# How do you Brits differentiate Barb and Bob,? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 29, 2017, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471 "2017-04-29T02:22:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/1 "2017-04-29T02:22:51Z")
Serious question. I worked with a South African fellow and I couldn’t tell who he was speaking about: Barb, or Bob. Yeah don’t bug me on SA vs UK. I get it. Sent from my XT1635-02 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/2 "2017-04-29T02:48:34Z")
This is one of those questions that requires you to either understand someone else’s accent already or be able to use IPA, because all these “ah” and “aw” and “o” sounds are very different from one accent to another and many of them are merged depending on the accent. It depends on a person’s specific accent of course, but in RP they can be differentiated as Barb —[baːb] or [bäːb] – a lengthened low front or central unrounded vowel Bob — [bɒb] – a low back rounded vowel In general American these will often be Barb — [baɹb] or [bɑɹb] Bob — [bɑb] – a low back unrounded vowel Note the key vowel difference [ɑ] versus [ɒ] in “Bob.” For most Americans, this is an unrounded vowel and is usually merged with the “ah” sound. In RP, however, the rounding makes it a difgerent vowel than the “ah.” ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/3 "2017-04-29T02:56:48Z")
And for many if not most Americans, the father-bother merger and the cot-caught merger will make these distinctions difficult to perceive without some effort. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/4 "2017-04-29T02:58:52Z")
Barb’s not your uncle. ---
**Author:** ![goldmund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a4c791/32.png) [@goldmund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/goldmund)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/5 "2017-04-29T03:21:15Z")
When I think “Bob”, I think of [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOdfNwD9cEA). This isn’t easily mistaken for “Barb” at all. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/6 "2017-04-29T03:44:37Z")
You beat me to it goldmund. Barb lasts about 4 times longer than Bob. Poor bob Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/7 "2017-04-29T03:51:37Z")
Ascenray’s IPA does also indicate that the Barb vowel is longer. That’s what the symbol that looks like a : means. Non-rhotic dialects tend to lengthen the vowel in order to indicate the /r/ phoneme., since it otherwise has no sound. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/8 "2017-04-29T04:06:45Z")
I should add that this is in stressed syllables. Lengthening unstressed syllables tends to make them sound stressed in English. So words like mother don’t get lengthened. And, by lengthened, I mean about the amount of time it would take to add the /r/ in rhotic dialects. Though, if there are two word that sound similar, it might get lengthened further for clarity. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/9 "2017-04-29T04:47:30Z")
Barb is pronounced “bob” Bob is pronounced “bawb” ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/10 "2017-04-29T07:50:06Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Serious question. I worked with a South African fellow and I couldn’t tell who he was speaking about: Barb, or Bob. Simply, Barb has a long _a_ and Bob has a short _o_. Barb also has an _r_. And, of course, _a_ and _o_ are different sounds in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/11 "2017-04-29T08:26:32Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Simply, Barb has a long _a_ and Bob has a short _o_. Barb also has an _r_. And, of course, _a_ and _o_ are different sounds in the first place. Exactly this, they are completely different words in the vast majority of british accents and don’t sound the same at all. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/12 "2017-04-29T09:58:33Z")
Brits would never call anyone Barb. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/13 "2017-04-29T11:05:32Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Barb is pronounced “bob” > > Bob is pronounced “bawb” See here’s where not using IPA creates problems. In accents that don’t have the cot-caught merger, the “aw” vowel is yet another separate sound - [bɔb] ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/14 "2017-04-29T21:10:27Z")
A similar “you pronounce these two names identically” for me is a Californian accent (not sure if it’s a specific region within; could be). When I did corporate IT and got a call from a California employee about a coworker’s issue, I just.could.not find the person in our system. Until she spelled it out. I’d swear on my mother’s theoretical grave that she said “Don (Last name)”, but it actually was “Dawn (Last name)”. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/15 "2017-04-29T21:14:57Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > A similar “you pronounce these two names identically” for me is a Californian accent (not sure if it’s a specific region within; could be). When I did corporate IT and got a call from a California employee about a coworker’s issue, I just.could.not find the person in our system. Until she spelled it out. I’d swear on my mother’s theoretical grave that she said “Don (Last name)”, but it actually was “Dawn (Last name)”. I’m pretty sure Don and Dawn are merged all across the Midwest, not just in California. This is the cot-caught merger that is a feature of a lot (most?) of American accents. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/16 "2017-04-29T22:43:14Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I’m pretty sure Don and Dawn are merged all across the Midwest, not just in California. This is the cot-caught merger that is a feature of a lot (most?) of American accents. Throughout the podcast Serial, the presenters referred to the boyfriend as Dawn, which I thought was a bit weird. One of the interviewees then called him Don. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/17 "2017-04-29T23:01:48Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I’m pretty sure Don and Dawn are merged all across the Midwest, not just in California. This is the cot-caught merger that is a feature of a lot (most?) of American accents. But I’m _in_ the Midwest! I hear that the caught-cot merger is supposed to be here, but they’re very obviously different to me. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/18 "2017-04-29T23:12:57Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > But I’m _in_ the Midwest! I hear that the caught-cot merger is supposed to be here, but they’re very obviously different to me. Well, there are multiple accents in the Midwest, but the cot-caught merger is definitely a majority on the whole. Most people I know have no idea that they can be pronounced differently. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/19 "2017-04-29T23:22:03Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Well, there are multiple accents in the Midwest, but the cot-caught merger is definitely a majority on the whole. Most people I know have no idea that they can be pronounced differently. Me included. Sent from my XT1635-02 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471/20 "2017-04-29T23:25:40Z")
> [@antechinus](#): > > Throughout the podcast Serial, the presenters referred to the boyfriend as Dawn, which I thought was a bit weird. One of the interviewees then called him Don. I just listened to a bit of episode 2. Sarah Koenig pronounces “Don” as [dɑn], which is the usual vowel for both “cot” (Don) and “caught” (Dawn) in the Midwest. In RP, I believe “Don” gets the “cot” vowel [dɒn] and “Dawn” gets the “caught” vowel [dɔn]. I have a friend who grew up on Long Island who complained about all the Midwesterners around us pronouncing “Don” and “Dawn” identically. I asked her how she said them and she said “Don” the same way [dɑn] but “Dawn” had a diphthong [duən] (“doo-un”). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-brits-differentiate-barb-and-bob/785471.md?page=2)