# How do poor people afford everything? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 14, 2012, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018 "2012-11-14T19:50:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/41 "2012-11-14T21:24:21Z")
> [@Infovore](#): > > Does she work in a type of job where you need to be particularly presentable to the public (something like some types of sales)? I’m gonna go with option #2: “she doesn’t exist.” ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/42 "2012-11-14T21:27:52Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I’m not including insurance because I do have renter’s insurance, but I am pretty sure renter’s insurance is far cheaper than house insurance. By a ton. Renter’s insurance only covers your personal possessions (i.e., everything inside the apartment), though it also usually covers your possessions if something happens to them away from home (like your bike being stolen at the train station, etc.). If you bundle renter’s insurance with the company with which you have your auto insurance, you can usually get renter’s insurance for a pittance (i.e., a few dollars a month). And, even then, renter’s insurance is optional…you can take the risk and not have it. Homeowner’s insurance is **mandatory** if you have a mortgage (no reputable lender will give you a mortgage without it), and covers the real property (i.e., the house), as well as your possessions. Expect it to cost at least hundreds, if not thousands, per year. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/43 "2012-11-14T21:28:02Z")
To answer the title question succinctly: They don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/44 "2012-11-14T21:33:02Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > By a ton. Renter’s insurance only covers your personal possessions (i.e., everything inside the apartment), though it also usually covers your possessions if something happens to them away from home (like your bike being stolen at the train station, etc.). If you bundle renter’s insurance with the company with which you have your auto insurance, you can usually get renter’s insurance for a pittance (i.e., a few dollars a month). And, even then, renter’s insurance is optional…you can take the risk and not have it. > > Homeowner’s insurance is **mandatory** if you have a mortgage (no reputable lender will give you a mortgage without it), and covers the real property (i.e., the house), as well as your possessions. Expect it to cost at least hundreds, if not thousands, per year. Ok, thank you. So yes, we lose out on not having this amazing insurance (no sarcasm), but if you just can’t afford it, you just can’t afford it. I do bundle my renter’s with my auto. It’s less optional now, in many places. Many apartment complexes require proof of it before they rent to oyu. I just see many people being talked into this American dream of owning a house. GREAT! Everyone who wants one should have a house, but should be aware of what they are getting into. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/45 "2012-11-14T21:37:58Z")
> [@](#): > > so if you were to buy this house how much would property taxes be? Suddenly - it’s a quiz show kids! I’ll take obscure property taxes for $400, Alex! ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/46 "2012-11-14T21:40:25Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I just see many people being talked into this American dream of owning a house. GREAT! Everyone who wants one should have a house, but should be aware of what they are getting into. When we bought our house, the mortgage payment itself was somewhat less than what we had been paying in rent (and we gained a lot of room, plus a yard), but when you add in the property insurance and taxes, it’s considerably more. Looking at my mortgage statement, I see that my monthly PITI payment (principal, interest, taxes, and insurance – I make it all in one payment, and the lender pays the taxes and insurance out of an escrow account) is 55% mortgage, and 45% escrow (which goes to pay taxes and insurance). ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/47 "2012-11-14T21:43:05Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > \ The poor may get a few thousand dollar refund every year as an Earned Income Credit which is a form of welfare done through the tax system.\ An aside - my husband and I were scratching our heads over how the poor people on “Judge Judy” were always getting $4000 type income tax refunds - how could they get serious money back when they don’t _make_ anything? It finally made sense when we learned about this. > [@CEOofPolar](#): > > tripolar houses are real cheap now > > [http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/15-Edward-St-Worcester-MA-01605/56729081\_zpid/](http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/15-Edward-St-Worcester-MA-01605/56729081_zpid/) > > that house is 6 bed for 2 baths for 185,000, and i figure a 150,000 house must be around 1,000 a month. Holy crap, if we sold our (extremely modest) house in Calgary, we could just about buy that house with the profits! > [@Smeghead](#): > > This may be difficult for you to wrap your head around, but housing prices vary HUGELY depending on where you are. See my comment above. 🙂 > [@Kimballkid](#): > > To answer the title question succinctly: They don’t. That was going to be my answer, too. Smart poor people budget and live within their means and try to get ahead; other poor people live way beyond their means on credit, buying things they want rather than need, and eventually that collapses on them. ---
