# How important is education ranking in your state? \[edited title\] **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 18, 2017, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015 "2017-11-18T20:20:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/21 "2017-11-19T06:27:35Z")
> [@CastletonSnob](#): > > No, I’m done with school. I meant am I fucked? You are lucky enough to live in an era when most of human knowledge is available to you with a few clicks on a keyboard. If there is information or education that you want, seek it out. There are free online lectures and college classes if you want something formal and academic; millions of Youtube videos to train you to do everything from cooking to car repair; and of course message boards like this one that answer questions and broaden your knowledge base. I learn something new here almost every day. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/22 "2017-11-19T12:59:27Z")
It’s still not clear what the OP is concerned about. Job prospects? The level of discourse with neighbors? Local economic growth? Real estate prices? Prostitution? Pies? ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/23 "2017-11-19T18:46:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It’s true you can get a fine education in a state with a terrible overall educational system. And the reverse is equally true. So the educational average in your state isn’t an issue that affects you and your family directly; for that, you need to keep an eye on your local school system. > > But the state average is meaningful in terms of the quality of life in your state. The people in your state are not all going to be the product of your local school system. They’re going to have come from other school districts and be reflective of that average. So if you live in a state with what is, on average, a terrible public school system you’re going to be living with a lot of poorly educated people and suffer from the kinds of problems that result from that. Yep. States with better educational systems tend to attract employers who offer better paying jobs. They tend to have better standards of living, with higher per capita income. It might be a chicken and egg thing though - its possible that the people who have higher paying jobs demand decent public schools and performance from their kids (and their kids may be predisposed to do better in school). But you can get a good education in a state not known for it - and a lousy education in a good education state. But where a state puts emphasis on preparing kids for college - their test scores will reflect that. If a state puts emphasis on basic skills and then letting them out into the blue collar workforce, test scores will reflect that. I live in Minnesota, which is tends to be a pretty good education state. And if you are white and live in the 'burbs of the Twin Cities, the opportunity is there. Lots of AP courses are offered. ACT (we tend to be an ACT rather than SAT state) scores are above the national average. There is a huge racial gap here though, and a smaller urban/suburban/rural gap. ---
**Author:** ![CastletonSnob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ea924/32.png) [@CastletonSnob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CastletonSnob)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/24 "2017-11-19T18:56:40Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Yep. States with better educational systems tend to attract employers who offer better paying jobs. They tend to have better standards of living, with higher per capita income. It might be a chicken and egg thing though - its possible that the people who have higher paying jobs demand decent public schools and performance from their kids (and their kids may be predisposed to do better in school). > > But you can get a good education in a state not known for it - and a lousy education in a good education state. But where a state puts emphasis on preparing kids for college - their test scores will reflect that. If a state puts emphasis on basic skills and then letting them out into the blue collar workforce, test scores will reflect that. > > I live in Minnesota, which is tends to be a pretty good education state. And if you are white and live in the 'burbs of the Twin Cities, the opportunity is there. Lots of AP courses are offered. ACT (we tend to be an ACT rather than SAT state) scores are above the national average. There is a huge racial gap here though, and a smaller urban/suburban/rural gap. I guess I’ll be stuck with a low-paying job. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/25 "2017-11-19T20:33:25Z")
> [@CastletonSnob](#): > > I guess I’ll be stuck with a low-paying job. Not necessarily. Statistics are good at describing populations, not individuals. In a state like Mississippi, which doesn’t have a well regarded education system, there are still people who make a lot of money. Mississippi still has doctors, it still has business people, it still has computer programmers - it just has fewer of those highly paid jobs than a state with a better education system. And educationl systems are only part of the equation. History is full of people who were self taught. People who had intellectual gifts, but not much opportunity for formal education, and turned out brilliant and did quite well with their lives. There is a well regarded Broadway show about such a man playing right now - Hamilton. There are modern examples as well - kids who live in poverty in third world countries who develop incredible skills. [Kelvin Doe - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelvin_Doe) Now, if you have few intellectual gifts, plus few opportunities for a quality education, and little desire to make an effort to better yourself- you are truly screwed by where you live. But then, if you have few intellectual gifts and little drive to make yourself better, the best high school in America isn’t going to do you that much good. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/26 "2017-11-19T20:56:06Z")
I never gave school ratings by state a second thought. I have heard Arkansas is ranked near the bottom of the list. I always had good teachers. The schools had well equipped science labs. We used the same or very similar textbooks as any other state. You could take college prep classes like Calculus and Physics your senior year. My daughters got a good education. They are in state universities now. The public schools modernized with computer labs and other tech several years ago. ---
**Author:** ![CastletonSnob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ea924/32.png) [@CastletonSnob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CastletonSnob)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/27 "2017-11-19T21:09:21Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Not necessarily. Statistics are good at describing populations, not individuals. In a state like Mississippi, which doesn’t have a well regarded education system, there are still people who make a lot of money. Mississippi still has doctors, it still has business people, it still has computer programmers - it just has fewer of those highly paid jobs than a state with a better education system. > > And educationl systems are only part of the equation. History is full of people who were self taught. People who had intellectual gifts, but not much opportunity for formal education, and turned out brilliant and did quite well with their lives. There is a well regarded Broadway show about such a man playing right now - Hamilton. There are modern examples as well - kids who live in poverty in third world countries who develop incredible skills. [Kelvin Doe - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelvin_Doe) > > Now, if you have few intellectual gifts, plus few opportunities for a quality education, and little desire to make an effort to better yourself- you are truly screwed by where you live. But then, if you have few intellectual gifts and little drive to make yourself better, the best high school in America isn’t going to do you that much good. I probably won’t be able to get a good job if I moved to another state, since I come from a state that ranks low in education. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/28 "2017-11-19T21:27:24Z")
> [@CastletonSnob](#): > > I probably won’t be able to get a good job if I moved to another state, since I come from a state that ranks low in education. Employers don’t care which state you graduated from. They care about your level of education, skills, experience, attitude and overall fitness for the position. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/29 "2017-11-19T21:29:00Z")
