# How easily could people start a fire before matches and lighters? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 28, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606 "2011-12-28T05:46:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/101 "2016-06-12T10:21:05Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Dayum, I gotta find me one of those! [Here you go](http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=64338&cat=1,41182). Also found [wooden reproduction ones](http://redrosereproductions.com/spill-plane/) of an earlier pattern, but at near 3 times the cost. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/102 "2016-06-12T15:12:40Z")
3 pages in and no one has mentioned the magnifying glass? Yeah, it requires the sun to be out so you may have to plan your fire a little ahead of time but it does have the advantage of being reusable. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/103 "2016-06-12T15:51:30Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > 3 pages in and no one has mentioned the magnifying glass? Here ya’ go: > [@Lumpy](#): > > If I were to carry a prepared fire starter with me, it would be a lighter, matches, a striker, a magnifying mirror, etc. . > [@puzzlegal](#): > > Oh, and don’t forget that you can use a magnifying glass on a sunny day. That’s pretty easy and stores well. Of course, you need the weather to cooperate. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/104 "2016-06-12T17:52:52Z")
From _[The private journal of Aaron Burr, during his residence of four years in Europe](https://archive.org/details/privatejournalof02burr)_: > [@](#): > > I did go to bed at 10, promising myself a rich sleep. Lay two hours vigil; that cursed one single dish of tea! Note: My bed had undergone a thorough ablution and there were no bugs or insects. Got up and attempted to light candle, but in vain; had flint and matches but only some shreds of punk which would not catch. Recollected a gun which I had on my late journey; filled the pan with powder and was just going to flash it when it occurred that though I had not loaded it someone else might; tried and found in it a very heavy charge! What a fine alarm it would have made if I had fired! Then poured out some powder on a piece of paper, put the shreds of punk with it and after fifty essays succeeded in firing the powder ; but it being dark, had put more powder than intended; my shirt caught fire, the papers on my table caught fire, burnt my fingers to a blister (the left hand, fortunately); it seemed like a general conflagration. Succeeded, however, in lighting my candle and passed the night till 5 this morning in smoking, reading, and writing this. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/105 "2016-06-12T17:59:17Z")
LOL! Sounds like he had a rough time of it. And no smoking in bed, Aaron. Yeah the magnifying glass just isn’t likely to be useful in a survival situation. Even a fire itself is probably over-rated, although as a morale builder it may have some utility. In dry or drought conditions almost no technique is required, the idea is to prevent burning the place down. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2016, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/106 "2016-07-02T23:44:49Z")
Finally got a bow drill to work. For some reason, the wood my spindle is made out of takes a fine polish that reduces friction to virtually nothing. Solved by using a lighter to char the end of the spindle, works great now. Next step: see if I can make my own bow, spindle and foot piece from found wood (the footpiece I bought is wearing out!) Fortunately [basswood](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilia) trees are common here; a wood so soft you’d mistake it for pine if you didn’t know otherwise. A [Janka hardness rating](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janka_hardness_test) of 410, probably the softest deciduous wood you’ll find in North America. Probably softer than whatever the bow kit I sent off for is made out of. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/107 "2016-07-04T20:35:32Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Finally got a bow drill to work. For some reason, the wood my spindle is made out of takes a fine polish that reduces friction to virtually nothing. Solved by using a lighter to char the end of the spindle, works great now. Got it: Step 1, start a fire. Step 2, char the stick end. Step 3, start a fire. (I know, I know. A lot of low tech stuff is sped up considerably if you were able to do it before. But it’s that very first time that’s the pain.) ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/108 "2016-07-05T16:29:23Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Got it: Step 1, start a fire. Step 2, char the stick end. Step 3, start a fire. > > (I know, I know. A lot of low tech stuff is sped up considerably if you were able to do it before. But it’s that very first time that’s the pain.) I presume the very first time you “burn in” a brand-new foot piece and spindle, it helps to add some sort of abrasive (fine dust, etc.) to get enough friction to char the spindle end and the foot piece hole. ETA: In the demo video I watched, the guy said that the purpose of being able to start a fire with a bow drill is so you can make charred tinder so you can use flint and steel the next time. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BobArrgh](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobarrgh/32/2881_2.png) [@BobArrgh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobArrgh)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/109 "2016-07-05T20:52:48Z")
I’ve seen a few demonstrations of fire-starting over the years. At Fort Osage near Kansas City, the guide in the Trading Post demonstrated charred cloth which was sparked with a flint and steel. It took about 30 seconds, but it was indoors under absolutely the best conditions (dry tinder, etc.) He allowed me to take the big magnifying glass out to the picnic table outside to start a fire using a leaf. Took about 20 seconds in the bright sunlight. I saw a New Guinea tribesman start one using a bow and spindle. It, too, was indoors, out of the wind. Now, this was a man in his 30s or 40s, and for whom starting a fire like that was a normal way of life for him. He did is so quickly, that I think if I was racing him with a lighter, he would have had the fire started before I could have got the lighter out of my pocket. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/110 "2016-07-05T21:47:35Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Elsewhere, I don’t think the Inuit have taken up farming, just yet…but not sure how much of their food is imported. I grew up in Alaska, and while subsistence hunting is very important it’s all done with modern methods. Rifles, snow machines, ATVs, motorboats, and so on. There’s no such thing as a village without an airstrip. So in a place like Barrow you get scenes like this: [I got to witness this in Barrow a few years ago. - Imgur](http://i.imgur.com/D4jbJsc.jpg) And also scenes like this: [http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-FmzspuET-lo/T\_T0FPuE\_KI/AAAAAAAAAQM/CtV3NgCmmOY/s1600/CIMG5773.JPG](http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-FmzspuET-lo/T_T0FPuE_KI/AAAAAAAAAQM/CtV3NgCmmOY/s1600/CIMG5773.JPG) Yeah, expect to pay shockingly high prices for produce in Barrow. Hunting and fishing are a big deal in Alaska, even for white people. Some people get a sizable fraction of their meat from hunting. But lots of others just go to the grocery store. And notice the clothing of the people butchering the whale. All modern clothing. Sure people sometimes make traditional clothing, fur parkas and so on, but that’s considered fancy, not something you’d wear if there was a chance of getting dirty. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2016, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/111 "2016-08-12T04:13:50Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Finally got a bow drill to work. For some reason, the wood my spindle is made out of takes a fine polish that reduces friction to virtually nothing. Solved by using a lighter to char the end of the spindle, works great now. > > Next step: see if I can make my own bow, spindle and foot piece from found wood (the footpiece I bought is wearing out!) Fortunately [basswood](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilia) trees are common here; a wood so soft you’d mistake it for pine if you didn’t know otherwise. A [Janka hardness rating](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janka_hardness_test) of 410, probably the softest deciduous wood you’ll find in North America. Probably softer than whatever the bow kit I sent off for is made out of. I like Cottonwood, it’s light enough to work easily, and is found pretty much anywhere in the US along rivers and streams. Wood selection is of course important. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2016, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/112 "2016-08-12T22:42:08Z")
A teaching resource I have mentions using a bottle of water to start a fire, as in using it like a magnifying glass to set some kindling alight. It seems feasible to me, given all the warnings in places like Australia about dropped rubbish starting bush fires, but could you actually make a fire like that intentionally? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/113 "2016-08-13T00:25:31Z")
It’d be really, really tough to use a bottle of water to start a fire. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2017, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606/114 "2017-01-20T02:10:36Z")
As with the difference between firewood and Christmas trees, the ease of starting a fire is inversely proportional to how much you want one. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-easily-could-people-start-a-fire-before-matches-and-lighters/607606.md?page=5)