# How does an autonomous car decide which parking space I want? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 19, 2016, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137 "2016-12-19T15:32:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/81 "2016-12-24T12:45:45Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > That’s a cute, witty comment. 🙂 > But it actually raises a _very_ important issue: how robust will the software be, and who will set the standards. > Because if, say, one brand of car allows cookies, and another company does not—there are going to be big big,problems. > Will all cars recognize each other all the time? Will Apple cars know how to deal with Windows cars? > Will individual drivers set their own cookies and preferences? > > Here’s an example, : > There was a funny-but-not funny story on Fark .com about an ambulance which failed to save a patient because it didn’t arrive on time. The reason: the ambulance driver went to the location by strictly following the route displayed on GPS(as required by the regulations of his job.) But somebody on a previous shift had reset the GPS program, and accidently changed the mode–to “scenic route”, instead of “fastest route”. There’s also the story about the forces during the initial invasion of Afghanistan - they had a gizmo using GPS that would pinpoint a target location relative to them and transmit the coordinates to an aircraft overhead for precision bombing. They were about to call in an airstrike on the opposing Taliban when the battery died . They changed the battery and called in the airstrike, not realizing that on reboot it re-set the strike location to its current position. It’s important to understand the programming and how it works for any device. I’m also imaginging the “Wiley Coyote murders”. Drag an obstacle across a road, painted with a tunnel (and with radar-absorbing paint) and see if the self-driving car goes head-first into it like a bad cartoon. Modern car electronics are quite capable of recording every minute detail of what’s going on, up to and including a few months of interior video. What are the privacy rules? Are the police able to access any and all data on demand, or only with a warrant? Gives new meaning to “roaming profile” too. Does your behaviour and favorites and such carry over from Apple Car to Tesla to Google? Or do they each build separate profiles of you? Or are the profiles part of the company - your “Uber profile”? Or tied to your credit card? Will SDC’s refuse to take you to the “bad areas” of town, because after they drop you off they will be hemmed in and stripped? It’s hard enough to get police to respond to minor problems right now, how responsive will they be to an alarm about a property crime with no human victims? Maybe Uber will need its own security service. ---
**Author:** ![dofe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ba0ec/32.png) [@dofe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dofe)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/82 "2016-12-24T17:07:31Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > I’m also imaginging the “Wiley Coyote murders”. Drag an obstacle across a road, painted with a tunnel (and with radar-absorbing paint) and see if the self-driving car goes head-first into it like a bad cartoon. > > . Given the things I’ve seen human drivers do, it wouldn’t surprise me if a not insignificant number of human drivers would go head-first into such an obstacle. Case in point: > **[Trip To Candle Store Takes Drastic Turn](https://jalopnik.com/trip-to-candle-store-takes-drastic-turn-1790001106)** > > Two women in Alabama were on a mission from God. They were going to a candle supply shop, and there was nothing on this earth that was going to stop them. Not even a car-swallowing loading dock. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/83 "2016-12-24T17:45:48Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The key shortcoming to car-sharing is that it \*\*won’t \*\*be a solution to rush hour traffic. > > Yes, most people’s cars are unused except from, say 7 to 8am while they drive to work and from 5 to 6pm when they drive home. But everybody else’s car is used on the exact same schedule. > > Just like you can’t make a real 2x4 out of sawdust & chips, you can’t add up all the cars sitting unused between 2 and 3 am and use those car-hours to create more cars from 5 to 6 pm. > > Car sharing for the masses works once we eliminate standard working hours so 1/24th of the populace reports for work each hour of the day. Once you consider how far-fetched that is, you see how car-sharing will not be a solution to commuter rush-hour traffic. It may make a dent in car ownership, but it’ll be a small dent. This assumes automated cars will be used the same way as cars except they will be driving themselves. If you applied the same reasoning to cell phones vs landlines you would be way off. Some major misses here: (1) Car pooling becomes easily practical with a network of automated cars. Today it is essentially one person per car at rush hour. That wont remain true. (2) Cars can be physically smaller. No one would buy a one seater now because they arent practical. But if its just me in the car what would I care? (3) Capacity of roads will increase. Automated cars arent going to slow going around a curve or up a hill causing traffic, for example. Reaction time for the cars is improved so they can travel closed together. In the future they will talk to each other meaning that distance can be reduced even further Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/84 "2016-12-24T17:49:00Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I don’t understand why people always make a connection between self-driving cars and car sharing. Yes, there are advantages to car-sharing, but all of those advantages already exist now, with human-driven cars, and to nearly the same degree they would exist with self-driving sharecars. People now have, for the most part, decided that the advantages of sharecars are not worth the drawbacks, and I can’t see why that would change in the era of self-driving cars. Self driving cars will flip the economics. Uber is more expensive than having my own car because of the money going to the driver. With no driver it becomes cheaper because the capital cost of the car is shared and I dont need insurance. They also make car pooling practical which will further tip the economics. Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/85 "2016-12-24T18:08:17Z")
I’m always a little surprised at how many people see all this as either / or. First, there are plenty of driving situations where it’s hard to imagine an autonomous vehicle handling it well. When I built my shed, I would back my truck right up to the worksite 200 feet into the yard. When we had that big ice storm, I drove from tree bit to tree bit and threw the pieces in the back of the truck. I’ve a friend who has large parties on his 20 acres, and we drive right to the site of the party. I also suspect that in really bad storms, the type where most people stay home but some have to go to work, a human will better navigate some of the obstacles mentioned upthread. I have had to plow my Ford Escort through a plow bank to get to my exit. The other issue is the paranoia about them taking away non-autonomous vehicles. As far as I know, every vehicle that has ever legally been sold in the US is still legal to drive in the US, so long as it meets the requirements of when it was built. I still see Model Ts on the road routinely in the summer. I love cars. I love to drive. But I hate commuting and I can’t wait until I have the option not to. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/86 "2016-12-24T18:31:44Z")
How does self-driving cars make car pooling more practical than now? I don’t want detours on my way to or from work. I could use public transportation _today_ if I wanted to bother with others. And then once I’m at work, what if I need to visit a supplier or plant? I already have that conundrum when I choose to ride my bicycle, but not everyone has that choice. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/87 "2016-12-24T18:40:07Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > I also suspect that in really bad storms, the type where most people stay home but some have to go to work, a human will better navigate some of the obstacles mentioned upthread. I have had to plow my Ford Escort through a plow bank to get to my exit. This. While the overall percentage of us is small, there are a few million at least that sometimes need to take the initiative and use their very specific knowledge, ability and experience to get to where they need to be. It’s aggravating that SUV’s have turned into crossovers with no real 4x4 ability. Sure, the VDC and all the other bells and whistles help most people, but for some, it can be a hindrance (not always, it is pretty good). Luckily that system can be turned off. For now. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/88 "2016-12-24T19:50:45Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Maybe the car would drop you off at the door, and then, who cares where it parks? Aye, why wouldn’t having an auto be like having valet parking wherever you go? Who tells the valet where to park? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/89 "2016-12-24T19:52:02Z")
> [@dofe](#): > > Car sharing is already a thing – are you being forced to participate? There’s no such thing as “car sharing”. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/90 "2016-12-24T19:55:24Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > There’s no such thing as “car sharing”. I agree. I would no more “car share” than I would invite random strangers to use my guest room. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/91 "2016-12-24T20:20:22Z")
I don’t know what you mean by “There’s no such thing as ‘car sharing’.” As used by companies like Zipcar, car sharing basically means short-term car rentals, even for as short a period as a single hour. And rather than needing to travel to the car rental agency, the cars used for car sharing are located throughout the city. The system is set up so that you can rent a car immediately upon walking up to it. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/92 "2016-12-24T21:17:08Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > There’s no such thing as “car sharing”. There absolutely is, both instant rental services like goget ( in Australia ) and ride sharing services. Just because you don’t like to use them doesn’t mean you get to deny their existence. > **[GoGet Carshare | Australia's Leading Car Rental Network](https://www.goget.com.au/)** > > Hire a car, van, peoplemover or SUV near you by the hour or the day. GoGet is Australia's #1 car sharing service with a fleet of over 3000 vehicles in all the best spots. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/93 "2016-12-24T21:25:41Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I don’t know what you mean by “There’s no such thing as ‘car sharing’.” As used by companies like Zipcar, car sharing basically means short-term car rentals, even for as short a period as a single hour. And rather than needing to travel to the car rental agency, the cars used for car sharing are located throughout the city. The system is set up so that you can rent a car immediately upon walking up to it. We are talking across each other again. And it’s my fault. When I think of “car sharing” I immediately think about sharing my car. I understand that I’m in the wrong here, and will try to understand this new paradigm. For myself, it simply will not work. I hope people try to understand that as well. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/94 "2016-12-24T21:33:49Z")
