# How important is "bruising" alcohol? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 12, 2016, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585 "2016-05-12T00:56:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/21 "2016-05-12T16:27:04Z")
Places and people really need to start qualifying their offerings, ie Brandy Manhattan, Bourbon Manhattan, Poser Martini, etc. That way everybody has a common frame of reference. It’s not like we’re ever going to even come close to agreeing on any of these things. Except maybe that “the other guy” has a naugahyde palate. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/22 "2016-05-12T17:20:21Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Places and people really need to start qualifying their offerings, ie Brandy Manhattan, Bourbon Manhattan, Poser Martini, etc. That way everybody has a common frame of reference. > > It’s not like we’re ever going to even come close to agreeing on any of these things. Except maybe that “the other guy” has a naugahyde palate. 😛 I agree… if for no other reason than a lot of garden-variety bartenders are scandalously ignorant of their craft, and probably need some help in getting you the drink you’re looking for. My wife and I went out for dinner at a nice place some years ago ([Al Biernat’s in Dallas](https://www.zagat.com/r/al-biernats-dallas), FTR), and she ordered a daiquri. A plain daiquiri, meaning lime juice, rum and sugar(or syrup). Instead, she got some weird strawberry-ish bright red concoction. You’d think the bartender at a place like that would actually know what a daiquiri is, or have the freaking sense to ask, but apparently not. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/23 "2016-05-12T19:09:48Z")
One place I go that is sort of a martini oriented bar, the bartenders shake the thing like it’s a can of paint at Home Depot. I’ve told them that I’m not sure about bruising gin, but they’re killing it. One of the younger bartenders thought because you use dry vermouth, that a dry martini meant more vermouth. He actually still thinks that, but makes them correctly assuming everyone is ordering wrong. ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/24 "2016-05-12T19:16:14Z")
+1 for a gin martini always having vermouth. And a dash of orange bitters and a twist is classic. The orange bitters bridges the vermouth and gin perfectly. Nevertheless, no bitters and a olive is acceptably a martini. No vermouth is typically used in a vodka martini because it just doesn’t make sense, but then again a vodka martini is just a chilled shot in a pretty glass. Bruising to me is just a word for shaking air and ice into the mix making it cloudy and icy. Stir a martini. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/25 "2016-05-12T19:34:14Z")
> [@bump](#): > > The main reason you don’t shake a martini is because they look ugly as shit in the glass if you do. Since they’re classically crystal clear and served in a cocktail glass, shaking them would make them a little bit cloudy and bubbly (esp. at first), and would also leave a bunch of tiny ice crystals floating near the surface. None of which is a big deal in something like a daiquiri, which is naturally cloudy, but it makes a martini look ugly. Screw that. The ice slick on top of a martini, if done well, is one of the best parts of a martini IMO. I care not if it’s cloudy or clear; it must have that ice slick. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/26 "2016-05-12T19:35:15Z")
> [@lost4life](#): > > One place I go that is sort of a martini oriented bar, the bartenders shake the thing like it’s a can of paint at Home Depot. I’ve told them that I’m not sure about bruising gin, but they’re killing it. One of the younger bartenders thought because you use dry vermouth, that a dry martini meant more vermouth. He actually still thinks that, but makes them correctly assuming everyone is ordering wrong. I once ordered a martini and was told she couldn’t make one because she “didn’t have olive juice”. I blinked and ordered a beer. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/27 "2016-05-12T19:36:41Z")
> [@yellowjacketcoder](#): > > A gimlet is gin and lime juice. It’s also one of my favorite drinks, and I always use fresh limes. I feel like Rose’s is perfectly fine, even though it creates a completely different experience. I don’t like people to assume; I might prefer one or the other, depending. I have met bartenders who don’t know what a gimlet is :smack: > [@bump](#): > > My wife and I went out for dinner at a nice place some years ago ([Al Biernat’s in Dallas](https://www.zagat.com/r/al-biernats-dallas), FTR), and she ordered a daiquri. A plain daiquiri, meaning lime juice, rum and sugar(or syrup). Instead, she got some weird strawberry-ish bright red concoction. That’s a lost cause, I think, and 99% of people these days expect the frozen kind. It is odd that he didn’t ask though, and also if frozen was assumed, that they didn’t ask if you wanted some other fruit (banana seems common). A twist in a martini is good too. Hendrick’s martinis often use a cucumber slice, instead. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/28 "2016-05-13T01:44:35Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Places and people really need to start qualifying their offerings, ie Brandy Manhattan, Bourbon Manhattan, Poser Martini, etc. That way everybody has a common frame of reference. > > It’s not like we’re ever going to even come close to agreeing on any of these things. Except maybe that “the other guy” has a naugahyde palate. 😛 …and that serving something in a martini glass doesn’t entitle it to the name “martini.” ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/29 "2016-05-13T01:58:29Z")
now I don’t mind a good booze discussion but is it me or are most bartenders these days just lost if a drink needs more that 2 or 3 things in a glass ? I mean I know at places like chilli’s and such that have bars or cocktails they value speed over accuracy but I think true bartending is a dying art … I miss the old 50s style Chinese place we had here because they made drinks you didn’t need more than 2 or 3 of and they had all the post ww2 fruity stuff… ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/30 "2016-05-13T02:33:13Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > …and that serving something in a martini glass doesn’t entitle it to the name “martini.” Or the suffix “-tini.” ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/31 "2016-05-13T03:23:06Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > 1. A Martini has vermouth in it, by definition. All that “extra-dry” nonsense is just that. You can vary the proportions to taste, but this isn’t homeopathy. Right. I’ve often wondered if we’re going to have to pass some sort of Federal Law about this. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/32 "2016-05-13T10:38:24Z")
