# How Do You Feel About The CHAZ / Seattle Take Over **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 12, 2020, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551 "2020-06-12T17:55:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Driver8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Driver8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Driver8)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/41 "2020-06-17T06:07:37Z")
I actually visited this early evening while on my bike ride and hung around a bit and can confirm what most locals here are saying. At most it’s a protest that is continuous, but even that risks overstating things. I don’t want to call it a “festival”, because I think that trivializes what people are protesting about. The best analogy I can think of is that it seemed like what happens when instead of dissipating a regular protest turns 30 and settles down in the suburbs with an office job. The “youthful energy” of a 20 something (chanting, etc.) is gone, replaced with the calmer sequences of speeches, merchants in stalls selling shirts and food (as well as the established restaurants operating normally under COVID-19 restrictions), and mostly people just hanging out listening and chatting. If I was completely ignorant and squinted from a distance I would have guessed it was the farmer’s market. It was as expected a mostly young crowd, but there were families with small children and I would not have felt afraid to bring my young children here either. There seems to be cooperation with the city, and today the city and the protesters had agreed on some logistical changes ([Seattle shrinks CHOP area with street barriers](https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/seattle-transportation-crew-shrinks-capitol-hill-protest-area-with-street-barriers/)) to better facilitate emergency responders and local businesses and residents. I don’t know if I’d really consider myself that politically savvy, so I can’t really predict what will happen. I did support what I saw; it seemed like an act of civil disobedience at its finest. The dialog with the city seems promising. Something similar to what \*\* Shalmanese\*\* was saying would in my view be an ideal trajectory, if they could figure out a way to find out what works from the ground up in a coordinated effort between the community and city officials. ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/42 "2020-06-17T07:28:45Z")
I ate a steak today so I know at least one of their hacky sacks went into a gutter. I can’t wait to see autonomous zones in Chicago I bet they can teach law enforcement a thing or two! Just seems like a bunch of dumbass wannabe hippies to me, I don’t expect them to accomplish much. [https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=DdOw\_1592174459](https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=DdOw_1592174459) Here are some random videos, allegedly from the inside. ---
**Author:** ![GulfTiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e79b87/32.png) [@GulfTiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GulfTiger)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/43 "2020-06-17T14:14:33Z")
I support the idea of secession, so I’m excited about it. ---
**Author:** ![ThisIsTheEnd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thisistheend/32/4713_2.png) [@ThisIsTheEnd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisIsTheEnd)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/44 "2020-06-17T17:25:30Z")
As long as they don’t bring back jazz hands I’m good with it. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/45 "2020-06-17T18:23:00Z")
> [@Driver8](#): > > I actually visited this early evening while on my bike ride and hung around a bit and can confirm what most locals here are saying. At most it’s a protest that is continuous, but even that risks overstating things. > > I don’t want to call it a “festival”, because I think that trivializes what people are protesting about. The best analogy I can think of is that it seemed like what happens when instead of dissipating a regular protest turns 30 and settles down in the suburbs with an office job. The “youthful energy” of a 20 something (chanting, etc.) is gone, replaced with the calmer sequences of speeches, merchants in stalls selling shirts and food (as well as the established restaurants operating normally under COVID-19 restrictions), and mostly people just hanging out listening and chatting. If I was completely ignorant and squinted from a distance I would have guessed it was the farmer’s market. It was as expected a mostly young crowd, but there were families with small children and I would not have felt afraid to bring my young children here either. > > There seems to be cooperation with the city, and today the city and the protesters had agreed on some logistical changes ([Seattle shrinks CHOP area with street barriers](https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/seattle-transportation-crew-shrinks-capitol-hill-protest-area-with-street-barriers/)) to better facilitate emergency responders and local businesses and residents. > > I don’t know if I’d really consider myself that politically savvy, so I can’t really predict what will happen. I did support what I saw; it seemed like an act of civil disobedience at its finest. The dialog with the city seems promising. Something similar to what \*\* Shalmanese\*\* was saying would in my view be an ideal trajectory, if they could figure out a way to find out what works from the ground up in a coordinated effort between the community and city officials. I also went yesterday, though in the morning. Turns out, it’s mostly dead at 8:30. I was surprised to see the entire perimeter of the field at Cal Anderson lined with tents - I guess a lot of people are just living there at this point. I was there while SDOT was moving a bunch of barricades around, and the fire dept was also out in uniform chatting with random people. No one seemed to care about the city’s presence, though I later learned the SDOT maneuvers were negotiated with the protesters. Most people I did see were masked. No one hassled or extorted me. Maybe it was too early in the morning. Nothing about it changed my mind about anything, though it was cool to see in person. I wish I could have made it there at a more ‘happening’ time. ---
**Author:** ![Driver8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Driver8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Driver8)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/46 "2020-06-17T18:41:03Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > No one hassled or extorted me. Maybe it was too early in the morning. I was there maybe around 6pm and it was actually quite crowded. 99.9% of folks were wearing masks. There was no harassment or extortion, and again there were parents with small children milling about too. A lot of people were just wandering around, a lot of people were gathered at an intersection listening to speakers giving short speeches. Again, I don’t want to trivialize it, but in terms of energy and harassment, etc. this was much closer to a festival or farmer’s market than a protest. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/47 "2020-06-17T20:25:18Z")
> [@Driver8](#): > > I was there maybe around 6pm and it was actually quite crowded. 99.9% of folks were wearing masks. There was no harassment or extortion, and again there were parents with small children milling about too. A lot of people were just wandering around, a lot of people were gathered at an intersection listening to speakers giving short speeches. > > Again, I don’t want to trivialize it, but in terms of energy and harassment, etc. this was much closer to a festival or farmer’s market than a protest. In case it wasn’t clear, the part you quoted was meant in jest. I didn’t expect to be hassled or extorted. I’ve been long aware that that was right-wing noise machine crap, not reality. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/48 "2020-06-17T22:18:44Z")