**Author:** ![kushiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbce88/32.png) [@kushiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kushiel)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/48 "2012-11-14T21:50:52Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Holy crap, if we sold our (extremely modest) house in Calgary, we could just about buy that house with the profits! \<101 Dalmations Puppy voice\>Mama Cat, someday I wanna own a home.\ I left school right when your boom went the next province over. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/49 "2012-11-14T21:56:04Z")
Idiot brother sponges off my dad. He has a full bedroom and bathroom in my dad’s house. IB has no wife or children. Dad pays the rent, property taxes, utilities, food bills and even a cleaning lady because Idiot Brother is too lazy to bother to clean up after himself according to my late mom. He also lets Idiot Brother drive his car. When Idiot Brother wants medical care he goes to the free clinic. He’s in college part-time at 38 and hasn’t held a job in over a year. I think he’s still getting unemployment right now and may pick up the odd job here and there. I try to avoid contact with Idiot Brother as he has turned Orthodox Jew on me and decided I am a) a lazy, arrogant JAP (even though I have a full time job and he works sporadically at best) and b) an insult to Judaism as I have married a non-Jew and am raising my girls to be educated and decent human beings rather than birdbrained, uneducated, Haredi breeders. But right now he’s poor and he’s managing because my dad pays just about all his bills. I think Idiot Brother spends money on clothing, gas and books but that’s about it. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/50 "2012-11-14T22:01:55Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Ok, thank you. So yes, we lose out on not having this amazing insurance (no sarcasm), but if you just can’t afford it, you just can’t afford it. I do bundle my renter’s with my auto. > > It’s less optional now, in many places. Many apartment complexes require proof of it before they rent to oyu. > > I just see many people being talked into this American dream of owning a house. GREAT! Everyone who wants one should have a house, but should be aware of what they are getting into. You can’t simply look at it as rent vs. mortgage payment + upkeep. The rent you pay is the landlord’s income. The mortgage you pay is the bank’s income + your investment. For example, this summer I finally paid off my mortgage. Now, I own an asset, which is not particularly liquid (that is not easy for me to turn into money) but which has considerable value nonetheless. For renting to make financial sense, the amount one saves paying rent on a comparable property (as in, not paying taxes or insurance directly, not paying the bank’s rent on its money directly) has to be equal, over the time of the mortgage, to an investment of equivalent value to the house - and you have to make that investment. Why renters often lose out in the long run is, even assuming that the rent is low enough for the deal to make financial sense, most people don’t have the financial discipline to save that money and invest it - in a way, having a mortgage acts as a “forced savings”. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/51 "2012-11-14T22:04:09Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Suddenly - it’s a quiz show kids! > > I’ll take obscure property taxes for $400, Alex! It isn’t even obscure, on that house, property taxes last year were $5391. It’s right on the Zillow page. I just sold a little house my late brother in law occupied. Which is one way poor people live, with help from family. It as $129,000 when we bought it. Mortgage was $961. Insurance was about $800 a year, property taxes were $1200 a year, utilities (heat, electricity, water) were $250 a month. About $16.5k a year, but that didn’t include phone, food, transportation, health insurance, or maintenance (the plumbing was bad, we spent $1000 a year on plumbers). ---
**Author:** ![tim-n-va](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim-n-va/32/3001_2.png) [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/52 "2012-11-14T22:06:08Z")
Hard to answer with the info given (regarding the OP’s sister). I’d want to know location, family size, recent unexpected financial hits (uninsured damage, etc.) There was a time when I was making about $60 and struggling but that was partially based on choices. My job was in the DC area and I wanted a decent school district for my kids. The more general answer is that if you don’t have money for everything you do without some things. ---
**Author:** ![kiz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7feea3/32.png) [@kiz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kiz)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/53 "2012-11-14T22:09:42Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > what about shes a girl she has to get her hair done and nails isn’t that $100 a month do you guys still live in the 1920’s? Getting your hair and nails done is a luxury. Neither are as important as food, a roof over your head, and being able to pay your bills. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/54 "2012-11-14T22:09:59Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > That was going to be my answer, too. Smart poor people budget and live within their means and try to get ahead; other poor people live way beyond their means on credit, buying things they want rather than need, and eventually that collapses on them. That is true of wealthy people as well. There are plenty of people who make a lot of money who don’t budget and try to get ahead. It just SHOULD be easier. And, as you can see from the ‘but don’t you need manicures’ comment, it isn’t necessarily so. ---
**Author:** ![RockytheflyingS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a9adbd/32.png) [@RockytheflyingS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RockytheflyingS)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/55 "2012-11-14T22:10:50Z")
I wonder if your sister has children. They eat up a ton of money. I live on 42K a year. I’m able to to do it by not having children, no college debt, no debt from credit card, and living in a small house. My biggest money eater is my dogs, but I love them. ---
