# How have "dirty words" changed over time? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 19, 2003, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092 "2003-02-19T08:00:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/21 "2003-02-20T15:50:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fretful Porpentine \* > \*\*“Fart” is in the original Middle English … \*\* “Fart” is an old, old word. [It’s origin is in the Proto-Indo-European root \ ***perd-**](http://www.bartleby.com/61/roots/IE400.html). > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Floater_ > **However, I’m still not totally convinced about the Old Norse connection, as it has left no trace that I know of in present day Scandinavian.** How about in unfamiliar dialects, as explained [here](http://www.takeourword.com/pt.html): > [@](#): > > \*_Cunt is believed to derive from a Germanic root kunton “female genitalia”, which also gave rise to Old Norse kunta (ancestor of Norwegian and Swedish dialectical kunta and Danish dialectical kunte), Old Frisian, Middle Low German and Middle Dutch kunte, and the English doublet quaint._ There are also likely non-naughty Scandinavian words that are related semantically to Old Norse “kunta”. The English word “kin” is ultimately related to “cunt”, for example. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/22 "2003-02-20T15:58:35Z")
Heureka! I did what I should have done from the beginning, namely check the Dictionary of the Swedish language, and there it was. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![pasty2003](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@pasty2003](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pasty2003)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/23 "2003-02-20T17:23:48Z")
I was always led to believe that the word “fuck” came from the back in ole WW2 and derived from the german aeroplane manufacturer ‘focker’ ( if i spelt it right there). And became a common cry from the allies and into what it is today. But hey i always have been a bit gullible! ---
**Author:** ![Belrix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed655f/32.png) [@Belrix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belrix)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/24 "2003-02-20T18:21:56Z")
I don’t know why I remember this… In the Little House on the Prarie books, Laura Ingalls describes a conversation between her mother & father that is more or less like this: Pa: “Gosh, Darned it!” Ma: “Charles!” (shocked) Pa: “Sorry, but it’s enough to make a saint swear.” So “Gosh” & “Darn” were offensive enough to not be part of the family’s lexicon but we still OK enough for Laura to document for her book. Of course, she may have sanitized it for publication, too. -B ---
**Author:** ![Amethyst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@Amethyst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amethyst)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/25 "2003-02-20T18:25:40Z")
My mum, who was very much a UEL (United Empire Loyalist) descendant, told me that when she was a young girl in the 1930’s, she considered the words ‘male’ and ‘female’ to be ‘bad words’ and didn’t use them. However, I just figured she was excessively puritan, if not a little batty! I’m curious about the word ‘fanny’ in the UK … while it means behind or bottom here in Canada/US, I’ve heard that in the UK it refers to the ‘female bits’ 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Satyagrahi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f475e1/32.png) [@Satyagrahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satyagrahi)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/26 "2003-02-20T18:27:44Z")
I feel I must point out that the English word ‘fuck’ is almost identical to the German word ‘fuchs’ (same meaning) and that both are almost certainly derived from the ancient Germanic languages spoken before the Ango-Saxon invasion of England. In short, ‘fuck’ is a very old word that, perhaps, didn’t make it into print until the 16th Cent. …though I would be pleased to hear from someone with immediate access to a good etymological dictionary. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/27 "2003-02-20T18:30:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Satyagrahi \* > …though I would be pleased to hear from someone with immediate access to a good etymological dictionary. Try the [Online Etymology Dictionary](http://www.geocities.com/etymonline/)! There’s a good article about “fuck” there. ---
**Author:** ![Hubajube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c37758/32.png) [@Hubajube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hubajube)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/28 "2003-02-20T18:35:21Z")
Does anyone know of any words that were once used as swear words that have fallen completely out of usage now? I seem to remember an article about these in an Old Farmer’s Almanack when I was a kid (with drawings of 18th century Americans with those long, thin word bubbles), but I can’t remember what the specific words were. ---
