More importantly, the Purim Seudah falls out on Friday this year.
*Originally posted by sdimbert *
**
More importantly, the Purim Seudah falls out on Friday this year.**
Well, yes, any year in which Purim comes out on Friday, the first Seder will be Saturday night. I hate when that happens (who wants to daven at six in the morning on Shabbos???)
Zev Steinhardt
On a tangent, how does the Jewish calendar compare with the Chinese lunar calendar? I thought the Chinese calendar had leap years every three years, but now I’m wondering if it’s really seven every 19 years.
*Originally posted by Greg Charles *
**On a tangent, how does the Jewish calendar compare with the Chinese lunar calendar? I thought the Chinese calendar had leap years every three years, but now I’m wondering if it’s really seven every 19 years. **
Yes. A 30 day month (Adar I) is added in the 3rd, 6th, 8th, 11th, 14th, 17th and 19th years of the cycle.
I couldn’t comment on the Chinese calendar.
Zev Steinhardt
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by zev_steinhardt *
**
Well, yes, any year in which Purim comes out on Friday, the first Seder will be Saturday night. I hate when that happens (who wants to daven at six in the morning on Shabbos???)**
Drunk. That makes it worse.
;j
Actually, I am not sure what you mean about 6:00 Shabbos morning.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by sdimbert *
**
*Originally posted by zev_steinhardt *
**Well, yes, any year in which Purim comes out on Friday, the first Seder will be Saturday night. I hate when that happens (who wants to daven at six in the morning on Shabbos???)**
Drunk. That makes it worse.
;j
Actually, I am not sure what you mean about 6:00 Shabbos morning.
**
Well, you have to have a chometz meal on Shabbos morning (because you can’t eat matzah on Erev Pesach). And you have to finish eating your chometz by 9:30 or so (depending on your location, etc.). So, to do this, on Shabbos Erev Pesach, you must first start davening very early.
Zev Steinhardt
Zev Steinhardt
>> Why do the jewish holidays fall on different dates every year?
The answer is they don’t. They fall on the same dates of the Jewish calendar which do not coincide every year with the dates of the Christian calendar.
Some time ago I found a document on the net at http://www.pip.dknet.dk/~c-t/calendar.html but it does not seem to be available now so I will quote it:
- The Hebrew Calendar
The current definition of the Hebrew calendar is generally said to have been set down by the Sanhedrin president Hillel II in approximately AD 359. The original details of his calendar are, however, uncertain.
The Hebrew calendar is used for religious purposes by Jews all over the world, and it is the official calendar of Israel.
The Hebrew calendar is a combined solar/lunar calendar, in that it strives to have its years coincide with the tropical year and its months coincide with the synodic months. This is a complicated goal, and the rules for the Hebrew calendar are correspondingly fascinating.
3.1. What does a Hebrew year look like?An ordinary (non-leap) year has 353, 354, or 355 days.
A leap year has 383, 384, or 385 days.
The three lengths of the years are termed, “deficient”, “regular”,
and “complete”, respectively.An ordinary year has 12 months, a leap year has 13 months.
Every month starts (approximately) on the day of a new moon.
The months and their lengths are:
Length in a Length in a Length in a Name deficient year regular year complete year ------- -------------- ------------ ------------- Tishri 30 30 30 Heshvan 29 29 30 Kislev 29 30 30 Tevet 29 29 29 Shevat 30 30 30 (Adar I 30 30 30) Adar II 29 29 29 Nisan 30 30 30 Iyar 29 29 29 Sivan 30 30 30 Tammuz 29 29 29 Av 30 30 30 Elul 29 29 29 ------- -------------- ------------ ------------- Total: 353 or 383 354 or 384 355 or 385
The month Adar I is only present in leap years. In non-leap years Adar II is simply called “Adar”.
Note that in a regular year the numbers 30 and 29 alternate; a complete year is created by adding a day to Heshvan, whereas a deficient year is created by removing a day from Kislev.
The alteration of 30 and 29 ensures that when the year starts with a new moon, so does each month.
3.2. What years are leap years?A year is a leap year if the number year mod 19 is one of the following: 0, 3, 6, 8, 11, 14, or 17.
