# How do people learn to play unusual instruments (like a church organ or a carillon)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [November 13, 2023, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055 "2023-11-13T05:50:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TXRebel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6de8d8/32.png) [@TXRebel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TXRebel)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2023, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/21 "2023-11-13T21:00:13Z")
A friend of mine’s grandson has been taking organ lessons since he was a small child. He learned from a person who also taught piano so I suppose it is mostly the same thing. This young man wants to travel the world and see organs every place he goes. What from what I’ve been told there are some magnificent ones to view. ---
**Author:** ![Clark\_Cello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58f4c7/32.png) [@Clark\_Cello](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clark_Cello)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2023, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/22 "2023-11-13T21:36:23Z")
My daughter has a good friend that was an incredible keyboardist from an early age. He got a full ride to a local university and majored in Music - Organ Performance. I know this isn’t a very popular major, but there are still folks who do it :). He’s in his mid-20s so we aren’t talking about 30 years ago. He has a stable gig working as the organist/music director at a church in NYC, and does a lot of sideline musical stuff. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2023, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/23 "2023-11-13T21:40:13Z")
There is a carillon in my town. I’ve never heard anyone banging out twinkle twinkle little star, or chopsticks on it. I think that by the time you get to play it, you are already a skilled musician and also, I’m not sure I would be able to tell a good carillon player from a great one. ---
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2023, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/24 "2023-11-13T22:38:03Z")
The church I went to as a kid was on a bit of a shoestring, and organ maintenance wasn’t a high priority. The church itself was built in 1927 though I believe the organ didn’t come until a little later, but no later than WWII. In any case, several of the pipes either had bad actuators, broken linkages, or were way out of tune due to some damage to the pipe itself. So the organist had marked the keys with red tape to remind himself to play other similar notes/chords to compensate. Yikes! ---
**Author:** ![Apodder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apodder/32/17727_2.png) [@Apodder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apodder)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/25 "2023-11-14T22:39:11Z")
So, we’ve covered carillons and organs…any other obscure/large/rare instruments? I thought of the big harps…not rare, but certainly not ubiquitous in high school band rooms. How does one learn and practice something like that? ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/26 "2023-11-14T23:03:06Z")
I learned organ by practicing at night in the church that I went to, with permission/arrangement from the organist / choir director. Carillon, if I remember correctly, in college they had a contraption that had all of the levers as the real carillon, but wasn’t connected to the bells. So people could practice on that before using the actual bells, which obviously everybody can hear, unlike in a deserted church. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/27 "2023-11-14T23:08:20Z")
It seems like it shouldn’t be too hard to make a “synth carillon”, that produces sound electronically and outputs it only through headphones. It might not be a perfect replacement for the real thing, but it should be good enough that the student wouldn’t embarrass themself the first time they did play the real one. Heck, the difference between one real carillon and another is probably greater than the difference between a real one and a simulation. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/28 "2023-11-14T23:14:26Z")
Yeah but there aren’t any carillon hobbyists that have their own personal carillon and want to practice at home. They’d instead be located near a college or a church or someplace like that where they’d be playing it in public. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/29 "2023-11-14T23:25:40Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > The two official pre requisites for the course include: > > 1. ability to read music, and > 2. ability to climb a lot of stairs 🙂 I looked into it when I was in college. At my university, the course was only available to music majors. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/30 "2023-11-14T23:27:28Z")
If you want to learn to play a [calliope](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calliope_(music)) you may have to go to a museum. In the olden days you could join the circus or work on a river boat. They were originally steam driven pipe organs that were extremely loud and audible for miles. Great way to advertise a traveling circus’s arrival in town. ---
**Author:** ![N9IWP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/n9iwp/32/3154_2.png) [@N9IWP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N9IWP)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/31 "2023-11-14T23:39:46Z")
I can tell you from direct observation that calliopes are still used on Mississippi river boats. I work near the river and cruise boats go by – sometimes they play calliope music (often just after undocking). Nice for about 1 minute, annoying after that IMHO. Brian ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/32 "2023-11-15T03:28:47Z")
