# How does a newly minted Lieutenant get posted? (Marine Recon and in general) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 1, 2016, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531 "2016-12-01T14:59:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/1 "2016-12-01T14:59:53Z")
Query prompted by re-watching the superb _Generation Kill_, which follows a Marine Recon platoon in the Gulf War. Can you be made be a commander _right off the bat_, after West Point, of a special forces outfit (I’m sure the services differ) such as Marine Recon, who are trained in tactics and basic skills of such a wide area (well, specialized ones)? How _does_ one get farmed out upon graduation? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/2 "2016-12-01T16:26:15Z")
I don’t know the answer, but I’ll just be the first jerk to point out that Marines don’t go to West Point, they go to the Naval Academy at Anapolis. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/3 "2016-12-01T16:30:04Z")
Thank you. I knew I shouldn’t have edited in “West Point,” but it was before I added “right off the bat,” and wanted to underline that. Sucks to have to write, dontit? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/4 "2016-12-01T16:50:49Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > I don’t know the answer, but I’ll just be the first jerk to point out that Marines don’t go to West Point, they go to the Naval Academy at Anapolis. That’s what I was going to say. Outside of that, it’s probably unusual, if not impossible for a freshly minted O-1 to command some sort of elite special operations unit. I’m sure there are various requirements just to apply for the spec ops training. For example, US Special Forces (Green Berets) require O-2 or O-3 officers just to attend the training. However, outside of special operations units, it’s not uncommon for new officers to be assigned an appropriate command- like a platoon. As for the actual mechanism for actually being assigned to a unit, I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/5 "2016-12-01T16:52:38Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > I don’t know the answer, but I’ll just be the first jerk to point out that Marines don’t go to West Point, they go to the Naval Academy at Anapolis. If they go through the Academy; the US Armed Forces have a surprising amount of other ways to become an officer. They mainly seem to boil down to “Academy, ROTC or promotion from enlisted” but the ROTC part alone already includes several different versions. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/6 "2016-12-01T17:11:10Z")
Doesn’t answer the command question, but this article may shed some light on the immediate post-graduation process: [http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/anne-arundel/annapolis/bs-md-naval-academy-service-assignments-20141120-story.html](http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/anne-arundel/annapolis/bs-md-naval-academy-service-assignments-20141120-story.html) Basically you choose 3 preferred assignments, and you get one of those, or something completely different, it’s entirely out of your hands. Most get their 1st or 2nd choice. You can also apply to postgraduate medical school (USU), but this incurs an additional commitment and is extremely competitive (classes are about 160 students, approximately 50 from each service academy plus a few Public Health Service students). They will be full O-1 their first day (this may be a demotion for some students) and they are barred from promotion until graduation, upon which they are immediately promoted to O-3. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/7 "2016-12-01T17:22:18Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Doesn’t answer the command question, but this article may shed some light on the immediate post-graduation process: > > [http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/anne-arundel/annapolis/bs-md-naval-academy-service-assignments-20141120-story.html](http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/anne-arundel/annapolis/bs-md-naval-academy-service-assignments-20141120-story.html) > > Basically you choose 3 preferred assignments, and you get one of those, or something completely different, it’s entirely out of your hands. Most get their 1st or 2nd choice. > . Pakistan Army, not US Military, but my Dad graduated 9th of 340 in his class. He ticked Armour and Infantry as his two options, but they told him he was too smart to be a tanker or an infantryman, so he should be an Engineer, which he most certainly did not want. Eventually, they sent him to the Artillery. As he says, if he had not done as well as he did in his finals, he would have gotten his desired assignments. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/8 "2016-12-01T17:31:55Z")
For the Army: Most LTs are slotted through a combination of assigned branch, merit, needs of the Army, and preference of the officer. Arguably, in that order. Ranger Regiment does not take new LTs. After a LT has had about a year of exceptional platoon leader time, he can apply for regiment. It is very competitive. If the application is approved, he will then go to Ft Benning to attend an assessment and selection program that lasts about 2 months. If they are selected, they will be assigned to a platoon within regiment. For Special Forces, the LT will have to have completed all of his required platoon leader time and about ready to make captain, or newly promoted to captain. There is only a small window of time where an officer can apply. If he is in that window, and so desires, he can apply for the SF Assessment and Selection program. That’s about a month long program at Ft. Bragg (Camp Mackall, actually). Again, that program is very competitive, especially for officers. There will only be a certain number of officers selected during each SFAS. There are other administrative requirements like being about to get a TS Clearance, getting over an 85 on the language exam, and stuff like that. But that’s basically it. I’m betting Force Recon is similar in that they probably don’t accept brand new officers. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/9 "2016-12-01T17:42:52Z")
**Bear** , thank you as always for your willingness to share your hard-earned, wide knowledge of this stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/10 "2016-12-01T17:54:09Z")
So the most junior officers in U.S. special ops units are platoon officers, like in regular land combat units? I’m asking because in Israeli _sayarot_, junior officers are essentially beefed-up squad leaders, leading teams of 12-20 soldiers. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/11 "2016-12-01T17:58:59Z")
Always happy to oblige. Also, after re-reading my post, I kind of made it seem like the SF officer only has a month program, but the Ranger has one that’s twice as long. I neglected to mention, that while the Ranger LT is assigned to a platoon in regiment following a successful run at assessment and selection, the SF officer goes on to receive further training before being assigned to an A-Team. If the officer passes that 1 month selection program, he will be sent to the maneuver officer captain career course immediately if he hasn’t already completed it. After that (like 6 months), he goes back to bragg to start Special Forces Officer 18A training. I think that’s like a year long with various phases like small unit tactics, SERE, Robin Sage, 18A specific stuff, and language training. After all of _that_ is complete, he graduates and is awarded the green beret and Special Forces tab. After graduation, he is sent to an SF Group to serve as a ODA team commander. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2016, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-a-newly-minted-lieutenant-get-posted-marine-recon-and-in-general/773531/12 "2016-12-01T18:03:26Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > So the most junior officers in U.S. special ops units are platoon officers, like in regular land combat units? I’m asking because in Israeli _sayarot_, junior officers are essentially beefed-up squad leaders, leading teams of 12-20 soldiers. Yes. The most junior officer in Ranger Regiment is a 1LT (O-2). Other infantry units receive brand new 2LTs (O-1) who are immediately placed in charge of a platoon of around 30 people. They do have a Platoon Sergeant (E-7) to help develop and advise them, though.