The value for year in this formula is the ‘Anno Mundi’ described in section 3.8.
3.3. What years are deficient, regular, and complete?That is the wrong question to ask. The correct question to ask is: When does a Hebrew year begin? Once you have answered that question (see section 3.6), the length of the year is the number of days between 1 Tishri in one year and 1 Tishri in the following year.
3.4. When is New Year’s day?That depends. Jews have 4 different days to choose from:
1 Tishri: “Rosh HaShanah”. This day is a celebration of the creation
of the world and marks the start of a new calendar
year. This will be the day we shall base our calculations on
in the following sections.15 Shevat: “Tu B’shevat”. The new year for trees, when fruit tithes
should be brought.1 Nisan: “New Year for Kings”. Nisan is considered the first month,
although it occurs 6 or 7 months after the start of the
calendar year.1 Elul: “New Year for Animal Tithes (Taxes)”.
Only the first two dates are celebrated nowadays.
3.5. When does a Hebrew day begin?A Hebrew-calendar day does not begin at midnight, but at either sunset
or when three medium-sized stars should be visible, depending on the
religious circumstance.Sunset marks the start of the 12 night hours, whereas sunrise marks the
start of the 12 day hours. This means that night hours may be longer
or shorter than day hours, depending on the season.
3.6. When does a Hebrew year begin?The first day of the calendary year, Rosh HaShanah, on 1 Tishri is
determined as follows:
The new year starts on the day of the new moon that occurs about
354 days (or 384 days if the previous year was a leap year) after
1 Tishri of the previous yearIf the new moon occurs after noon on that day, delay the new year
by one day. (Because in that case the new crescent moon will not be
visible until the next day.)If this would cause the new year to start on a Sunday, Wednesday,
or Friday, delay it by one day. (Because we want to avoid that
Yom Kippur (10 Tishri) falls on a Friday or Sunday, and that
Hoshanah Rabba (21 Tishri) falls on a Sabbath (Saturday)).If two consecutive years start 356 days apart (an illegal year
length), delay the start of the first year by two days.If two consecutive years start 382 days apart (an illegal year
length), delay the start of the second year by one day.
Note: Rule 4 can only come into play if the first year was supposed to start on a Tuesday. Therefore a two day delay is used rather that a one day delay, as the year must not start on a Wednesday as stated in
rule 3.
3.7. When is the new moon?
A calculated new moon is used. In order to understand the
calculations, one must know that an hour is subdivided into 1080 ‘parts’.The calculations are as follows:
The new moon that started the year AM 1, occurred 5 hours and 204 parts after sunset (i.e. just before midnight on Julian date 6 October 3761 BC).
The new moon of any particular year is calculated by extrapolating from this time, using a synodic month of 29 days 12 hours and 793 parts.
Note that 18:00 Jerusalem time (15:39 UT) is used instead of sunset in all these calculations.
3.8. How does one count years?Years are counted since the creation of the world, which is assumed to have taken place in 3761 BC. In that year, AM 1 started (AM = Anno Mundi = year of the world).
In the year AD 1998 we have witnessed the start of Hebrew year AM 5759.
I copied the entire document because it has an explanation of all calendars.
Zev,
Thanks for setting me straight. I hadn’t thought that far ahead.
Yeesh. Shabbos Erev Pesach. Yuck.
I remember a few years ago when this happened - I remember attending a shiur all about how to get around eating chametz at Shalosh Shudos, but I don’t remember any such difficulty regarding eating lunch.
Of course, what you say makes sense. As soon as I go downstairs I’ll check what Rabbi Frankel says… If I can’t get up here tonight, I will post it tomorrow.
*Originally posted by CKDextHavn *
**And Mellonhead, if you go searching the Mailbag, you’ll find an extravagant discussion by Straight Dope Staff Dex (c’est moi!) on the leap year subject in the Gregorian calendars, with reference to the Julian, Jewish, and Islamic calendars: Why do we have leap years?
[Edited by CKDextHavn on 10-10-2000 at 04:13 PM] **
Wow…thanks for the link; dear god man, you weren’t kidding when you said ‘extravagant discussion’