# How do poor people afford everything? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 14, 2012, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018 "2012-11-14T19:50:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/61 "2012-11-14T22:23:17Z")
If you earn $60,000 per year, you’re much more likely to have a college degree, and your student loan payments may be significant. I have a friend whose payments are larger than my mortgage payment, including escrow, and he’s on an extended-time repayment plan to lower his payment. Also if you’re making $60,000 and finding yourself with little discretionary income, _hopefully_ that’s after deducting money each month for retirement savings. From a personal budgeting point of view, you’re much better off thinking of the $1000 a month you put into your retirement savings as an expense, not something do you choose to do every month with your leftover cash. But if you’re comparing yourself to someone who earns $20,000 and can’t save for retirement at all, it might be kind of obnoxious to categorize retirement savings as an expense. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/62 "2012-11-14T22:26:51Z")
Regarding renting an apartment vs buying a house. In most cases you can’t really call the comparision fair. Its not like an apartment is just a house you rent. A house you rent is like a house you rent. And of course long term renting a house makes less sense than just buying one. But renting an apartment vs buying a house IMO really aren’t comparable. Apartments are generally smaller, less desirable, little to no yard, more limited parking, less privacy… blah blah blah. Thats why they are cheaper than houses. If you wanted to compare renting an apartment vs buying a house, you need to compare your typical apartment to your typical crappy small house. Sure, when you buy a house you are building equity and making an investment. But its easier to fund renting an apartment than it is to find a small crappy house thats actually a decent investment with the same monthly budget . ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/63 "2012-11-14T22:29:48Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > tripolar houses are real cheap now > > [http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/15-Edward-St-Worcester-MA-01605/56729081\_zpid/](http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/15-Edward-St-Worcester-MA-01605/56729081_zpid/) > > that house is 6 bed for 2 baths for 185,000, and i figure a 150,000 house must be around 1,000 a month. My goodness do you think 1000 dollars a month is at all workable when you’re poor? ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/64 "2012-11-14T22:36:49Z")
> [@RockytheflyingS](#): > > I don’t know if I would consider hair and nail care a “luxury”. Women are judged differently than men, even in the workforce. I wonder what is thought about the woman with say bitten up nails and the one with the french manicure. Like any thing, there’s cheaper options and DIY route. Of course it’s a luxury. If you’re poor, it’s a luxury to pay someone else to paint your nails or style your hair. It doesn’t matter if you’re judged differently, you just can’t afford it. I can’t even tell you how long it’s been since I even had a 15 dollar haircut. I do it myself. It may not look as good but it’s all I can afford. As for nails, unless you’re disabled I can’t even fathom WHY anyone would think they had to have manicures. It’s just not that hard to do it yourself. One emery board and one bottle of clear polish can be had for less than five bucks and lasts a very long time. And you know what? I can’t even afford that! ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/65 "2012-11-14T22:41:07Z")
You guys can talk all day about renting vs owning but there’s not a chance in hell poor folks like me would qualify for a home loan. Oh I could go the “rent to own” route but I’m poor, not stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/66 "2012-11-14T22:47:27Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Regarding renting an apartment vs buying a house. In most cases you can’t really call the comparision fair. Its not like an apartment is just a house you rent. A house you rent is like a house you rent. And of course long term renting a house makes less sense than just buying one. But renting an apartment vs buying a house IMO really aren’t comparable. > > Apartments are generally smaller, less desirable, little to no yard, more limited parking, less privacy… blah blah blah. Thats why they are cheaper than houses. > > If you wanted to compare renting an apartment vs buying a house, you need to compare your typical apartment to your typical crappy small house. > > Sure, when you buy a house you are building equity and making an investment. But its easier to fund renting an apartment than it is to find a small crappy house thats actually a decent investment with the same monthly budget . Obviously you gottta compare apples with apples. The comparison with renting an apartment is buying the equivalent condo. But it is of course possible to rent houses, and some of the posters in this thread are doing exactly that. All depends on location. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/67 "2012-11-14T22:50:46Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > You guys can talk all day about renting vs owning but there’s not a chance in hell poor folks like me would qualify for a home loan. Oh I could go the “rent to own” route but I’m poor, not stupid. I agree - owning isn’t possible under those conditions. ---
**Author:** ![CEOofPolar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@CEOofPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CEOofPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/68 "2012-11-14T23:10:59Z")
wouldn’t you want to cut back on everything else and get a house so you not paying for nothing. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/69 "2012-11-14T23:14:27Z")