That makes zero sense whatsoever. A person with a Masters from the University of Mississippi is a person with a Masters, period. The reasons you wouldn’t be able to get a good job in another state are all on you, bunky. Don’t try to blame your state for your state. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/30 "2017-11-19T23:23:17Z")
Err… I assumed we were talking about primary and secondary education. The U of Mississippi ranks pretty well. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/31 "2017-11-19T23:31:31Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > Err… I assumed we were talking about primary and secondary education. The U of Mississippi ranks pretty well. That’s true and it is a bargain for in state tuition costs. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/32 "2017-11-20T02:29:37Z")
Let me try putting this a different way. The education your kids get is on you. The state provides a school down the street, which has standard educational materials for your kids to tap into. It’s up to you to see that they make the best available. There isn’t much your state department of education can do to influence the quality of the pupils that show up in the morning. Here are the books, learn from them, or don’t. The statistical rating of the school system reflects the quality of the raw materials that shows up on the bus every morning. Minnesota’s department of education can’t to much with a room full of Mississippi kids. Mississippi’s schools and teachers would do just fine with a home room full of Minnesota kids. School statistics don’t reflectg the quality of the school. They reflect the qujality of the human resources that live in the school districts. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/33 "2017-11-20T13:25:02Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Let me try putting this a different way. The education your kids get is on you. The state provides a school down the street, which has standard educational materials for your kids to tap into. It’s up to you to see that they make the best available. > > There isn’t much your state department of education can do to influence the quality of the pupils that show up in the morning. Here are the books, learn from them, or don’t. The statistical rating of the school system reflects the quality of the raw materials that shows up on the bus every morning. Minnesota’s department of education can’t to much with a room full of Mississippi kids. Mississippi’s schools and teachers would do just fine with a home room full of Minnesota kids. > School statistics don’t reflectg the quality of the school. They reflect the qujality of the human resources that live in the school districts. As someone who moved from state to state a lot as a kid - this isn’t the whole truth. There is a qualitative difference in education - in educational theory - in what the state expects the outcome of the education to be - in the quality of teachers - from state to state. While no teacher gets paid well, Minnesota pays teachers a little better. Even within a state - districts have different priorities - I went to a blue collar high school in Minnesota - college prep wasn’t something that they did well, because very few of the kids went to college. As a result, my first couple years of college were rough. There is truth to there is only so much you can do with a student body whose parents didn’t go to college and who have a daily fight against poverty. And that will affect the priorities of the school But there is also a state by state and region by region difference in the schools themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/34 "2017-11-20T13:51:52Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Parental engagement is a must in these parts It’s a must everywhere. My home town has two college-track high schools. And for almost as long as there have been two, there has also been the saying “if you want your kids to get high grades, send them to Benjamin; if you want them to be prepared beyond what colleges expect, send them to the Jesuits”. Statistics for the two schools taken separately, and for both of them taken together, will produce very different figures. How much more will the effect of individual schools be diluted when we’re talking about every single school in a state? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/35 "2017-11-20T16:18:00Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > It’s still not clear what the OP is concerned about. He wants to know if he’s fucked. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/36 "2017-11-20T16:20:23Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I never gave school ratings by state a second thought. Here’s some information on the [Dunning-Kruger Effect.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect) ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/37 "2017-11-21T04:36:30Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > As someone who moved from state to state a lot as a kid - this isn’t the whole truth. There is a qualitative difference in education - in educational theory - in what the state expects the outcome of the education to be - in the quality of teachers - from state to state. While no teacher gets paid well, Minnesota pays teachers a little better. Even within a state - districts have different priorities - I went to a blue collar high school in Minnesota - college prep wasn’t something that they did well, because very few of the kids went to college. As a result, my first couple years of college were rough. > > There is truth to there is only so much you can do with a student body whose parents didn’t go to college and who have a daily fight against poverty. And that will affect the priorities of the school But there is also a state by state and region by region difference in the schools themselves. Of course, nothing is the whole truth. But my remarks were intended to alert posters who may believe that all Mississippi has to do is throw a lot of money at schools, and suddenly Mississippi school children will show up Monday morning as brilliant and diligent scholars. An overwhelming majority of children will come out of school with the education that their parents predisposed them to acquire. All we can hope to do is influence those on the borderlines, which is unlikely to be reflected through any if the current statistical paradigms. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/38 "2017-11-21T18:43:58Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Toss out the magnate schools and top 1%. Magnate school? 1%? That’s one of the best Freudian slips I’ve ever seen in the wild! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/39 "2017-11-21T18:52:13Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > Magnate school? 1%? That’s one of the best Freudian slips I’ve ever seen in the wild! 😃 :smack: Oy Vey! Well the Magnate schools usually are better then almost all public schools also but yes I did mean Magnet. High Tech High School just down the road from me has occasionally rated #1 in the country in the last 10 years. Freaking impressive as hell and is jokingly called MIT Prep. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015/40 "2017-11-21T19:04:18Z")
I live in Massachusetts which is commonly #1 and my daughters go to school in one of the best school districts here so I can’t complain except that I think they have to work too hard and have too much homework. When they have to wake up at 5:30 am to get ready for the bus, I don’t think they should still be doing homework at 9 pm. It puts a drain on family life. I didn’t do jack shit in my rural Louisiana school and still made it into top universities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-important-is-education-ranking-in-your-state-edited-title/802015.md?page=3)