# How important are trees for advanced intelligence **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 20, 2018, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412 "2018-12-20T07:31:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2018, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/21 "2018-12-23T16:34:11Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Sure, dolphins, octopuses, elephants, etc. have a surprising amount of intelligence given our innate speciesism. But they never developed fire… I might give the octopuses a pass on not discovering fire. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2018, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/22 "2018-12-24T02:13:49Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I might give the octopuses a pass on not discovering fire. [Obligatory Link](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FB0aeb-TPs) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2018, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/23 "2018-12-24T14:56:59Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > BTW, pandas [do](http://www.panda.org.cn/english/news/news/2013-12-12/3092.html) climb trees. Sure, now that they’ve evolved their thumbalogue they do. 😉 in case that wasn’t obvious, I know lots of animals climb trees without anything like a thumb. Lions, for instance. But the panda’s “thumb” was developed for holding bamboo. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/24 "2018-12-24T15:47:34Z")
Hey, there’s even [tree-kangaroos](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree-kangaroo). There are also tree lobsters, but they’re an insect and unrelated to crustaceans. [These](https://www.treelobsters.com/) don’t count. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2018, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/25 "2018-12-24T17:31:51Z")
I heard a scientist on CBC Radio discussing human evolution, who suggested the big brains we developed were for dealing with the workspace we used our hands in - the challenges of toolmaking and tool use helped create our brains, which then conveniently were useful to process more advanced speech too. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2018, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/26 "2018-12-25T08:03:58Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > Hey, there’s even [tree-kangaroos](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree-kangaroo). There are also tree lobsters, but they’re an insect and unrelated to crustaceans. [These](https://www.treelobsters.com/) don’t count. Hell, there’s even a[tree-octopus](https://zapatopi.net/treeoctopus/)in the PNW… ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2018, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/27 "2018-12-25T08:22:05Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Hell, there’s even a[tree-octopus](https://zapatopi.net/treeoctopus/)in the PNW… And why aren’t trees smarter? I mean, they are all surrounded by other trees. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2018, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/28 "2018-12-25T20:58:21Z")
Speaking of fire and trees, one hypothesis for the Fermi Paradox I came up with is that maybe it’s only by a quirk of terrestrial evolution that we have **wood**. Maybe on almost all other planets the local light gatherers use the equivalent of shell or horn for their stiffening structures, and there’s no handy source of good fuel for early intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2018, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/29 "2018-12-26T03:01:20Z")
If their photosynthesizers excrete oxygen, then there’s something flammable on the planet. Oxygen reacts with almost everything. It’s only the result of selection effects that we think of non-flammable substances as being common: They’re common on Earth only because that’s all that’s left. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2018, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412/30 "2018-12-26T03:12:33Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > If their photosynthesizers excrete oxygen, then there’s something flammable on the planet. Oxygen reacts with almost everything. Not necessarily _very_ flammable. Wet meat burns very poorly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-are-trees-for-advanced-intelligence/826412.md?page=1)