> [@nightshadea](#): > > now I don’t mind a good booze discussion but is it me or are most bartenders these days just lost if a drink needs more that 2 or 3 things in a glass ? I don’t drink Long Island Iced Teas, but I like watching a good bartender throw one together. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/33 "2016-05-13T11:20:20Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > …and that serving something in a martini glass doesn’t entitle it to the name “martini.” +1 A martini is a recipe, not a style. Gin, dry vermouth, cold, olives. I have become accepting of vodka being substituted, and those “dirty” martinis can be an acceptable variation, but there is no such an animal as a “Oreo cookie martini” or an “appletini.” ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/34 "2016-05-13T11:57:51Z")
> [@snfaulkner](#): > > The “Bruising” of gin, as I’ve heard it, is just a joke… [Apparently not.](https://talesofthecocktail.com/techniques/scientific-argument-never-shaking-your-gin) > [@](#): > > … Breathing and bruising? They aren’t just buzzwords. There are organic compounds in your gin that can go sideways when you subject them to the hardcore rock tumbler of your cocktail shaker … > > … In gin, the most distinct and attractive notes are the lovely juniper and coriander. It’s what makes gin so enticing. > > “This is the top note,” Stewart said. “And the quality of juniper actually doesn’t come from a single compound, but rather a mix of lightweight alcohols.” > > So when you agitate gin — say by shaking it for a martini — you’re causing the top notes to dissipate. Those bits of pine and botanicals that you look forward to start breaking down and become dull. The end result: A cocktail that’s nowhere near as crisp as it should be. > > “This is what we call bruising,” Stewart said. “Once you’ve shaken it, the rest of the drink only contains middle and base notes. Yuck.” ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/35 "2016-05-13T12:34:13Z")
> [@nightshadea](#): > > now I don’t mind a good booze discussion but is it me or are most bartenders these days just lost if a drink needs more that 2 or 3 things in a glass ? > > I mean I know at places like chilli’s and such that have bars or cocktails they value speed over accuracy but I think true bartending is a dying art … > > I miss the old 50s style Chinese place we had here because they made drinks you didn’t need more than 2 or 3 of and they had all the post ww2 fruity stuff… Let me tell you about the time my father ordered a “perfect Rob Roy, with a twist, straight up” at Applebee’s… ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/36 "2016-05-13T15:44:29Z")
> [@nightshadea](#): > > now I don’t mind a good booze discussion but is it me or are most bartenders these days just lost if a drink needs more that 2 or 3 things in a glass ? > > I mean I know at places like chilli’s and such that have bars or cocktails they value speed over accuracy but I think true bartending is a dying art … Actually, that would have been true had you said it 20 years ago, but in the last 10 years, there’s been a real renaissance of cocktail culture, serious mixology, and bars that serve that kind of thing. There’s even a convention for this stuff- “Tales of The Cocktail” in New Orleans every summer (\*\*DSeid’s \*\*link is from their site) where bartenders and cocktail hobbyists go and learn about technique, ingredients, etc… and drink quantities that would stagger Ernest Hemingway. But I don’t know how prevalent it is in the nation as a whole; even here in Dallas, one of the bigger cities in the country, there are maybe around 20-30 places that could claim to have serious cocktails and bartenders, and the rest are places that have a waiter who got “promoted” to being a bartender and taught how to make the advertised house drinks, serve beer and wine, and make a handful of extremely basic mixed drinks like gin & tonic, \ and coke, cosmopolitan, etc… If I walked into one of the 30 places and told the bartender that I wanted that perfect Rob Roy, they’d actually know what I was talking about- both on the Rob Roy part, and on the “perfect” part (equal amounts sweet and dry vermouth, instead of one or the other). The rest wouldn’t have a clue on either account, and would probably ask you what it was, and then may not even have both kinds of vermouth on hand, depending on where you are. ---
**Author:** ![Totenfeier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@Totenfeier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Totenfeier)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/37 "2016-05-13T19:23:08Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > My go-to after work quick relaxation drink is the Putin. > > **Putin** > [ul] > [li]remove vodka from freezer (briefly)[/li][li]pour three to four shots worth into a chilled juice glass[/li][li]drink as a shot[/li][/ul] (…must…not…write…grr…grraagh…) You mean a Pukin? :D:D:D ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/38 "2016-05-13T19:31:07Z")
Tonight’s Cocktail Hour will feature **two** Abominations Unto Nuggan. I will be making the wife her favorite Dirty Vodka Don’t-Call-It-A-Martini with two habanero-stuffed olives, while I will be enjoying a Manhattan-like concoction featuring Rittenhouse 100 proof rye, sweet vermouth, Angostura bitters, a small dollop of Luxardo Marachino syrup and three, count 'em _three_ cherries. Hers will be shaken, whilst mine shall be stirred. Both will be delicious. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/39 "2016-05-13T19:33:49Z")
^It’s all good. Cheers! ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585/40 "2016-05-13T19:36:07Z")
> [@fachverwirrt](#): > > A martini with an onion is a Gibson. I never understood why garnishing a martini with an onion instead of an olive makes it an entirely different drink, but make it with a totally different alcohol (vodka), and somehow it’s still a martini. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-bruising-alcohol/754585.md?page=3)