# How high can a weather/scientific balloon carry a person or payload? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 28, 2014, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773 "2014-10-28T17:01:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bumbershoot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bumbershoot/32/3428_2.png) [@Bumbershoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bumbershoot)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/1 "2014-10-28T17:01:46Z")
[I started a thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=738499) in MPSIMS a few days ago about Alan Eustace, who recently beat Felix Baumgartner’s record for highest parachute jump. Now I’m wondering what the upper limit might be. I can think of several factors involved- the size of the balloon, the size of the payload, the air density at the upper reaches of the stratosphere. Baumgartner’s balloon was approx. 30,000,000 cubic feet and took him to approx. 128,000 feet altitude. Eustace’s balloon was approx. 11,000,000 cubic feet and took him to approx. 135,000 feet. So a much smaller balloon, but the payload was much smaller as well (Eustace didn’t use a pressurized capsule, he was suspended directly beneath the balloon in his pressurized suit). The balloons are only partially filled on the ground; the helium expands and the balloon grows larger as it ascends and the air gets thinner. So I actually have more than one question- How high can a helium (or hydrogen) balloon go? What is the maximum altitude we could expect someone to reach when attempting to set a new record parachute jump? As it rises, will the helium keep expanding until the balloon bursts? I suppose if you overfill the balloon in the first place it will burst before it gets to the edge of space. And if you underfill it, it will rise until the density of the helium matches the density of the air. How precisely can they calculate the altitude where it balances? As I recall, Baumgartner’s balloon kept rising past their goal and he ended up jumping from a higher altitude than they expected. Could Eustace’s team accurately calculate how much helium they needed to beat Baumgartner’s record by 7,000 feet or is it not that precise? Could they only say (based on the size of their balloon and the payload) “We need this much helium to beat the record by approximately this much altitude”? Thanks in advance. ---
**Author:** ![slaphead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@slaphead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slaphead)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/2 "2014-10-28T18:53:44Z")
[QUOTE=Bumbershoot;17852905 How high can a helium (or hydrogen) balloon go? What is the maximum altitude we could expect someone to reach when attempting to set a new record parachute jump?.[/QUOTE] Well, according to this site [http://www.stratostar.net/faq.html](http://www.stratostar.net/faq.html) > [@](#): > > The highest recorded gas filled balloon reached 173,000 ft (53 km), launched in 2002 from Japan! However, this was not a normal weather balloon, but a specially designed balloon with a material which is 1/6 the thickness of a plastic grocery bag. The highest recorded weather balloon flight of one of StratoStar’s customers is 125,200 ft (38 km) launched by DePauw University launch August 11, 2011 from Illinois. So it looks like you could perhaps go a bit higher but it would presumably be rather expensive and complicated, especially given that the man/parachute/lifesupport load will presumably be considerably heavier than a normal scientific payload. From the [high-balooning scientists](http://global.jaxa.jp/article/interview/vol42/p2_e.html) > [@](#): > > In 2002, with a 3.4-micrometer-thick polyethylene film balloon, (20 percent thicker than the new film), we set a world record by flying an unmanned balloon to an altitude of 53 km. It flew beyond the stratosphere, reaching the mesosphere, and has already been used to observe ozone in the mesosphere. We are now trying to develop a 2.8-micrometer-thick film balloon to reach an altitude of 55 km. ---
**Author:** ![Bumbershoot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bumbershoot/32/3428_2.png) [@Bumbershoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bumbershoot)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/3 "2014-10-28T19:33:44Z")
Thanks **slaphead,** lots of good info at those sites. I can’t spend as much time reading them as I’d like right now; they expect me to do stuff here at work and it interferes with my web-surfing. According to the [paragon/stratex website](http://www.paragonsdc.com/stratex/) (the team that worked with Eustace), the largest scientific balloon ever flown had a capacity of 60,000,000 cubic feet. I wonder how high it could go with Eustace suspended underneath in his pressurized suit? ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2014, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/4 "2014-10-30T00:05:27Z")
Wow! I’m a fan of this sort of stuff and this is the first I’d heard of it. I guess not having Red Bull foot the bill results in a lot less publicity! 😃 I really expected Baumgartner’s record to stand for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Joker\_and\_the\_Thief](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e79b87/32.png) [@The\_Joker\_and\_the\_Thief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Joker_and_the_Thief)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2014, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/5 "2014-10-30T00:18:23Z")
You could get higher by using hydrogen instead of helium, which has a specific gravity about half of helium. Not sure of what risks it would pose, though (yes I know what happened to the hindenberg, but there must be some reasons it’s not used for unmanned weather balloons). ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-high-can-a-weather-scientific-balloon-carry-a-person-or-payload/702773/6 "2015-01-07T23:07:25Z")
Some relevant news: > [@](#): > > NASA has proposed a challenge that calls for airship designs that can fly higher and longer than existing airships. At the moment, no airship — blimp-like devices — can maintain an altitude of 65,000 feet (20 kilometers) for more than 8 hours. Weather balloons can soar to that height, but the balloons are difficult to control and vulnerable to winds… > > The proposed challenge would include two tiers. The first tier would call for designs for an airship that can lift 44 pounds (20 kilograms) and hover at 65,000 ft. for at least 20 hours. The second tier designs would need to be a little more complex. Those airships would have to support 440 lbs (200 kg) at the same height but for at least 200 hours. > **[High-Tech Airships Could Be NASA's Next Challenge](https://www.livescience.com/49334-nasa-airship-challenge.html)** > > NASA has proposed a new citizen science challenge called the 20-20-20 Airship Challenge that calls for high-altitude and long-duration airship designs.