FYI, [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carsharing) is the Wikipedia article on the type of car sharing I meant, which is the type offered by Zipcar and like companies. It is, as I said, short-term car rentals. There were Internet startups that let you offer your personal car for others to rent but obviously that’s different and that would be up to you to decide you wanted to do it. ---
**Author:** ![dofe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ba0ec/32.png) [@dofe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dofe)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2016, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/95 "2016-12-24T23:31:37Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > There’s no such thing as “car sharing”. Car sharing in the form of short term car rentals where you reserve and pick up cars parked around your location (using an uber-like app) already exist. The latest entry to this market is owned by BMW, and you can certainly bet that automakers are taking a close look at this in light of the potential with self driving cars. [http://www.geekwire.com/2016/testing-bmws-car-sharing-service-car2go-competitor-lives-premium-hype/](http://www.geekwire.com/2016/testing-bmws-car-sharing-service-car2go-competitor-lives-premium-hype/) ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2016, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/96 "2016-12-25T00:49:56Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Aye, why wouldn’t having an auto be like having valet parking wherever you go? Who tells the valet where to park? Another lost job category that no one has been talking about. First they came for the truckers, but I’m not one (blah, blah, blah), then the taxi drivers (blah blah), then finally the valet parkers. ---
**Author:** ![urban1a](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e47c2d/32.png) [@urban1a](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urban1a)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2016, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/97 "2016-12-25T01:55:22Z")
I think **Son of a Rich** is the most correct. I have heard a guy with a Tesla X who says his car drops him off at the front door and then goes to the garage by itself. When he is ready to leave, the car comes back to the front door (or whichever he wants). All you really need is to get to the store, restaurant, theater, etc. After that, you really don’t care where the car goes as long as it comes back and picks you up whey you are ready. In an emergency, you can easily find the car using GPS, but you would probably piss it off if you cheated it out of a chance to come get you. Bob ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2016, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/98 "2016-12-25T02:43:00Z")
I agree with **enipla** that “car sharing” is a really crappy misleading bit of marketing speak for “short term car rental.” I know the term is in use that way and we’re stuck with it. I don’t have to like it. The whole hoopla since the early 2000’s about “the sharing economy” was all about ordinary people being able to rent out their ordinary possessions when not otherwise in use. Renting out your spare bedroom, renting out your lawnmower, etc. With apps to centralize the problem of introducing buyers to sellers. It was explicitly \*not \*about capitalists or laborers using this as just another distribution channel for otherwise conventional rental or service businesses. Neither Uber nor Zipcar are examples of the “sharing” paradigm. Uber might have been if people signed up as drivers to be able to pick up passengers and a couple bucks while driving to wherever they were already going. The moment driving for Uber became the \*de facto \*job of unlicensed taxi driver, it ceased to be part of the “sharing economy” and entered the “gig economy”. If Costco is a membership warehouse store then Zipcar is a membership car rental company. Marketing-speak be damned. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2016, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/99 "2016-12-25T04:33:53Z")
But if you’re willing to use the same car as others, why would you buy it? It’d almost certainly be more economical for you to rent, too, leaving the actual ownership to some big faceless corporation. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2016, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137/100 "2016-12-25T09:37:34Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > How does self-driving cars make car pooling more practical than now? I don’t want detours on my way to or from work. I could use public transportation _today_ if I wanted to bother with others. > > And then once I’m at work, what if I need to visit a supplier or plant? I already have that conundrum when I choose to ride my bicycle, but not everyone has that choice. It is relatively easy to match up people in ad hoc groups when you know where everyone is trying to travel from and to. That’s more practical than assembling a traditional car pool. Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-does-an-autonomous-car-decide-which-parking-space-i-want/775137.md?page=4)