Well, unless you house magically feeds you, transports you to work, provides basic medical care, babysits, and a bunch of other stuff there is a limit to that idea. ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/70 "2012-11-14T23:23:01Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > Which is fine if you have $1000 a month to spend on housing, plus the costs of maintenance, insurance, property taxes, etc. In many places in the country, you can rent a place to live (not necessarily a house) for far less than that, and without the additional charges. It seems like he doesn’t really understand how the housing market works. That house in the Chicago suburbs would be valued at well over a million dollars. There are condos (nice ones, to be sure, but smaller than that McMansion) not far from me that are listed at $750,000. You pay a premium for location. And if you are poor, live in a city (because you can’t afford a car and public transit is the only way you can get to work), renting is a lot cheaper on a monthly basis than buying. I sure as hell can’t afford $1000 a month in housing costs. I room with someone so I can get my rent down to $400ish. My food stamps, btw, only cover about half our monthly food budget. We’re still spending our own money on necessaries, and been doing without a lot of necessaries for years. I have few clothes and even fewer that are in good condition. I’ve needed replacements for years but do without. Once or twice a year I might get a new sweater or pair of jeans from my mom for holidays and birthdays. That’s it. I didn’t have cable TV for over a decade. Hell, I didn’t have a _television set_ for most of that time, and only got one because it was a gift – never would have spent the money on it myself. I only have cable TV now because it made my internet cheaper, ironically; and most of my work is work-from-home, so if I don’t have internet I don’t work. Otherwise, yeah, it would be gone. BTW, I’m also a girl and have never in my life spent $100 a month on my hair. Doing my nails consists of trimming them myself with a clipper, which is free. Doing my hair is shampoo and conditioner. I go years between haircuts, precisely because I can’t afford them. Oh, and insurance? You realize that some people die because they can’t afford medical care, right? I know someone who watched that happen. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/71 "2012-11-14T23:23:48Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > wouldn’t you want to cut back on everything else and get a house so you not paying for nothing. As **Rushgeekgirl** notes, if you’re poor, you probably cannot get a home loan, especially these days. Up until 2008, a number of mortgage lenders were willing to make “subprime” loans (that is, loans to less-qualified borrowers – i.e., poorer people). And, in fact, a number of them made a big business out of writing tons of loans to people who probably were not really in the position to buy a house. All of those subprime loans were a big factor in what caused the U.S. housing market (and, by extension, the U.S. economy) to go into the toilet in 2008. Since then, banks have become far less willing to lend to potential homebuyers with lower incomes. If you have a household income of $30K or $40K, even if you don’t have any other debt, and are a very conscientious budgeter, you will probably still have a difficult, if not impossible, time of getting a mortgage in the current market. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/72 "2012-11-14T23:39:16Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > wouldn’t you want to cut back on everything else and get a house so you not paying for nothing. Did you go to some Mitt Romney “Building Personal Wealth” seminar out at the airport or something? “If you need to pay for college, just borrow more money from your parents. If you’re poor and can’t afford anything, buy a house! You’d be stupid not to!” ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/73 "2012-11-14T23:50:52Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Sure, when you buy a house you are building equity and making an investment. But its easier to fund renting an apartment than it is to find a small crappy house thats actually a decent investment with the same monthly budget . Given the housing bubble and the aftermath, I’m not sure you can just carte blanche declare that buying a house is a good investment anymore. We’ve got empty houses in my area, that are crumbling for lack of care, because at the end of said “investment” they had a money pit instead of equity. Hell, there’s a brand-new, never-lived-in townhouse not far from here that’s been abandoned for at least three years. I looked at condos around here some years ago (houses were out of the question), and not even counting monthly assessments, insurance, and maintenance, the monthly mortgage payment was at a minimum $100 more a month for less space than my apartment which was itself too small. This isn’t just an investment – you still have to LIVE in the place. And for something that left me less liquid (bad news for emergencies, and they always come up) for a place that was less livable… not really worth investing in, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/74 "2012-11-15T00:00:31Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > Given the housing bubble and the aftermath, I’m not sure you can just carte blanche declare that buying a house is a good investment anymore. We’ve got empty houses in my area, that are crumbling for lack of care, because Oh yeah, there is that too for that matter. But I guess the bigger point about poor people investing better is at some point of poor you can’t even really invest. The best you can hope for is try to make things better by whatever means possible and eventually get out of the poor zone so some form of investment even becomes possible. I think a better thread would be more along the lines of how do poor people afford pretty much anything? ---
**Author:** ![CEOofPolar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@CEOofPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CEOofPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/75 "2012-11-15T00:17:59Z")
i thought poor people spend there money on mercedes benz and porsches? ---
**Author:** ![InsomniaMama](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ad7895/32.png) [@InsomniaMama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InsomniaMama)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/76 "2012-11-15T00:37:58Z")
And I thought this board had a minimum IQ required, but we were both wrong. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/77 "2012-11-15T00:42:37Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > wouldn’t you want to cut back on everything else and get a house so you not paying for nothing. Do you own a house? Or anything? ---
**Author:** ![CEOofPolar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@CEOofPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CEOofPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/78 "2012-11-15T01:00:41Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Do you own a house? Or anything? tri be quiet and stop harrasing me i can sue! ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/79 "2012-11-15T01:03:36Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > tri be quiet and stop harrasing me i can sue! I’ll assume the answer is no then. Do you have a job? ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2012, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018/80 "2012-11-15T01:19:36Z")
> [@CEOofPolar](#): > > tri be quiet and stop harrasing me i can sue! Keep it civil, **CEOofPolar**. Legal threats are regarded seriously on this board. - Gukumatz, IMHO Moderator. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-poor-people-afford-everything/641018.md?page=5)