**Author:** ![RockytheflyingS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a9adbd/32.png) [@RockytheflyingS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RockytheflyingS)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/56 "2012-11-14T22:12:53Z")
> [@kiz](#): > > Getting your hair and nails done is a luxury. Neither are as important as food, a roof over your head, and being able to pay your bills. I don’t know if I would consider hair and nail care a “luxury”. Women are judged differently than men, even in the workforce. I wonder what is thought about the woman with say bitten up nails and the one with the french manicure. Like any thing, there’s cheaper options and DIY route. ---
**Author:** ![kiz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7feea3/32.png) [@kiz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kiz)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/57 "2012-11-14T22:18:01Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > so if you were to buy this house how much would property taxes be? > [http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/25-Coachman-Ridge-Rd-Shrewsbury-MA-01545/56718566\_zpid/](http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/25-Coachman-Ridge-Rd-Shrewsbury-MA-01545/56718566_zpid/) It depends on the town. You can easily google it to get a rough estimate. ---
**Author:** ![kiz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7feea3/32.png) [@kiz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kiz)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/58 "2012-11-14T22:20:40Z")
> [@RockytheflyingS](#): > > I don’t know if I would consider hair and nail care a “luxury”. Women are judged differently than men, even in the workforce. I wonder what is thought about the woman with say bitten up nails and the one with the french manicure. Like any thing, there’s cheaper options and DIY route. If the woman in question considers them a necessity, then yes, there are less expensive ways to have them – DIY, as you said, or patronizing a less expensive salon. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/59 "2012-11-14T22:22:57Z")
We weren’t in the best shape before, but now that my SO has been deported we are really struggling. I’m waiting to hear if I qualify for disability because I have such bad PTSD with dissociative episodes. We had a roommate until a few weeks ago but he stole some of our stuff and pawned it because SURPRISE! Meth Addiction! So he’s out and that’s 350 dollars less. My SO (i guess now former) makes about 12 dollars a day in Mexico so there’s obviously no child support for my little girl. My older daughter makes about 250 a week. I get 142 a month plus 267 in food stamps. That’s our income. Our rent is 600 a month, utilities run around 175. Gas to get my daughter to work and us to school runs about 50 a week. We have the internet because our roommate was paying. I don’t know where we’ll find that extra 40 bucks a month so it’ll probably be gone soon. We don’t have cable. We don’t even have a television. I have gone to a church charity for clothing for my little girl because now we’re in such dire straits I can’t even afford Goodwill. I have one pair of shoes, two pairs of pants, a few shirts and a few old stained things I wouldn’t wear in public. I don’t buy clothes for myself. My older daughter works in torn up tennies every day. I really wish I could get HER shoes. Maybe with the tax money. That’s what we always say…maybe with the tax money. It’s spent a week after we get it, and most of it is paying bills, playing catch-up. So my answer to your question is this: We can’t afford everything. We can’t afford much of anything. We have no savings. We have no bank account now that my daughter’s was compromised and money was stolen (we were credited the money but still had overdraft fees). We counted our change and took it to Coinstar yesterday because we didn’t have enough for gas for the week. We are almost a month late on the rent and owe 150 in late fees my landlady agreed to let us pay when we get our tax refund. That tax refund saves our asses, thanks to EIC. There will be no Christmas for us. I mean, we’ll do the tree and lights and all that but my little girl will get something from Santa and that’s it. I don’t care. I’ve come to hate the holiday anyway. I don’t mean to sound so grim. We aren’t dying here. We’re well-fed. We have a roof and all the proper appliances and hot water. We manage to have lots of fun here in Memphis for free. One day a week we have the zoo and the museum. We go to festivals and hang out at the park when the weather is good. If there’s a free event we are there, even if gas costs are killing us. It’s worth it because you know, you gotta have fun sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![CEOofPolar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@CEOofPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CEOofPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/60 "2012-11-14T22:23:07Z")
yes my sister has 2 kids they both go to college. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018.md?page=4)