in equality and justice for the downtrodden in the first three cases. Then ask why not the last one. Other than that I really have nothing besides getting new friends or otherwise just ignoring moronic arguments in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/115 "2015-07-05T01:44:27Z")
Hint to Republicans – telling black people that they are dupes who aren’t capable of choosing who to vote for rationally is not likely to win any black party-switchers. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/116 "2015-07-05T02:05:37Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > In addition, amusingly, it is conservative white voters who vote against their own economic interests. As discussed in the book _What’s the Matter with Kansas_, conservative white people will routinely vote for policies that starkly favor the wealthy, even though they themselves will never benefit from them, and even though they actually end up suffering from those policies. And based on the campaign messaging to which they seem to be responding, many are making decisions based on the color of their skin. It is human nature to believe a person is above average regardless. I doubt it’s difficult to convince poor people to vote against their interests because they don’t believe they are poor. What black people provided for white southerners was a way to feel superior regardless of poverty. Contempt for them is a manifestation of their plight. I am not apologizing for bigots, only saying prosperity is the salve that works. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/117 "2015-07-05T02:23:57Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > That’s not remotely true for the average voter, and even less true for the average black voter, who tends to be less educated, less informed and more apt to reflexively vote for skin color or anyone that has a “D” next to his name. They are simply ignorant of the facts presented in the OP. And any black who has the gumption and temerity to vote for an “R” candidate is quickly labeled as an Uncle Tom or some such. Since you’ve decided education is the arbiter of the true righteous voter I’ll tell you this: nationally, American conservatives have less education than liberals. Ask for a cite. I dare you. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/118 "2015-07-05T02:32:48Z")
“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” - John Steinbeck “If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.” - Lyndon B. Johnson ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/119 "2015-07-05T15:13:39Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Since you’ve decided education is the arbiter of the true righteous voter I’ll tell you this: nationally, American conservatives have less education than liberals. > > Ask for a cite. I dare you. cite ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2015, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913/120 "2015-07-05T15:30:36Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Obama took office in 2007? And 2009 was his budget? Man, we learn all kinds of things from Fox News! Obama came into office in 2008. The entire US debt has doubled in 6 years. He still has 2 more budget years in office. What don’t you understand? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-i-respond-to-this/723913.md?page=7)