> [@Apodder](#): > > I thought of the big harps…not rare, but certainly not ubiquitous in high school band rooms. How does one learn and practice something like that? My late first wife was a hobby & play-some-in-public harpist. At the entry level, harp teachers have them, and students quickly get their own if they’re serious. The full bore upright concert harps are a) a PITA to move, and b) friggin expensive. But they are buyable, durable, and movable if you’re motivated enough. You can also learn many of the basics on smaller more portable versions or even on modern Celtic (“lever”) harps. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/33 "2023-11-15T06:25:21Z")
Check out Camille and Kennerly, the Harp Twins. They also have a YouTube channel. > **[Nordic Celtic Harp Duo | Harp Twins](https://www.harptwins.com/)** > > Identical twin Nordic Celtic Harp Duo Camille and Kennerly Kitt (Harp Twins). Music, tour dates, videos, and merchandise at HarpTwins.com ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/34 "2023-11-15T07:31:16Z")
Watching the video, I wondered: pipe organs can be _huge_, with the pipes tens of meters away from the console. But the speed of sound is only 300 m/s, so if it’s pneumatically actuated, it might be over 1/10 of a second before the sound comes out. And more before the organist actually hears anything. Well, I looked it up, and found this interesting thread: [https://music.stackexchange.com/questions/30454/how-does-a-pipe-organist-deal-with-latency-or-delay](https://music.stackexchange.com/questions/30454/how-does-a-pipe-organist-deal-with-latency-or-delay) The short version is: yes, there’s a ton of latency, up to half a second in some cases. And every organ is different, and if you’re unlucky some notes might have higher latency than others. You just learn to deal with it. As said above, every pipe organ is different, so part of the learning process is just learning the idiosyncrasies. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/35 "2023-11-15T10:54:42Z")
This video about the organ at St Paul’s Cathedral in London is interesting. It was re-built in 1872 in a very innovative way. The idea of a 92-foot pipe is mind-boggling. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/XqP-2-yVRbs/maxresdefault.jpg "The Grand Organ of St Paul's Cathedral") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqP-2-yVRbs) ---
**Author:** ![Apodder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apodder/32/17727_2.png) [@Apodder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apodder)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/36 "2023-11-15T12:37:03Z")
Maybe that’s why some organ music sounds kind of muddy. ---
**Author:** ![tofor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tofor/32/13727_2.png) [@tofor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tofor)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/37 "2023-11-15T13:04:57Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > The short version is: yes, there’s a ton of latency, up to half a second in some cases. And every organ is different, and if you’re unlucky some notes might have higher latency than others. You just learn to deal with it. As said above, every pipe organ is different, so part of the learning process is just learning the idiosyncrasies. > [@Apodder](#): > > Maybe that’s why some organ music sounds kind of muddy. Also, how it sounds will be different depending on where you are in the building. Most organs don’t have all the pipes in one place, they are placed around the room, leading to a different experience depending on where you are. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/38 "2023-11-15T23:11:21Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > The idea of a 92-foot pipe is mind-boggling. Eh, some of B. S. Johnson’s organs can top that. Though it helps if your organist has a three-octave handspan. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/39 "2023-11-16T00:12:53Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > If you want to learn to play a [calliope](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calliope_(music)) you may have to go to a museum. In the olden days you could join the circus or work on a river boat. They were originally steam driven pipe organs that were extremely loud and audible for miles. Great way to advertise a traveling circus’s arrival in town. The Knott’s Berry Farm amusement park used to have one. Now I’m wondering if OSHA would require players to wear hearing protection. ---
**Author:** ![Topologist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/topologist/32/3208_2.png) [@Topologist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Topologist)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055/40 "2023-11-16T17:31:42Z")
> [@Apodder](#): > > So, we’ve covered carillons and organs…any other obscure/large/rare instruments? In my younger days I was a change ringer. This is the common way of ringing church bells in the UK, but much rarer in the US. The bells are set up to swing from mouth up to mouth up and back, with the clapper balanced so that the strike happens while the bell is roughly horizontal, projecting the loudest sound out of the tower. Obviously, that’s going to be annoying to the neighbors while you’re practicing—I learned at the Old North Church in Boston, in the middle of the densely packed North End. (Paul Revere was a change ringer, that’s how he was so familiar with the bell tower of the church.) So there are things you can do to lessen the sound: When you’re learning and practicing the physical skill of ringing one of the bells (moderately dangerous if you don’t know what you’re doing), you can tie the clapper so that it doesn’t ring at all. If you want to hear what you’re doing but not deafen the neighbors, you can attach a leather muffler to the clapper that greatly reduces the volume. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-people-learn-to-play-unusual-instruments-like-a-church-organ-or-a-carillon/993055.md?page=3)