# How do you know God's voice? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 4, 2012, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393 "2012-08-04T04:50:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/1 "2012-08-04T04:50:20Z")
If you are a believer, who thinks that God might literally talk to people, how would you know that the voice telling you to kill your son isn’t God? There’s a precedent that such a voice could indeed be God, right? So how do you distinguish schizophrenia from divine revelation? I asked the question in a thread that was only tangentially related to this topic, and predictably got no answers due to it being off topic. I am genuinely curious about how people who believe in a literal voice of God would explain this apparent dilemma, though. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/2 "2012-08-04T04:58:41Z")
No big mystery here, and it doesn’t take a believer to answer. If one assumes that God exists and is otherwise benevolent, then an instruction to perform an obviously malevolent act would have to come from some other source. ---
**Author:** ![greenslime1951](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9bcb4/32.png) [@greenslime1951](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greenslime1951)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/3 "2012-08-04T04:59:10Z")
With no external point of reference, it would be impossible to tell if _any_ sensory input was halluncinatory or real. So it comes back to a question of belief–if you want to believe that the voice in your head has an external origin, you will. Since no human being ever actually _has_ been spoken to by God or any other imaginary deity, yet, literally millions of people have claimed to have had that exact experience, one must conclude that it’s pretty dang easy for someone (particularly one already so inclined) to misinterpret an auditory hallucination as the voice of his/her favorite deity. I don’t think the particular heinousness of an act that is commanded by the hallucinatory voice (kill your son; appear on American Idol, etc.) makes much difference–after all, if your deity commands you to do something, you gosh-durn better do it, even if doing so contradicts prior instructions. In Christian as well as most other mythology, questioning the will of the God/gods was supposed to be very, very wrong–that’s why Abraham’s compliance in the Exodus (?) myth was supposedly so laudable. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/4 "2012-08-04T05:00:07Z")
God, being a god, I would think could magic your head into absolute belief you are talking to God. That or God, being a god, could provide some proof you are talking to God. Being omnipotent surely there is something God could do to make it abundantly clear that you are talking to the real deal. Such proof would be, by definition, trivial for God. Magic you out to Jupiter and have a convo there for instance then send you back when done (god will see to it that you do not die in the process). ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/5 "2012-08-04T05:04:35Z")
Well, that’s a fundamental problem, **Mole** , because once we accept that there are supernatural entities, what’s to say that some demon, devil or what have you can’t make you think you’re talking to God? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/6 "2012-08-04T05:40:56Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Well, that’s a fundamental problem, **Mole** , because once we accept that there are supernatural entities, what’s to say that some demon, devil or what have you can’t make you think you’re talking to God? Great point. Since this is all speculation/make-believe I would submit the following restrictions: If a supernatural entity (God or Satan or something lesser like angels/demons) could magic our brain into any state to believe anything they wanted there is some reason they don’t/can’t. - God is by definition omnipotent so surely that is within god’s power but for some reason god doesn’t do that. - Satan is powerful but not god so not omnipotent. Is Satan powerful enough to magic your brain into any belief or magic you out to Jupiter for a chit-chat? Frankly I have no idea. - Angles and demons are clearly lesser than the above so whatever keeps God/Satan from doing it would certainly apply to them as well. If Satan could magic our brains into becoming evil bastards then one would think he would do it. But that doesn’t happen so either he can’t or he can but God instantly undoes his manipulations so it is a non-starter for Satan. God, for whatever reason, does not magic goodness on us although it would be within God’s power. So, to be clear, I am making shit up. All I can say with certainty is Satan (if he existed which I do not think he or God for that matter do) does not snap his fingers and make everyone evil. If I were writing some fiction I would posit the restriction is humans have free will and magicking their brains to do what you want them to do is off limits. Satan does not play by the rules but God will enforce this. God could but God made everything and decided this is the rule and one even God will abide by. So, if you accept all that made-up bullshit then it takes something else to get you to believe you are talking to God. Could Satan still fool you? Sure. Is their a foolproof method to be sure if it is God or Satan you are talking to? I doubt it. One would presume both are waaaay smarter than you are so you cannot manage to outmaneuver them. I guess I am left with God doing some omnipotent shit but that would mean knowing what limits Satan/demons have and asking for something beyond their abilities. No idea what that would be. Ask them to swear on a bible that they are not evil maybe? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/7 "2012-08-04T05:52:00Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > No big mystery here, and it doesn’t take a believer to answer. If one assumes that God exists and is otherwise benevolent, then an instruction to perform an obviously malevolent act would have to come from some other source. There’s a precedent. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/8 "2012-08-04T05:54:31Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > There’s a precedent. Old Testament. The Big G (not Gandalf, the other one) doesn’t do blood sacrifice anymore. Or so I heard. Something about the J-Man making all that stuff obsolete. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/9 "2012-08-04T06:04:14Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Old Testament. The Big G (not Gandalf, the other one) doesn’t do blood sacrifice anymore. Or so I heard. Something about the J-Man making all that stuff obsolete. Well, J-Dawg is also on the record whipping a bunch of innocent entrepreneurs and destroying property. In a \*church \*! Now that might not be big league Evil, but it’s not a very Christian thing to do either, is it ? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/10 "2012-08-04T06:29:03Z")
He also destroyed a fig tree like a petulant child. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/11 "2012-08-04T07:54:41Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > That or God, being a god, could provide some proof you are talking to God. Being omnipotent surely there is something God could do to make it abundantly clear that you are talking to the real deal. Thing is, something doesn’t need to be God, omnipotent or even supernatural to do that. It just needs to be powerful enough to fool a human. Anything that can control minds for example can convince anyone of anything; and that’s much less powerful than omnipotence. There’s an awful lot of hypothetical entities that are more plausible than a tri-omni (or even one-omni) god that could fool a human that way. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/12 "2012-08-04T07:59:12Z")
I know when I hear the voice of God because I want to tell Him to shut the fuck up. He’s good at two things, puppies and kitties and ittle babbies on the one hand, and soul-crushing authoritarianism and wholesale bloodshed on the other, and I strongly suspect the puppykittybabby part is just PR to get people on His side for the real business at hand. ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/13 "2012-08-04T11:09:24Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Old Testament. The Big G (not Gandalf, the other one) doesn’t do blood sacrifice anymore. Or so I heard. Something about the J-Man making all that stuff obsolete. If something is good purely because God says so then God can change his mind about what is good and decide that you need to kill your family. If God cannot change what is good then goodness exists independently from God and we no longer need God as the source of goodness. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/14 "2012-08-04T11:16:45Z")
You hear Him every time you stop taking the Prozac. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/15 "2012-08-04T13:10:09Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Old Testament. The Big G (not Gandalf, the other one) doesn’t do blood sacrifice anymore. Or so I heard. Something about the J-Man making all that stuff obsolete. He never did human sacrifice. That was always against the rules, yet there he is commanding someone to do it. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/16 "2012-08-04T13:41:02Z")
I would expect near perfect syntax. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/17 "2012-08-04T14:01:19Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > No big mystery here, and it doesn’t take a believer to answer. If one assumes that God exists and is otherwise benevolent, then an instruction to perform an obviously malevolent act would have to come from some other source. So a voice tells you an agent of the devil is next door and plans to kill people, and you should go cut off his head with nail scissors before he can do that. Is that a benevolent God asking you to save lives or a malevolent voice trying to trick you? How about if the voice is telling you to oppose gay marriage? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/18 "2012-08-04T16:00:51Z")
Always ask for I.D. ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/19 "2012-08-04T16:31:40Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Always ask for I.D. Satan has a fake I.D. He can fool everyone but cops and bouncers. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393/20 "2012-08-04T17:19:50Z")
> [@fumster](#): > > So a voice tells you an agent of the devil is next door and plans to kill people, and you should go cut off his head with nail scissors before he can do that. Is that a benevolent God asking you to save lives or a malevolent voice trying to trick you? Pretty much anything calling for violence would obviously not be a product of divine inspiration. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-do-you-know-gods-voice/630393.md?page=2)