> [@pool](#): > > I ate a steak today so I know at least one of their hacky sacks went into a gutter. I can’t wait to see autonomous zones in Chicago I bet they can teach law enforcement a thing or two! > > Just seems like a bunch of dumbass wannabe hippies to me, I don’t expect them to accomplish much. > > [https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=DdOw\_1592174459](https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=DdOw_1592174459) > > Here are some random videos, allegedly from the inside. Yeah - I’m not giving any credence to a site that runs the headline “Chaz abolishes alphabet and math. End systematic oppression now!” ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2020, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/49 "2020-06-17T22:26:51Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > Yeah - I’m not giving any credence to a site that runs the headline “Chaz abolishes alphabet and math. End systematic oppression now!” I’m not endorsing the description but the videos are there to watch, they don’t seem really bad in either direction, just hippies stumbling about. Definitely not some radical demilitarized zone or anything. I just posted them in case anyone wanted to watch, they aren’t particularly noteworthy. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/50 "2020-06-18T00:10:18Z")
CHAZ protester now says that people who “oppose the revolution” [need to be guillotined.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=8&v=NVvvYb9x5Yc&feature=emb_logo) ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/51 "2020-06-18T00:17:11Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > CHAZ protester now says that people who “oppose the revolution” [need to be guillotined.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=8&v=NVvvYb9x5Yc&feature=emb_logo) You found a random protestor with an unsavory opinion? ---
**Author:** ![ExVoxMachina](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@ExVoxMachina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExVoxMachina)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/52 "2020-06-18T00:43:25Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > CHAZ protester now says that people who “oppose the revolution” [need to be guillotined.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=8&v=NVvvYb9x5Yc&feature=emb_logo) Although your’e paraphrasing, there is an almost constant push and pull among the more organised groups about if the CHOP is a distraction or a standard to the BLM movement and whether it should be more radicalized. The curse of the left is self evaluation to an almost painfull level. I really like how he worked the new name in to his speech. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/53 "2020-06-18T01:15:01Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > CHAZ protester now says that people who “oppose the revolution” [need to be guillotined.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=8&v=NVvvYb9x5Yc&feature=emb_logo) Let me know when they actually do it. In the mean time a couple far right assholes actually did shoot some cops. > **[A man charged with killing a federal officer during George Floyd protests is...](https://www.businessinsider.com/steven-carrillo-charged-with-killing-officers-boogaloo-movement-2020-6)** > > Multiple people associated with the far-right have been accused of stoking violence connected to the protests against police brutality. ---
**Author:** ![Surreal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eada6e/32.png) [@Surreal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Surreal)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2020, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/54 "2020-06-24T22:26:01Z")
This thread didn’t age well. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2020, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/55 "2020-06-24T22:47:53Z")
Who could have predicted things [going badly in a lawless zone](https://www.king5.com/mobile/article/news/local/seattle/seattle-police-investigate-capitol-hill-shooting/281-04c066b5-e492-4441-a5a5-cd5805144238)? Oh, that’s right–everybody. Everybody could have predicted it. ---
**Author:** ![ExVoxMachina](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@ExVoxMachina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExVoxMachina)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/56 "2020-06-25T05:05:20Z")
Interesting development [Businesses, others file suit.](https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/businesses-sue-seattle-over-occupied-protest-zone/UTVJEEBMXRAWHGHFMYCBUOMOSE/) In past “occupations” like this in seattle they’ve taken over abandoned buildings with very little impact on residential areas. Also these were far from the seattle core in areas where at the time there was far less crime than the CHOP area. There is now a large homeless/transient population in the park. Which means drugs and Mental health issues. Which are not being addressed any longer. It is winding down quite quickly. Most the original larger groups are gone. Many saying that the area has lost its effectiveness. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/57 "2020-06-25T13:53:26Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Who could have predicted things [going badly in a lawless zone](https://www.king5.com/mobile/article/news/local/seattle/seattle-police-investigate-capitol-hill-shooting/281-04c066b5-e492-4441-a5a5-cd5805144238)? Oh, that’s right–everybody. Everybody could have predicted it. You can see exactly why we need this sort of protest from the article you quoted: > [@](#): > > The victim, who was shot in the calf, met officers and Seattle fire medics at the designated area outside of the CHOP, [according to the SPD](https://spdblotter.seattle.gov/2020/06/23/detectives-investigating-tuesday-morning-capitol-hill-shooting/). Police said **the victim refused to provide any information about the shooting or a suspect description.** The way our police does business is so utterly fucked that people who get shot don’t want to give them information about their shooters. If this was an isolated incident, that would be one thing; but this happens all the time. Victims are literally more afraid of the police than they are of their shooters. So much for “serve and protect”. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/58 "2020-06-25T14:30:37Z")
I’m getting an “Occupy Wall Street” vibe: A tale full of sound and fury… ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/59 "2020-06-25T14:35:30Z")
I suspect you’re right, **QS**. I live far from Seattle but am troubled by the thought that, in a modern democracy, there might be any place where the rule of law doesn’t apply and where public officials and police won’t go. Even relatively benign and peaceful mob rule is still mob rule. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2020, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551/60 "2020-06-25T14:36:42Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I live far from Seattle but am troubled by the thought that, in a modern democracy, there might be any place where the rule of law doesn’t apply and where public officials and police won’t go. Even relatively benign and peaceful mob rule is still mob rule. Are you also troubled by the fact that the rule of law doesn’t seem to apply to the people who are supposed to enforce the law? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-feel-about-the-chaz-seattle-take-over/855551.md?page=4)