**Author:** ![Satyagrahi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f475e1/32.png) [@Satyagrahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satyagrahi)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/29 "2003-02-20T18:40:37Z")
\ Alright, I tried to resist it but I just can’t manage. Here’s a joke the memory of which was triggered by **pasty2003** ’s mention of Fokker airplanes. The Scandinavian fighter pilot who had served with the British Royal Air Force during the war was asked, some years later, to describe his adventures to a class room full of high school students. It went like this: “…so I was climbing through 5000 feet and came out of a cloud to see a flight of about 4 fokkers coming right at me! I knew I had to do something so I…” The class teacher interrupts here to forestall the giggling that had started to break out and says “I should explain here that the Fokker aircraft were made by the German company Fokker Aeronautics and that it is a perfectly respectable name in that language.” The pilot responds: “Well, ya, sure, but these fokkers were flying Messerschmitts!” \ ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/30 "2003-02-20T19:18:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoe \* > **In the 1930’s “damn” was a little raunchy and almost didn’t make it to the final cut of Gone with the Wind..** The word _damn_ was common in adult usage and in popular literature by the 1930s. Even “goddamn” was being used in Hollywood movies of the 1920s (via intertitle). The anomaly of the use of _damn_ in the film of _Gone With the Wind_ has been exaggerated. ---
**Author:** ![Lodrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@Lodrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lodrain)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/31 "2003-02-21T01:48:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Satyagrahi \* > \*\*I feel I must point out that the English word ‘fuck’ is almost identical to the German word ‘fuchs’ (same meaning) and that both are almost certainly derived from the ancient Germanic languages spoken before the Ango-Saxon invasion of England. In short, ‘fuck’ is a very old word that, perhaps, didn’t make it into print until the 16th Cent. > > …though I would be pleased to hear from someone with immediate access to a good etymological dictionary. \*\* Nuh-uh. _Fuchs_ means ‘fox’. The German word you’re looking for is _ficken_. The words are etymologically unrelated. ---
**Author:** ![clayton\_e](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c57346/32.png) [@clayton\_e](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clayton_e)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/32 "2003-02-21T05:03:17Z")
I have a book called “the history of swearing”… Its rather interesting. I’ll go try to dig it out of the \*\*Huge Pile Of Books in the Corner© \*\* and get a few quotes out of it. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/33 "2003-02-21T05:59:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Even “goddamn” was being used in Hollywood movies of the 1920s (via intertitle). While I can research this, I know your abilities. Which movies, and how many? It had to be rare. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/34 "2003-02-21T07:41:22Z")
One of the most successful movies of the silent era, _The Big Parade_ (1925), was about an American soldier (John Gilbert) in France during World War I. During a night battle scene, Gilbert is enraged at the enemy, and shouts (via intertitle), “Goddamn you!” But, oddly, in another intertitle he calls the enemy “b------s!” Go figure. Five years later, another big-budget World War I drama, _Hell’s Angels_, directed by Howard Hughes, really went all out, with dialogue that included “It’s me, goddamit,” “What the hell,” “For Chrissake,” “Jesus!” and “That son-of-a-bitch!” ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/35 "2003-02-21T07:51:08Z")
In the exotic meldorama _The Green Goddess_ (1930), the evil Rajah of Rukh, played by George Arliss, laments the escape of the white woman from his clutches. But in the closing line of the movie, he rationalizes, “She probably would have been a damned nuisance, anyway,” and takes a puff on his hookah. ---
**Author:** ![zorch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/50afbb/32.png) [@zorch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zorch)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/36 "2003-02-21T08:00:25Z")
In 1960, Jack Paar, host of ‘The Tonight Show’ on NBC, walked off the show after the network censored him for saying, ‘water closet’ :eek: ---
**Author:** ![cankerist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bc79bd/32.png) [@cankerist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cankerist)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/37 "2003-02-21T10:46:49Z")
I find it interesting that “slut” is one word that went the other way, from being largely inoffensive at first to its present highly insulting meaning. IIRC originally it meant a woman who kept an untidy house. Only 10 or 15 years ago I recall a neighbor rebuking her young daughter “the little slut” for her bed’s state of disarray. _grin_. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/38 "2003-02-21T11:55:09Z")
While slut meant _slovenly_ in 1400, by 1450, it already meant _immoral woman_, so that does not quite count as a recent change. ---
**Author:** ![cankerist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bc79bd/32.png) [@cankerist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cankerist)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2003, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092/39 "2003-02-21T12:24:33Z")
I respectfully disagree, tomndebb on two grounds: 1. There is a vast difference between ‘immoral woman’ and ‘slut’. The term ‘slut’ did not mean ‘a women who fucks a lot’ until very recently. My boss is an immoral woman but I wouldn’t call her a slut by any means. 2. The neighbor of my story was not brought up around my area but had moved here from rural England. This woman was exceedingly prim and proper and am certain she was not calling her daughter an immoral woman. The fact is that language change is not homogeneous even within a single society. Regardless of what the word meant to others, to her, and to the people from where she grew up, ‘slut’ meant slovenly. Why is her definition less valid that the definition you have proposed? Because it was in a dictionary? Puhlease. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-have-dirty-words-changed-over-time/156092.md?page=1)